Wife stumped me about knife making...

Justin King said:
It's easy to theorize and say you can turn out 3-5 complete knives (and sheaths) a week, making it happen is a different story.
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Just make folders!

Then, you take sheaths out of the equation...

More folks carry a folder anyhow.

And, plan ahead.
Issues still arise, but they are lessened by planning.

I am already ordering material for next year!

I most definitely make less than I did before I went full time.

However, quality of life has dramatically increased, and we aren't scraping to get by...
We have to mind what we are doing, but only the wealthy don't have to do that.
 
Phil Dwyer put together a list of threads that have dealt with the finances and business of knifemaking. Here's his post:

Phil Dwyer said:
Hi Folks,

I just love these threads on the business and finance of knife making. To me it ranks right up there with steel metallurgy, forging and tooling, heat treating, etc. Here are some other threads on exploring the topic.

All the best, Phil


An open and honest discussion about pricing
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=668332

How do you set prices when you are new? a discussion...
http://knifedogs.com/showthread.php?t=407

Fulltimers: Seeking feedback and insight (long)
This is an amazing thread with many topnotch pros talking about the biz...
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=546094

Knife Making and Arts productivity ...
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=615882

Newbie question about starting a knifemaking business on the side
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=669374

Special orders
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=610854

A question for other "Custom Makers"
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=704855
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I would like to get into folders one day but am not really equipped for it. I have a hard time envisioning it without a surface grinder.
I have only been doing this full time for about 5 months, so I may not be the example to look at. There is a lot more to it than I realized as a hobbyist, but also a lot to be gained in efficiency when you know you have a 60 hour work week ahead of you. The devil is in the details though, it's easy to end up dead in the water over a minor oversight.
 
like stated
if you make knives for fun have fun but like any biz if you dont run it like a biz you are fail before even getting started

its not easy and im sure not at the top liek some but its fun and i keep costs on my mind living in ones means is key (i never had much $ so its not much a change for me :) )
 
BTW to the make folders while knife ppl carry lots of folder every one has kitchen knives and that and straight razors are my bread and butter
 
Great stuff here. Almost everything I'd have said has been mentioned already. Batches, diversity, work ethic are all important. And a working wife. But don't listen to me, occasionally we have to sell a child or harvest some of our own organs to finance my knife making addiction.

Like Butch says, I never had much $$ so this ain't much of a change. It's all up from here!
 
I think EFFICIENCY is the biggest factor... beyond all else.

But productivity certainly has to be factored in. The "stubborn artistic side" of my mind wants to make super cool, high end pieces. The "family man, wants to be able to pay the mortgage, have a fridge full of food and puppies with full bellies" wants to have a balance of high end, and productivity.

It's a nice thing if you can blend them both! :)

I'll put it this way though... just for numbers. If Mr. Super Fancy engraved damascus guy makes 15- $2,500 knives per year... that's a gross of $37,500.... which of course is NOT taking into account things like propane, belts, materials, etc. If Mr. Plain Jane, simple and clean makes 250- $300 knives in a year, that's a gross of $75,000. :)

There's a huge difference between being an artistic minded guy who gets to make neat stuff for a living, and being a starving artist. ;) :)
 
It's nice to think one could make mostly bread and butter knives, but several high end fun pieces a year.

Yeah, a $2500 knife sounds like a lot of money until you think about damascus at $50-$100/inch, premium mammoth ivory for $200-$350, engraving at some crazy cost, and the sheer TIME involved with that stuff.
 
yep and thats why i dont make many folders (i cant make them as good as i want as fast as i need to to make them make $)
that said i love making one now and then and n also makeing the high end stuff for a change of pace
 
Yup...

To add a much more personal perspective--- If I can make 2- $850 "less ornate" knives in a week.... or make 1 - $1400 fighter with fancy bells and whistles in two weeks.... Which is the more responsible move? ;) :)
 
to make a living, the run thing works great. i started doing that a month or so ago, and is seems to be going well. same thing with the folders. from day one i planned to make folders more than fixed and the profit margin is greater (provided you can work fast enough). this month for the first time in the half year or so ive been making folders my credit card is going down instead of up.

as for equipment, i do 100% of my work in a 9 by 12 foot spare room in my basement. i have a 600$ mini mill a 50$ drill press and a cloned kmg (1500$), and a 75$ ryobi spindle sander (i never use) so the investment isnt all that impressive.

if you dont have a surface grinder, by pre flat ground stock or grind flat before you profile your blade. with more steel touching the platen, the harder it is to have low spots.
 
NickWheeler said:
Yup...

To add a much more personal perspective

If I can make 2- $850 "less ornate" knives in a week....
or make 1 - $1400 fighter with fancy bells and whistles in two weeks....

Which is the more responsible move?
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I think both - but probably weighted more towards the volume.

I believe it has to be more than just the numbers.

You have to show work that different and gets noticed.

the "stretch" pieces

For example BB's cut n shoots.
and his WIP threads
Compared to other less involved knives & the time spent on the WIP photos
he probably looses money on them
but
They attract people and traffic to his work.

I can't list all the MS there are.
I'm not sure I could name more than 15

, but I know and recognize his style and work.
 
While I'm not a professional knifemaker, I have one bit of experience that might be helpful.

Many years ago my friend and I started our own company. We were hot shot software developers who had a unique idea for a software package that would revolutionize the way software was developed and make it MUCH more intuitive to use. This was in the time before Windows and mice were common. Anyway, we spent $25K buying a computer on which we developed the software. We created and packaged it... and then realized we had no idea how to market it. We naively thought, "build a better mousetrap and they will come." They didn't. We ended up selling the hardware at a huge loss, and never made a single sale to offset the expenses of sending out tons of demo kits.

The moral of the story is we who make products would find it much easier to make money on our products if we know how to market them (or pay someone who knows how to market them).

While watching your expenses and investments cloesly is, I'm sure, very important, I think it is equally important (if not MORE important) to make sure you develop the market for what you make. Your reputation alone may carry some weight, but there's nothing like demand generation to take a business to the next level.

For what it's worth, I know a *little* more about marketing these days... but I'm still mostly an engineer/manager. The difference is I have some very dearly bought experience informing me of the need for marketing to be really successful.

- Greg
 
Another thought I had while working today- to make $1000 on a single high end piece requires much less time talking about knife design, less time dealing with shipping, way less sheath time (especially if the sheath gets made by someone else) and less time taking pics and selling your product than does making $1000 on five or six simple sheath knives. And, shop consumables such as abrasives are used at a lower rate. It's also a lot less time standing in front of the grinder. That's worth something to me.
 
Salem Straub said:
Another thought I had while working today- to make $1000 on a single high end piece requires much less time talking about knife design, less time dealing with shipping, way less sheath time (especially if the sheath gets made by someone else) and less time taking pics and selling your product than does making $1000 on five or six simple sheath knives. And, shop consumables such as abrasives are used at a lower rate. It's also a lot less time standing in front of the grinder. That's worth something to me.
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If that one piece dosen't sell, though, you're hurting that much more. Your percieved place in the market (according to your buyers) has some bearing on this also, not all makers can move a piece at $800-$1000 and I certainly can't afford to have many sitting on the shelf at that price.

Besides, it's hard enough for me to afford to own a little of my own product as it is, if they were all high-end I'd be shit out of luck:(
 
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