Working a claim for a damaged knife

Cricketfart

Cricketfart

Joined
May 29, 2008
Messages
5
Hey fella's, I'm new to this forum but have already learned a great deal and am loving applying it. Noticed a trend in people having difficulty working damage claims when shipping their pieces UPS. I've been a manager of one of the stores for a few years now and deal with claims all the time (least favorite part of the job) and I think I can be some help.

*I first recommend bringing them to one of the UPS Store locations, they can pack it for you and you'll definitely be covered for damage.

*If you can't, make sure to print up an invoice of almost any kind listing the knife and the price you're selling it for. UPS will ask you for some proof of value of the item. That invoice should suffice (try not to mention that it was hand made or you made it if you can).

*Always insure the piece for what you're selling it for. It's really cheap to do. The first $100 is free and comes standard. Each additional $100 is about $1-$2. It's worth it.

*If you don't have the means to write up an invoice in Microsoft Word or anything else, UPS will also accept a written appraisal. Don't bother with that one, too annoying. They'll also accept "an advertisement for a similar item". Surf the web until you've found another guys knife that is even vaguely similar to yours that has the same or greater price tag on it. Print that and fax/mail it to them.

*Make sure to pack the piece really damn well. Sometimes that box will get smashed to hell. You want the box, not the knife, to be taking that impact. UPS sometimes won't cover it for damage if you didn't pack it up to their standards which is usually 2 inches of cushioning material on all sides. Don't use bunched up paper, they usually won't cover it for damage if you do. I recommend bubble wrap or packing p-nuts.

Let me know if this is helpful. I hope to write up a more manufacturing thread soon.

Cricketfart
 
Hey, great advice, and a great name to boot :D. Thanks for the tips and welcome to the boards!

--nathan
 
Great post! Welcome Cricket!

Yes, shipping problems are a pain in the neck! I think everyone has a story or two. I've learned from "insiders" they (UPS, FedEx..etc) have an efficiency of about 97% without problems....or 3% that gets, lost or damaged. These statistics seem to fit my shipping history. For claim under $100...there's rarely any problems...but once it exceeds that bechmark, then the headaches begin. The frustrations for me come with from what seems to be unwritten and inconsistent policies and procedures designed to discourage filing a claim and even more "reasons" to deny the claim. To me, they seem to notoriously deny a claim just to frustrate you to submission. It's simply stuff....like, "I'm sorry Sir, but we did not receive the supporting documentation", ..."we did not see any damage"...."the package was not available for viewing"...bla..bla bla. When in fact they did. The supporting doc was submitted online or faxed and a confirmation of receipt was returned, the damages, yep it's clearly broken if you look at it, it was available for viewing..in fact the tracking details show that it arrived at the audit terminal before it was delivered back to me.

The list of stories go on and on. They seem to make you jump through hoops until you just give up... or practice some basic business sense and cut your loses early by spending your time more wisely on other things.

The web is full of stories.....some are heart breaking where people have fought and fought for months only to have their claim denied in what seems to be bad faith. It's certainly happened to me more than once, even to the point where the local TV news station came out to my shop to do a story on it.

$100 claims are no problem...but try a $2000 claim and good luck!
Insurance? what a scam....they won't call it insurance...it's "declared value"... and it has little to do with what they pay on your claim....but if you make a mistake with your paper work, then you are hosed with a claim denial.

Yep, my biggest frustration comes from the shipping companies. But what do you do? I've tried them all...they are all the same...and we can't live without them...so we just pack things the best we can and roll the dice.

Sorry for the rant, this topic always get my blood boiling.

Cricket, actually, I'm somewhat of a pleasant guy. (hee hee)

-Rob
 
Some homeowners policies will cover damage of things you own while its being shipped or mailed, you can always check with your company.
 
Cricketfart said:
Hey fella's, I'm new to this forum but have already learned a great deal and am loving applying it. Noticed a trend in people having difficulty working damage claims when shipping their pieces UPS. I've been a manager of one of the stores for a few years now and deal with claims all the time (least favorite part of the job) and I think I can be some help.

*I first recommend bringing them to one of the UPS Store locations, they can pack it for you and you'll definitely be covered for damage.

*If you can't, make sure to print up an invoice of almost any kind listing the knife and the price you're selling it for. UPS will ask you for some proof of value of the item. That invoice should suffice (try not to mention that it was hand made or you made it if you can).

*Always insure the piece for what you're selling it for. It's really cheap to do. The first $100 is free and comes standard. Each additional $100 is about $1-$2. It's worth it.

*If you don't have the means to write up an invoice in Microsoft Word or anything else, UPS will also accept a written appraisal. Don't bother with that one, too annoying. They'll also accept "an advertisement for a similar item". Surf the web until you've found another guys knife that is even vaguely similar to yours that has the same or greater price tag on it. Print that and fax/mail it to them.

*Make sure to pack the piece really damn well. Sometimes that box will get smashed to hell. You want the box, not the knife, to be taking that impact. UPS sometimes won't cover it for damage if you didn't pack it up to their standards which is usually 2 inches of cushioning material on all sides. Don't use bunched up paper, they usually won't cover it for damage if you do. I recommend bubble wrap or packing p-nuts.

Let me know if this is helpful. I hope to write up a more manufacturing thread soon.

Cricketfart
Click to expand...

I want to thank you for your input on this matter. I think it is great idea for a person in the inside to put information on how to better deal with these issues where many knifemakers can see it. I also like to see that you are with UPS and being helpful since for some reason knife and sword makers tend to beat up on UPS more than other shippers (like the others have never lost, damaged or been a hassle with a shipment :rolleyes:). The one thing that I personally find irritating are the number of folks who have developed an attitude about a particular shipper after having one of their items damaged, when I feel if it was damaged it was the customers fault for not packing it in a way that it could not be damaged.

It seems the vast majority of times I have see somebody complain that UPS should never be used because they damaged their sword, it turns out the thing was stuffed loose in a cardboard box with just some newspaper or a single layer of bubble wrap. If you don't care any more than that about your item why the heck should UPS? When I pack an item I assume that the shipper will be trying to destroy it and package it accordingly, do we think they will be chucking one package after another until they see our name and then everything will stop while they put on the white gloves and gently place the knifemakers package in a safe corner?? I assume they will be standing on it (I have found footprints all over packages), throwing it, slamming it around, they have trucks - who knows, perhaps backing over it, and I wouldn't rule out the use of explosive should the package be foolishly labeled- "fragile". With all of this in mind if I package a knife or sword in an unpadded cardboard box, I get what I deserve, not to mention how I should feel about a worker who gets a blade point in the hand or leg after it comes through the side of my flimsy skinflint packing.

For those buyers or collectors who may be reading this post, you may find that Kevin Cashen's shipping is sometimes a little higher (I will always quote exactly what the shippers tells me and pocket none), it is higher due to added size and weight in my packaging- you see I care as much about your blade as you would expect me to.

I have found the secret is ZERO movement; you can pack fine china in a concrete container if it cannot move at all. The next factor is rigid strength. For knives I like to use PVC pipe with wooden plugs in either end, with the blade inside so tightly surrounded that it cannot move. For swords and other items that will not fit into PVC, I go to the lumber yard and buy 2" Styrofoam insulation (the hard, blue stuff) and cut out an exact outline of the piece and sandwich it between two other solid pieces of the same. This makes a light and strong solid block around the piece that I will then put 1/4" plywood strips down the side to add rigidity before enclosing in cardboard. In the past with extremely expensive swords going abroad I have made lightweight wooden boxes and filled entirely around the piece with expanding foam insulation, it gave me a perfect indestructible fit but was a little too expensive so I dropped it for the sheet insulation.

It also never hurts to go to a UPS drop off center and get to know the guys behind the counter. Years ago after having to open a couple of my crates for inspection, due to value, I got some ooohs and aahhs and handed out some cards, now they know my name what I am shipping and give me no hassle, in fact we often chat a bit if they are not busy. Also for what it is worth I once had a claim arrive late after paying for 2nd day, UPS is the only shipper that automatically cut me a shipping refund without me even asking.

I have managed to devise containers that allow me to ship with confidence, now if I can only figure out how to make things safe from the airlines:eek::mad:. They hire a whole other category of gorilla to mangle packages at the airport:grumpy: I now believe they start tossing the luggage out as they are circling to land:thumbdn:.
 
I bought a sword once upon a time and it was shipped in a thick card board tube that had plywood circles on both ends and the sword was wrapped in bubble wrap and snuggly nesteled inside the tube and it arrived from the other side of the country with a few dings to the tube but the sword was unharmed.

Just a thought.

Tim
 
I've had to ship a few cameras. Double boxing, with space for lots of peanuts in both boxes, is the way to go.
 
Hey Cricketfart, you've started a great thread of shipping advice here. welcome to BF too! :D
I run shipping/receiving at a motorcycle shop and I've dealt with a handful of claims myself ....you're right - they are no fun. However I have a lot of faith in UPS... in the 10 years I've been doing this job, we've had only 2 packages lost and 5 damaged. Only one of those claims did we get the runaround on. UPS tracking information I also find to be far superior to priority mail if you really want to know where your package is along the way.

My advice in this area follows the rest:
Document as much as you possibly can, pack it like Godzilla is going to play football with it;), and you should be all set.

Oh yeah...If you get a damaged package- make sure have the driver note it BEFORE you sign for the package, and keep all the packing material in case they want to send someone to "inspect" it.

~kris
 
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Kevin

I love your approach. I likely spend too much time, effort, and $ packaging things for shipment.

However, I always feel vindicated when things arrive safely.

The shipments I have lost have been small high value packages such as DVD's that I resisted the urge to repackage into ridiculously large boxes. They fit into someones pocket far too easily.
 
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