Your weakest survival link??

Pict,

http://www.amazon.com/Tales-Shamans-Apprentice-Ethnobotanist-Medicines/dp/014012991X

I would check out this book. This is written by a student of Richard Schultes, who was an ethnobotanist who collected many specimens of plants in Suriname. I know it is not Brazil but it is worth checking out. The video doc on this book is amazing. Some serious local knowledge. It is not a plant id book but it does point you in the direction.

That looks like a great book on general principles. Central Brazil, where I live, is very different than the rain forest. My area was covered with "Mata Atlantica" (Atlantic Forest) originally and almost all of it was logged off during the colonial period. Large areas are now covered with the regrowth of this old forest much like the Eastern US is covered by regrown forest after the logging of the old growth. Much of the land doesn't support trees and is covered by open savannah or desert-like scrub growth called Cerrado. In the higher elevations we have what is called "Campo Rupestre", tropical alpine meadows. You can find all three of these major terrain types within walking distance of each other. Mac
 
Plants is mine.

I also had a realization following a 3 week camping/ rafting trip. For extended duration wilderness stays, there are huge psychological ramifications that are rarely considered. Some of the people on this trip started to go apeshit crazy after 10 days sans civilization. I was fine, but then again my wife was with me. I wonder if my mental status would have held up if I was solo for that duration, or longer. I also have been contemplating how to contend with these psychological challenges. Keeping busy seems to be the best answer, but there are times in between nightfall and sleep where ones mind could really sabotage an otherwise good stay in the woods.
 
Quiet Bear, forgive me for being forward, but your thinking is unwise. The entire point of being prepared in a survival situation is to not expect a finish line. You should mentally be able to accept the possibility of no rescue. With this in mind, arming yourself with the mindset of "short term" can be very dangerous, and may, in some cases, be lethal. "Short term" is not survival, my friend, that is called CAMPING. Should you find yourself stranded, you'd best accept the fact that it may be a very long time before you are able to return to civilization. With this in mind, edible plants become not a luxury, but a necessity. I hope this helps to educate you as to what you "are missing". Of course, I sense you already knew this and were merely fishing for responses.

Touche. Nice reply. Not the first time I have been called unwise and it is definately true in many regards. I don't agree with everything you state, but that doesn't mean either of us are right or wrong.

I am stubbornly sticking with my opion and I offer it again with rationale in hopes that it provokes thought.
- A high majority of survival situations last less than 72 hours. I am only aware of one starvation in North America in recent history. Christopher McCandless starved because he didn't know how to handle the meat he procured and tried to make it with edible plants after his supplies ran out. Even if he did have meat to eat, the berries he was eating may have done him in anyway as he misidentified them.
- Survival situations for the most part are very short term with exposure (hypothermia and hyperthermia) causing the most deaths.
- In the rare long-term survival situations, calories (energy) are important only after shelter and water requirements have been met.
- All nutrients (including vitamins and minerals) required to keep you alive can be found in the animal kingdom with Fats, Carbs, and Protein being the most important (plants are very low in these).
- I argue it is a waste of calories to forage for plants in a survival situation. To find an edible at the right time of year, prepare it (if necessary), in a quantity to generate a return in energy is unlikely. And that is assuming you can identify it properly including knowing its look-a-likes.
- Unless you are in the tropics, you will die as a vegetarian in a long-term survival situation or primitive living. Not implying anyone would try and be a vegetarian, just emphazing the importantance of meat.
- If you know edibles well and you happen upon some, great!
- I am of the opinion that T.V. shows like Survivorman have put to much emphasis on edible plants in a survival situation. (for the record, I like Les)
- I do believe plants are the foundation of survival, short and long-term, but not as a food source. They are important for fire, shelter, tools, and they are what the real food eats.
- Regarding ones 'weakest link' for survival, learning plants for the fore mentioned should be a higher priority than food. A greater return would be learning traps/snares and the plants with the highest wildlife use than what plants are edible for a human.
- Medicinal/Edible plants are important for Pimitive living and bushcraft.

All this is just my opinion. And it is not meant to discourage not learning plants, it should be just the opposite as plants are the foundation of survival. I think it is sad sheeple today know over a 1,000 comercial brands, but don't 10 trees in their own backyard. So in sum, my point is that ones concern over plants as a food in a survival situation should be a lower priority than what are truer weaker survival links we all most likely have.

I can't wait for the next topic on edible plants, the Universal Edibility Test, would you do it? :D

Peace, Chris
 
I'd say the cold, and edible plants. I've slept out below freezing twice. But there was not any threat of weather. Just freezing cold. And nothing like what you guys post pics of.
 
Definatly helpful/harmful plants

I have trapped and fished for years so that makes up for some of the food
issues, but it would be nice to know some medical plants.
 
Pooping in the woods. I've never been much for taking a dump without all the accoutrements of modern living. If I were stuck without TP, I know I would be a rotten bastard within a couple of days. How did people do it 100 years ago and not just STINK to hell all the time? Especially in winter when bathing was less frequent. For those that would now suggest leaves...Yeah, leaves don't work well with me, sorry. So, eventually I would just smell like walking excrement and some bear or large cat would come and end my sorry excuse for a life just to rid itself of my odor.
 
The question is weakest SURVIVAL link. Why all the focus on edible plants?

When I think survival, I think short term scenario. You all know the rules of 3 ~ 3 minutes without air, 3 hours shelter, 3 days water, 3 weeks food. It is obviously me as so many are concerned with it. What am I missing?

What are you missing? You are missing the fact that food isn't a common problem - that is why so many people are deficient in knowledge. Luckily this wouldn't be life threatening over a few days - but if the situation went on for weeks it would be a huge issue.


I have many weaknesses - lack of experience is probably the biggest.
Knot tying is another.
Edible plants is another.
Hunting & trapping - I have shot the occasional rabbit a couple of decades ago, nothing since.
Cleaning game - I've never done it.

To fix up some of my deficiencies I'll try to learn and practice some stuff. Knot tying isn't too hard, there are plenty of online resource - I just need to practice the knots enough to embed the knowledge into my brain. I guess I'll have to go hunting with someone and get them to show me how to clean and prepare the kill for eating.
 
Pooping in the woods. I've never been much for taking a dump without all the accoutrements of modern living. If I were stuck without TP, I know I would be a rotten bastard within a couple of days. How did people do it 100 years ago and not just STINK to hell all the time? Especially in winter when bathing was less frequent. For those that would now suggest leaves...Yeah, leaves don't work well with me, sorry. So, eventually I would just smell like walking excrement and some bear or large cat would come and end my sorry excuse for a life just to rid itself of my odor.

I'm with you. I always wonder if people understand what the world was like without in door plumbing. People smelled! Horse S@@@T in the streets, washing clothes, washing yourself etc was rarely done (compared to today).
 
Desert survival tech and Western Plants. I know plenty of Eastern plants, but I don't know ANY western plants.
I know enought that I could probably eek out a bad situation in the desert or canyon lands, but I don't know near enough to live as well out there as I can in these mountains.

Hand drill is a major chink in my armor. Bow drill I can do, and practice just for fun. But hand drill is something I've tried a million times and just can't get right.

Orienteering is a little bit weak. I know enough to use a compass to tell me about where I need to go to get back home. But I can't do azimuths and all that stuff. If I'm not mistaken our good buddy Brian Andrews made some really great little vids that helped me out immensely. I know the shadow stick trick, the watch/sun trick, and a couple others...but that only gives me a general direction.

I need to practice some other types of shelters. Mostly lean-to's and a-frames are what I use, but I'd like to build a wickiup and learn to build a good snow shelter (we got plenty of snow this year, I just didn't have plenty of time...). I'm bad for finding what works well for me and sticking with it. I need to get out of my box a little bit on shelters.

I could probably learn a couple more traps. But the old figure four, snare, squirrel pole and pitfall have never failed me. They're simple. I don't like to build super complicated traps--too many moving parts means a bigger chance of failure. But I do need to work on a few twitch-ups and mechanical traps. You never know when you'll have turn your front yard into a vietnam jungle....I also need to buy some connibear traps. I hear those are excellent.

Other than that...I don't have any wool (well, my uncle has picked me up a couple blankets and is bringing them in the next time he comes).
 
Weak links: map and compass use, edible plants

Strengths: intuition, ability to remain calm in the face of utter chaos (although that would be severely challenged with kids now in the mix), seemingly endless energy to finish a task at hand when others (again going back to wife/kids) are counting on me...

I must add the caveat though that I bet my list of weaknesses is much longer than I realize should an actual SHTF occur.
 
Sometimes we dont find out what is sooo hard to do untill we have to actually do it. We are encouraged to learn and test ourselves so if ever required we can survive with the basics, maybe just our blade, PSK or nothing at all. My weak link is probably eatable plants ... what is yours?

Same here.
 
Have you ever heard the term “jack of all trades, master of none”? That pretty well describes me when it comes to survival skills.

I’ve been learning these skills for a very long time — since I was a child, actually. My Dad got me started in a very good way: he made a game out of it, and it’s been a hobby and serious interest for my entire life. I’ve gone through a lot of schools — and read a lot of books — and now I know... almost nothing.

Well, that’s not quite true. Actually, I know quite a bit, but not nearly as much as I would like to know, and I always fear that it’s that one thing I don’t know that will kill me — if I live long enough to get into a situation like that.

I don’t worry much about short term survival situations. If we’re only talking three or four days — even a week — that’s easy (assuming I don’t have massive injuries). Heck, I can do a week standing on your head — nothing to it. I know more than necessary for the short term, but what if, for some reason, it turns into a long term survival situation? How would one cope with that?

That is where many of our primitive living skills would come into play. The indigenous people of an area (local indians, in my case) practiced these skills on a daily basis. To them, these weren’t called “primitive living skills,” just living. All the stuff we practice now was state of the art to them, and kept them alive for centuries.

I’m fascinated by those skills, because they’re still as useful today as they were then.

Here are some of the things that I’ve studied over the years:

Fire.
Wow — I must know at least thirty or forty ways to make a fire. Okay, maybe only eight or ten when we take Bic lighters, flame throwers, napalm, and things like that out of the equation. I know how to make and use bow drills, hand drills, flint and steel — all that stuff. That’s the easy part when you’re doing it for practice: it’s doing it under adverse conditions — when you’re cold, wet, dehydrated, disoriented, etc. — that’s where it gets tricky. That’s not to mention finding really good dry tinder in your survival location. I’ve yet to see a PJCB tree in any location I’ve ever visited, but maybe I haven’t looked hard enough.

Tool making.
None of us would ever be caught dead in a survival situation without our primary survival tool: our knife. But wait; what if we were? What if we lost our knife (knives) for some reason? Could we cope? How would we cut our meat and veggies, make trap and shelter components, cut wood or hide? Well, I guess we’re back to the stone age again — literally. I learned to knap flint (chip rocks) a long time ago. I even took a course in it. I was never all that good — it’s an art that requires practice — but I could turn out serviceable items if I had to. But that’s assuming that I could find suitable rocks to work with: not all rocks are created equal, you know. One really should become familiar with some basic rocks in their area, just in case. Me? I’m still not sure that I could identify good rock materials just by glancing at the dirty outside of them. When I go out wandering — I’m reluctant to actually call it hiking, because that implies more dedicated movement than I’m sometimes am willing to exert — I spend a pretty fair amount of time just bashing two rocks together to see how they split, and if they’ll spark. Sound silly? Well, you might want to try it sometime; you could learn a lot.

Wild edible plants.
I’ve studied wild edible plants for a long, long time, and I still don’t know squat. I probably know only twenty or thirty plants that are indigenous to my area that I know are safe to eat. I know this because I’ve eaten them, and I’m still here to type this. Some of these — like nettle — are plants that I used to consume on a regular basis when I lived in a rural area. Only twenty or thirty plants? Yep. Out of the thousands and thousands of plants that are out there, I really only know about that many for sure. That’s not a bad thing though, because I really do know those plants, and that’s probably a lot more than I would need to know to survive, even long term. I would suggest that people learn — really learn — twenty plants in their area. More is better, of course, but learn that twenty.

Useful plants.
Useful plants are not necessarily the same as edible plants. Some, like the nettle, are certainly useful for food, but have other uses, too. There are other plants though, that may be useful for some purposes, but are poisonous when eaten. There are many plants that have medicinal properties, and it would be a good idea to know as many of those as possible, too. I’m actually pretty weak on medicinal plants, and I need to learn more. When it comes to plants, I’d say learn twenty that you can eat, twenty that you can use for other purposes (cordage, etc.), and twenty that are useful for basic medicine (plantago, for wounds, for instance).

Traps.
I’ve read books, and gone to schools, and I’m still weak in this area. Sure, I’ve gone out and made some traps — caught a few things, too. A few things; not enough to keep me going in a long term situation, though. Maybe if I set more of them I’d get better production, but I’m betting that learning more about trapping would be a good thing, too. As I said, I’m weak in this area.

Medicine.
I’m weaker in this area than I’d like to be, too. Odd — I took the basic course and the trauma course, so I know a bit... but only a bit. The courses I took were over forty years ago, and I seem to have forgotten most of it. Like most of us, I really should study more, but I hope I don’t have to actually practice it in a real life situation. Yep, I am definitely weak in this area, so don’t come to me with your ouchies if you can help it.

Shelter.
Ah, I’ve got this one covered (excuse the pun). I’ll repeat myself, at the risk of being crude, there must be fifty ways to use your cover (I hear groans). Seriously, I can build anything from an expedient debris hut, to a wikiup, to a log cabin — or an adobe cabin, for that matter. Yep, I’ve got that covered... assuming I can find the materials. And that’s the problem: materials. In some places you can easily find more materials than you can possibly use without even working at it. On the other hand, try getting stuck in the desert where there’s almost nothing available. Oh, the materials are there, but they won’t be close at hand, and you’ll have to search for them. I know from experience that it’s not easy.

Knots.
I’ve got knots well in hand, too. Been learning and practicing since I was a kid. Unfortunately, I’ve forgotten most of them. I can still remember about twenty of them though, and that’s more than enough for a survival situation.

Signaling.
I know quite a bit about this. I could know more of course, but I know enough to signal for help.

As I said, “Jack of all trades, master of none”. I know a lot of things that would be highly useful in a survival situation, but feel that I’m still weaker than I’d like to be in almost all of them.

Where I’m weakest though, in an area that I can’t control, and no amount of study will ever change: I’m old, and have some health problems. Being old doesn’t stop me from getting out when I can, but it sure as heck slows me down. It doesn’t stop me from trying to learn more about this stuff, either. I keep learning more because I like it... and you just never know when you’ll need it. I have to say that the things I’ve learned from the people here on this board have been great. I love this place.
 
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