Yet another Wicked Edge thread with Qs!

Wowbagger said:
Oh my gosh you would be driven to palpitations by my Cold Steel Ranch Boss (other wise a very nice / well made knife inspite of all the bad press). The edge on the main blade was like . . . litterally 10° on one bevel and 25° to 30° on the other bevel ! ! ! !
. . . seriously guys ? ? ? o_O

How does one even get their "muscle memory" to hand sharpen something like that ? ? ?
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That is exactly as to why I went with fixed angle. Prior to the W.E. I had tried a KMW but without dissing KME fans, I found out that just wasn't for me.
 
sickpuppy1 said:
IS this the chinese D2 your sharpening? If so, I have a Efengrow or whatever, D2 knife, Chinese steel, that I tried to go to 17 degrees and got chuncky chips from it. I went back to 20 degrees and it was smooth as butta!
Dunno if that helps, but worth a try. I can only assume its the make up of the steel they are using.
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Yes it is as I had stated, Chinese D2! Hence why I was wonder aloud in a few posts earlier on if I ought to go back to 20*!
 
Wowbagger said:
From what little I know about it I remember basic D2 has large carbides.
See this LINK > > > for more info and photos.
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In that case, I may have gone too acutely on this one. Will have to try 20* and report back. I think that the very coarse 50 stone may have just torn into the steel at that angle!
 
Casinostocks said:
Oh no I didnt strop it with W.E and I dare not with their strops at my current level of learning curve! My contention is that IO have damaged the edge by making it chippy! Toothy I can live with but I have made it chippy hence thinking to go back to 20*. If you ask me what compelled me to go 17*, I have to say WTF I know! :rolleyes:
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The diamond stones especially when new are very very aggressive and the lower grits make massive looking gouges on the apex (at least when looking through a loupe). My guess is the chippy edge is from not being thorough enough with the next stone(s) and not removing all the previous scratches. I try and avoid the super coarse diamond stones when at all possible and when I do use them I try not to fully apex the knife to avoid getting the deep scratches in the apex. If you have not tried this I recommend giving it a go and you'll even see Clay do it on some of his vids. At the end of each stone/grit try some into the edge passes to remove any burr that might be hanging around. Starting with the stone at the heel as high as possible take some forward and downward strokes into the edge (very light pressure). Doing this I could get even the coarsest stones to make a hair shaving sharp edge.

Good luck!
 
^ what your saying makes perfect sense, but,(there's always a but isn't there) my chippy adventure was with SIC stones. I think a good quality knife with proper hardening goes along way,lol. I got mine when I first got interested in knives. And while mechanically its a sound knife, the steel is sub par. Glad it was 18.99 or whatever. I went to trailing edge with the stones from 600 on and still had it happen. But once I went back to 20 degrees it all went away. Like the Carbide particles were too big for the steeper bevel. It's a good beater knife/practice edge for me now days.
I'm using the matrix stone loaner set of stones at the moment and I dont think I'll let that knife in the room with them.
 
NORTHWEST_KNIFE_GUY said:
. . . with the stone take some . . . strokes into the edge (very light pressure). Doing this I could get even the coarsest stones to make a hair shaving sharp edge.
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I'm certainly not there yet :(
Even on a sharpening jig.
Even with stones that are not diamond and are well broken in.
I'm just a pathetic, edge refining, one trick pony.

The other day I was trying that very thing with a new Gritomatic Crystolon 100 grit using the Edge Pro on S35VN and failed miserably. I was sure it would be possible ! It isn't like I was skeptical. That surprised me. The edge got sharp, caught on the face of my thumb nail but not even hair scraping sharp let alone shaving.

I then went to a broken in DMT 600 and got good results but that is a far cry from 100 etc.

PS: sure the Crystolon 100 was a new stone but by the time I got done reprofiling the one bevel from about 28° to about 15°, on S35VN, the stone was pretty broken in :D.
 
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Casinostocks said:
I'm also thinking that with the fresh out of the box 50/80 shines, I may have beaten up too much on that steel because I have by and large, I think, eliminated my initial rookie and bone headed errors in my 30 days + of the W.E. ownership but I can not deny that I have also beaten up on that folder during the learning curve!



I rather take this gradually specially when it comes to learning to re-profile. I hazard the day that I will have to come in here and confess of doing that to my Shiros! As for the steel, yes it is Chinese D2 but from what I can gather being a Boker it is not the bottom of the scale steel.
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I don’t have any experience with Boker, could be that particular knife doesn’t like that thin of an edge. I’ve got a Maserin Plow with D2 that takes a good edge. I really don’t think taking M390 down to 17/15 dps will effect the performance/reliability at all. Unless it’s something like a broken tip or major chip on the edge, I prefer to re profile one degree at a time between uses/sharpening.
 
Ajack60 said:
I don’t have any experience with Boker, could be that particular knife doesn’t like that thin of an edge. I’ve got a Maserin Plow with D2 that takes a good edge. I really don’t think taking M390 down to 17/15 dps will effect the performance/reliability at all. Unless it’s something like a broken tip or major chip on the edge, I prefer to re profile one degree at a time between uses/sharpening.
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I noticed that you also bought a W.E. recently. In fact, we were both looking at the very same one which you ended up with which is a better system than the one I have currently got for doing the fiddly things like 1* per stone.

Other than that, I know that the Boker D2 flipper which I have is not thin behind the edge and also that I think the primary bevel was originally set at 20* per side. I might as well beat the crap outta what I have "sharpened" so far by cutting boxes and things and when it's all dull again, I will try to take back to 20*. We can agree that I do not anticipate such an issue when it comes to higher end steels like M390, at least not in a folder blade! I think with all the responses baed on what I wrote if taken as true, I gather that it is not ALL on me or someone would have said, "hey you idiot! stop doing it in such and such way!!!" ;)

To give some perspective, that Boker "practice" knife is still a &75-$80 knife. Cheap enough in the grand scheme of things for some of us knife-nuts to beat up on and practice on before we go to knives we had paid 10+ fold more for, but it was not a $20 gas station knife either!
 
Casinostocks said:
I noticed that you also bought a W.E. recently. In fact, we were both looking at the very same one which you ended up with which is a better system than the one I have currently got for doing the fiddly things like 1* per stone.

Other than that, I know that the Boker D2 flipper which I have is not thin behind the edge and also that I think the primary bevel was originally set at 20* per side. I might as well beat the crap outta what I have "sharpened" so far by cutting boxes and things and when it's all dull again, I will try to take back to 20*. We can agree that I do not anticipate such an issue when it comes to higher end steels like M390, at least not in a folder blade! I think with all the responses baed on what I wrote if taken as true, I gather that it is not ALL on me or someone would have said, "hey you idiot! stop doing it in such and such way!!!" ;)

To give some perspective, that Boker "practice" knife is still a &75-$80 knife. Cheap enough in the grand scheme of things for some of us knife-nuts to beat up on and practice on before we go to knives we had paid 10+ fold more for, but it was not a $20 gas station knife either!
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Believe it or not, I haven’t had the time to use the W.E. since I bought it. I’m still using a KME, the W.E. Is too big/heavy to bring to work where on some nights, I’ve got time to sharpen a couple knives. I plan on starting with one of my Big Chris knives and go from there.
 
Ajack60 said:
Believe it or not, I haven’t had the time to use the W.E. since I bought it. I’m still using a KME, the W.E. Is too big/heavy to bring to work where on some nights, I’ve got time to sharpen a couple knives. I plan on starting with one of my Big Chris knives and go from there.
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Rookie :P :D
 
OK, I'm here to report back that I made tremendous improvements to that Boker in D2 with the edge which I had messed up! Operator's inexperience and errors played a very large part in the raggedy edge I had created but also the aggressive and un-brokenin diamonds played their own part into it at the angle I had set (17* per).

With that said, I took it back to 20* per side and tried to eliminate all scratch marks when going from one stone to another. It's funny/not-so-funny because when you don't get rid of all the scratches, the pitch of the stone as it works on the bevel is quite different as opposed to when you get nearer to getting rid of all the scratches along the progression. So yeah, both listening to and also watching the edge/bevel with a loupe helps tremendously.

I cant say that I have the knife's edge apexed perfectly as it does snag in a couple of spots along the edge but the rest is really sharp and buttery smooth. Quite frankly, I juts lost patience trying to make it all "perfect". In this process, some very invaluable lessons were learned and I doubt that I will ever try to re-profile a knife unnecessarily and will only do so, if I really had to (referring to my much more expensive knives).

In closing, I am actually glad that I gave myself a tougher assignment than I had originally thought with the W.E. System. I lot has been grasped and learned, I think!
 
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