xm18 Availability?

jakeyjake4528 said:
The general response about the heavy duty ZTs are that they easily hold their own against a strider
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My perception is that this is an opinion held mostly, though not exclusively, by people who have not owned a Strider knife.

Back on the subject of the xm-18:

You wouldn't pay it, I would, so would many others.
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exactly? Im merely explaining the reasoning behind why I believe paying that high a percent of the mid tech's price for a production folder is not a wise decision. you dont have to agree, and you certainly dont have to get defensive about it. like I said I was merely disagreeing, not trying to piss anyone off.

let me just summarize my argument here for the sake of conciseness: I dont believe ZT can make a knife that delivers sufficient quality, relative to the original knife, to justify such a high percentage of the cost of the original. And though other people may view that as a good deal, that will not impact my view that it is far from an optimal use of funds.
 
Rick's a great guy and I don't like people taking advantage and buying two for resale. It's BS and it's making a mockery of his goal to provide the knives to LEOs, Active Military and Emergency Workers to be used on the "front lines".
 
jakeyjake4528 said:
The general response about the heavy duty ZTs are that they easily hold their own against a strider
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Actually, they hold their own against TWO Striders, because that's what they weigh.:D

It is an amazing thing that our economy is still good enough that we can argue the merits of paying more than $400 for a knife.

Our economy is on life support now though, so it may not be long before the XM's become readily available since far fewer people will be able to afford even the retail price by then. That's partly why I've been selling off my collection lately, the market is still viable.

I'm not selling my XM-18 though. It's a keeper.
 
SteelSnob said:
Rick's a great guy and I don't like people taking advantage and buying two for resale. It's BS and it's making a mockery of his goal to provide the knives to LEOs, Active Military and Emergency Workers to be used on the "front lines".
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Are you serious?..... your "front lines" people get bumped to the front of Rick's line. I am sure Rick is just fine with the way his knives are flying off the shelves.... even if they are re-sold at a profit. Anyone who thinks differently should look at it this way: Every XM sold is worth (X) amount of dollars to Rick. If he wants to make more money all he has to do is make more XMs. The man has a money printing operation. Would you expect people to feel sorry for you, or feel like you were taken advantage of, if you were the sole producer of the hottest item in a particualr genre?

What's further, anyone who is complaining about the inflated prices of Rick's knives should look at the mark-up on a Tim Galyean custom or a Ken Onion (in the early years). Knives have always been marked up when they are hot. It is what it is and it's never going to change..... it is not a conspiracy against ony of you.... I promise ;)
 
If you wanted a Carson Med M4 RIGHT NOW you might have to do some leg work tracking one down and you would certainly pay a big premium.

I don't see how this is any different.

I've bought two Gen 3 XM-18s since January, both for ~$50 over Rick's price. All it took was a little patience and persistence with the right dealers.
 
redisburning said:
My perception is that this is an opinion held mostly, though not exclusively, by people who have not owned a Strider knife.

Back on the subject of the xm-18:



exactly? Im merely explaining the reasoning behind why I believe paying that high a percent of the mid tech's price for a production folder is not a wise decision. you dont have to agree, and you certainly dont have to get defensive about it. like I said I was merely disagreeing, not trying to piss anyone off.

let me just summarize my argument here for the sake of conciseness: I dont believe ZT can make a knife that delivers sufficient quality, relative to the original knife, to justify such a high percentage of the cost of the original. And though other people may view that as a good deal, that will not impact my view that it is far from an optimal use of funds.
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What has led you to believe ZT could not produce such a caliber of knife?
 
jakeyjake4528 said:
What has led you to believe ZT could not produce such a caliber of knife?
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I don't think it's whether they could produce a "caliber" of knife. I think if they were selling for $300 when you can get the actual thing for $400 wouldn't be one of the high points. Sure you have to wait, but that's half the fun. :)

With the Strider / ZT collab I can see where buying a $300 knife compared to a $500 knife would appeal to people.
 
Josh K said:
I don't think it's whether they could produce a "caliber" of knife. I think if they were selling for $300 when you can get the actual thing for $400 wouldn't be one of the high points. Sure you have to wait, but that's half the fun. :)

With the Strider / ZT collab I can see where buying a $300 knife compared to a $500 knife would appeal to people.
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But its not like its easy to find an XM18 for 400, which is why I made my comment about a wishful thinking collab with ZT. The 300 price tag was one I just threw out there, I'm sure ZT could make their version for less. Certainly one is hard pressed to find a big 8oz ti framelock with premium materials for what ZT sells them for.

Waiting is fun, but not as fun as opening that box from UPS. What part of michigan are you in?
 
jakeyjake4528 said:
But its not like its easy to find an XM18 for 400, which is why I made my comment about a wishful thinking collab with ZT. The 300 price tag was one I just threw out there, I'm sure ZT could make their version for less. Certainly one is hard pressed to find a big 8oz ti framelock with premium materials for what ZT sells them for.

Waiting is fun, but not as fun as opening that box from UPS. What part of michigan are you in?
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When you have a good deal of time to wait for something it makes getting it all that much more special.

The XM-18 is complicated. I handled one on a passaround and my major complaint was the complexity. Everything is screwed down or comes apart. Internal stop pin, stabilizer, handle in three parts, clip, clip "filler", standoffs, etc. I'm not sure that would be easy to manufacture at a reasonable cost.

The ZT300 retails for $295, and it's comparable (big heavy framelock) to the XM-18 already. It fills the void for those wishing to have a titanium framelock without the custom maker price.

I understand the reasons for wanting to have a collaboration model, I'm just pointing out why I don't think it will happen. :)

I'm in the Brighton / Ann Arbor area.
 
Toyz said:
I could give examples of other knife makers copying knives from their competition and changing the design ever so slightly as to keep out of court but take advantage of the market segment created by the original manufacturer. The Sebenza is a prime example.
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Not sure what you mean here?? Can you clarify please.
 
Josh K said:
When you have a good deal of time to wait for something it makes getting it all that much more special.

The XM-18 is complicated. I handled one on a passaround and my major complaint was the complexity. Everything is screwed down or comes apart. Internal stop pin, stabilizer, handle in three parts, clip, clip "filler", standoffs, etc. I'm not sure that would be easy to manufacture at a reasonable cost.

The ZT300 retails for $295, and it's comparable (big heavy framelock) to the XM-18 already. It fills the void for those wishing to have a titanium framelock without the custom maker price.

I understand the reasons for wanting to have a collaboration model, I'm just pointing out why I don't think it will happen. :)

I'm in the Brighton / Ann Arbor area.
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Beautiful city in ann arbor, I worked there awhile.

All I ever said was, I wish. I know its not going to happen. Just as I know once I do get an XM18, it'll only fill the desire for a few weeks, maybe a month or so, then it'll be something else.

Its not so much the heft and toughness of the XM18 I love, more so in the design, the look, the whole package.
Once the benchmade 755 comes out ill be able to forget that XM18 for awhile.
 
I have seen an xm18 as high as $800. First thing that came to mind was the discontinued Red Scorpion 6 WSK. I nearly peed laughing when I saw the estimated value of $5000. I scoffed at the $310 original price tag. The main difference is the xm18 is a good knife and u can get one if you are patient. If no one was willing to pay the high price, it would drop.
 
giant1 said:
Not sure what you mean here?? Can you clarify please.
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What I meant was that there are many manufacturers that have gone through great lengths to design and manufacture knives that are similar in nature to the Sebenza.

Some may argue that this is not the case - but I have been a member of this forum for 4 years and lurked for several years prior to joining, and I have read many threads where forum members compared certain other models to the Sebenza.
 
softrockrenegade said:
i was just looking for another xm18 and the availability on any plateau is like zero!!! only 2 on ebay ! and thats it ! and both for like 700 bucks!! now i got mine for cost from rick and a few months ago there were several on the forums ! my question now is if there is a dry spell on xm18's or is it just my imagination???
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Wait a minute, you are looking for ANOTHER XM-18?!?

And you wonder why their aren't many available on the market for a good price......
 
Toyz said:
What I meant was that there are many manufacturers that have gone through great lengths to design and manufacture knives that are similar in nature to the Sebenza.

Some may argue that this is not the case - but I have been a member of this forum for 4 years and lurked for several years prior to joining, and I have read many threads where forum members compared certain other models to the Sebenza.
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I see, thanks for clarifying. I guess it would not be hard to find knives out there that come close to the sebenza, but that is what you get when you have a great design :)
 
I guess Rick was just kidding when he posted this on his site then...

http://www.rickhindererknives.com/

If Rick was all about profit he could have easily bumped up his prices to what they sell for but he has kept them the same.

You make it sound so easy for him to just make more knives like has a infinite amount of time or resources on his hands.

No offense but your post strikes me as uninformed and unrealistic.

spiralarchitect said:
Are you serious?..... your "front lines" people get bumped to the front of Rick's line. I am sure Rick is just fine with the way his knives are flying off the shelves.... even if they are re-sold at a profit. Anyone who thinks differently should look at it this way: Every XM sold is worth (X) amount of dollars to Rick. If he wants to make more money all he has to do is make more XMs. The man has a money printing operation. Would you expect people to feel sorry for you, or feel like you were taken advantage of, if you were the sole producer of the hottest item in a particualr genre?

What's further, anyone who is complaining about the inflated prices of Rick's knives should look at the mark-up on a Tim Galyean custom or a Ken Onion (in the early years). Knives have always been marked up when they are hot. It is what it is and it's never going to change..... it is not a conspiracy against ony of you.... I promise ;)
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In the past two weeks, I have seen 11 XM-18s sell for $385, 6 (2x3) were directly from Rick on his forum, 5 from a dealer. Granted, that dealer had them listed for $425 on his own website, but he was giving a discount to members of a certain forum to bring the price down to Rick's.
In both cases, there was a limit of one order per person.
Since I can't see how Rick can produce more knives than he is currently making, I think he should just increase his prices a little and sell more knives directly. He is doing the latter, but I think he refrains from increasing his prices because he does not want to hurt military personnel, LEOs and firemen.
 
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Its just the nature of the secondary market. Knives if you can get them directly from Bogi, Mayo, Hinderer, Onion etc are all affordable for customs directly from the maker. As soon as they are purchased, the knives can automatically be flipped for twice the price. I saw a $600 custom Emerson sell for $1200 half an hour later.

Why?

Because the buyer wanted it and was willing to pay the price.

I just got a custom Hinderer. I paid at least $200 more than Rick's show price. It was special to me so I bought it. I was also on a dealers list for more than two years when I got the email that my number was up. Sure I got it. Sure I could flip it but I won't because it is a great mid tech knife and I have been using it.

Life is too short not to use knives you like. If it is something you like, buy it and use it.
 
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