Your views on the ASP baton vs knife

C

Chariot

Joined
Jul 9, 2000
Messages
173
im considering either

a) buying a knife with some reach, for self protection (allready have one for close range)

or

b) buying a ASP baton to prevent the fight to go to close range.

i'd like to hear your opinions on this... is a ASP baton a good choice? would it work in self-defense situations? (no need to bring up legal aspects thanks)

regards, chariot
 
Your post comes at an interesting time. There are a couple current thread in other Bladeforums that might interest you regarding baton versus knife choice.

This thread was started in the Emerson Knives forum today by a British cop who had to switch to his Emerson CQC-6 after using his ASP baton to no avail!

This thread from the Practical Tactical forum is discussing knives and telescoping batons.
 
i think i need to sleep more, i pretty much asked this question before :)
guess i still haven't decided and needed some more input he he.
 
ASPs are superb weapons.

ASPs are a real wrist-wrencher when it comes to Abanico and Witiks that are done for real. You have to do some strength and flexibility training to get an ASP to sing without blasting your wrist. Especially with the 26 inch ASP Baton.

As for keeping someone at "long" range, that is not going to happen. That is something that is often talked about and should never be accepted as a fact.

You should try to keep an attacker off of you to the best of your ability, while accepting the reality that this is often not possible.

Real attackers are often not impressed by Strip Mall Kahrotty, knives and batons. Nor the hits they receive from them. They close. They destroy and care not about what injuries they receive, just a heads up!
 
abanico witeks? whats that?

if a baton CANT keep the distance, why would i use one?... and if buying a baton is a good idea, what length should i buy and why? 16" seems to short, 21" seems pretty good, if it's too big i guess ill leave it at home... no use in that.

also from what ive heard there's a lighter version of ASP available, what's your views on that? many thanks.
chariot
 
>>get an ASP to sing without blasting your wrist<<

Don, you called?

>>As for keeping someone at "long" range, that is not going to happen. That is something that is often talked about and should never be accepted as a fact. <<

Love ya. You're always throwing ice water on someone's lap.
smile.gif


>>also from what ive heard there's a lighter version of ASP available, what's your views on that? many thanks<<

TEST IT OUT! I have a friend who got into it with a big guy. Without getting into the why, he ended up whacking the BG over the head with a Taiwanese made baton. It wrapped around the BG's head and BG kept right on going. My friend ended up with a nice brick somewhere in the mix and finished it with that. Equipment counts but not more so than fighting spirit and skills. Chariot, go get some training and not worry so much about the tools yet.
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sing

AKTI #A000356



[This message has been edited by sing (edited 07-14-2000).]
 
A "Witik" is sometimes referred to as a, "broken attack." It is a strike that snaps out and returns, it does not follow through.

A "Lobtik" is a strike with follow through.

"Abanico" means "fan." And is sometimes referred to as a "Witik."

Abanico, or fanning, imagine holding a stick vertical (point of the stick towards the ceiling) in front of you, you can torque the stick to the left until it is horizontal, or until it goes vertical with the point directed at the floor. You can do this to the right as well. It feels awkward as hell until you get your wrist loosened up, after that, you can become very fast and powerful with this movement. It can also be delivered horizontal, imagine striking an attacker on both sides of their head in about 1/3 of a second.

Sing? Sing!
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I'm singin' in the rain, just singin' in the rain... BrickKwanDO, BKD is very effective, ask Reginal Denny.

Chariot, what I meant to say is, any sane individual would like to keep an attacker at bay, at a longer range where they can be sniped at with cane, stick, or BIG KNIFE. Unfortunately, due to simply missing, not hitting hard enough, or running into someone who is really tough or not impressed with the way you think he should react, Close Quarters Combat just happens.

The reason the Tactical Baton should be used in conjunction with the knife for those that wish to carry something like an ASP is the old axiom, Sh** happens.

Someone might jump out with a knife, you draw the ASP, and as you snap it out, the guy is on you. Now, you are in a wrestling match and he has a knife and you have a baton and you are grappling. He can just push that knife into you while you are beating the snot out of him with butt strikes, not my idea of survival. So, you have to learn to deal with many different attacks, including someone that performs the mad rush on you, multiple attackers, everything and as SING! said (I love you too man, now can I have that Bud Lite?) get some training. Try the Filipino Martial Arts out as they will teach you all the neato-torpedo stuff like...WOW, how to speak another language and actually make some sense out of it at times.

Lobtikwitikabanicoflorrette-arkoammarahcarrenza...(yawn)
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so wearing both a shorter knife and a ASP should i pull the knife instead (asuming it will get close) ? whatabout having a bigger knife (7" or more) instead of a ASP would that be better? (especially since some people claim a 7" can be worn without problems and not being too heavy)
 
i do not agree that it is not possible to keep a man at a distance with a stick. that is a strategy and application problem, not the weapon.

if you crack a man even if he is drunk or drugged with a stick with intermediate or advance skill you should have no problem keeping him away. anyone with experience fighting with a stick will find that out. the streetfighter is not unbeatable. a martial artist who think this is true should not quit his day job. what can make a man come through your attacks is the attacker's hesitation and lack of accuracy. your footwork can keep the distance, your confidence and skill will make the contact count.

now if you are in a small area i agree that the man with the knife have the advantage, even if the man has skill with pekiti tirsia technique.

the difference of the abaniko and the witik is the abaniko is the stick is traveling from rotating the wrist. the witik is a flick using your elbow and wrist (which points) the abaniko is for the opponent who is close to you, the witik if he is far.
 
If you don't think a person can remain completely conscious after getting bashed an un-Godly amount of times with two hands on a stick, review the Rodney King Beating. He might not have been doing much, but it was also multiple attackers on one guy.

Just because someone is a martial artist does not mean that they are unbeatable either.

A modern day martial artist is a streetfighter as far as I am concerned. And if they are not, then God help them. However, they are a streetfighter with principles and morals. But a streetfighter nonetheless.
 
I would get both items. With respect to the ASP I would try going for knee shots. Just like, I believe it was Don, said their are people out there who don't care were or how many times they get hit they will keep coming. There's a story the Dog Brothers tell of Surf Dog losing his stick and yet still attacking his opponent, he was deflecting the blows with his arms, until he was able to take him down and make him submit. After the fight it was discovered that Surf Dog's arm had been broken. Proof that the body can withstand a lot of punishment. But I believe a well placed knee shot, if you were able to shatter the adversary's knee cap, will prevent the attacker from continuing his attack.

Knives will turn brave men into cowards. I was in a bar a while ago and this individual started making trouble with me. I was watching this person's actions when I saw him make a move to grab his beer bottle to attempt some sort of strike. I checked his elbow then pulled my Cold Steel Voyager. Upon seeing my knife all of sudden this trouble maker/instigator didn't want any trouble. A knife will dramatically change the mood of any situation, because the possibility of serious injury or death is a very real possibility.
 
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