ZT 0200 washers

rschuch

rschuch

Joined
Apr 18, 2014
Messages
709
I have a ZT 0200 and, while it's not a BAD flipper, it's not 452 or 801 level. I've broken it in, loosened it up, greased it up and it still takes a forceful finger pressure to get it to open in one shot (no wrist action). SO, I'm wondering what I can do to take it to the next level. Will sanding down the phosphor bronze washers help (I have a Lansky sharpener, so I can use the extra fine or ceramic stones for this) or should I change out the washers all together? Has anyone put the ball bearing style washers in this? Would they even fit? Just wondering if anyone else has toyed around with this.
 
Ok. I just played with my 0200 built in 2007. I've carried it every day up until about three months ago. Mine flips like butter. I've taken it apart once, and only occasionally lubed it, BUT its the detent that keeps the blade from effortlessly deploying. I don't know how you could reduce the detent holding the blade. I wouldn't sand anything down, The knife just has a strong detent.
 
Hmmm, good point. Maybe a touch of grease on the detent, though obviously that'll wear off quickly. Don't sand anything, huh?
 
rschuch said:
Hmmm, good point. Maybe a touch of grease on the detent, though obviously that'll wear off quickly. Don't sand anything, huh?
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No. If you do that the washers will be too thin, and you might get nasty side to side play. Remember....the 0200 was designed to be a big heavy combat/severe duty folder. Smooth effortless flipping was not the goal back then.
 
Two things that can help. First polish the washers (I rub mine in a circular pattern on my strop. Second make sure the contact surface on the pivot area of the blade is smooth. If the coating is worn, it could help to *VERY CAREFULLY* sand the coating off and polish it (some taping to limit where you can sand helps here, and use a higher grit, at least 600).

Bearings won't work without modification because bearings are thicker than washers, so the liners or blade would have to get channels milled to accept the bearings, which is obviously a very risky procedure on a discontinued knife. If you find a machinist savant, this is an option, but I would only recommend it if you find the best of the best.
 
scottyj said:
Ok. I just played with my 0200 built in 2007. I've carried it every day up until about three months ago. Mine flips like butter. I've taken it apart once, and only occasionally lubed it, BUT its the detent that keeps the blade from effortlessly deploying. I don't know how you could reduce the detent holding the blade. I wouldn't sand anything down, The knife just has a strong detent.
Click to expand...

I would think that the issue is more likely to be the light detent... the newer models and dedicate flippers require much more pressure to get the blade moving; but, once it breaks, the blade is deployed like an assisted knife.
My 0200 and 0560 both have soft detents; it seems to be more a matter of technique than force that ensures good, consistent deployment.
 
scottyj said:
No. If you do that the washers will be too thin, and you might get nasty side to side play. Remember....the 0200 was designed to be a big heavy combat/severe duty folder. Smooth effortless flipping was not the goal back then.
Click to expand...

Exactly. Once the material has been removed, you cannot put it back. So, if you go too far without really paying very close attention will give you a wobbly and possibly unsafe knife. The 0200 was absolutely made to be a heavy duty knife and not a picket jewelry vanity knife with exceptional action. Not to mention, remember what it cost back 10 years ago.
 
Well, the ball bearings are definitely out, since a genius machinist is not in my rolladex. I'll leave the detent alone, too, which only leaves the current washers, which I may just give a light swish or two on the ceramic sharpener to see if it helps, along with where it contacts the blade. I know it's not designed to be an amazing flipper; it's a heavy blade, but some users have said theirs flips amazingly well, so if theirs can, why can't mine, right? I have a long weekend and a tropical storm coming through - might as well keep busy.
 
Again - technique....and realistic expectations.
Mine flips fine; but it doesn't flip anything like my 0801. It isn't built to flip like that.
Once I figured out the best technique for flipping my XM18, I found the same method worked great on my 0200 and 0560.
 
gonebad395 said:
I miss my 0200 one knife I truly regret selling
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I miss it too :(

And no, don't sand it. With one 200 I had I actually increased the detent by bending the lock bar. This made it flip better. Still not great though. If I were the OP I'd just leave it alone.
 
If you hold the lock bar out away from the blade, does the blade swing freely? If not, then the pivot may be too tight. Polishing the washers is not going to hurt anything, but it will not make up for a pivot that is too tight. If the blade does swing free when the lock is held open, then you can try adjusting the lock bar tension. Disassemble the knife and bend the lock bar out slightly to reduce the pressure it is putting on the blade. Keep in mind that this will also reduce the tension on the detent, reducing the force needed for the blade to break free. It can take some adjusting, but I find that slight adjustments to the lock tension can make a huge difference in how a knife opens and closes.
 
SunOfAtom said:
If you hold the lock bar out away from the blade, does the blade swing freely? If not, then the pivot may be too tight. Polishing the washers is not going to hurt anything, but it will not make up for a pivot that is too tight. If the blade does swing free when the lock is held open, then you can try adjusting the lock bar tension. Disassemble the knife and bend the lock bar out slightly to reduce the pressure it is putting on the blade. Keep in mind that this will also reduce the tension on the detent, reducing the force needed for the blade to break free. It can take some adjusting, but I find that slight adjustments to the lock tension can make a huge difference in how a knife opens and closes.
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Polishing the washers is removing metal. Remove too much and you have ruined the washers. It is common for people to suggest this and I myself have even done it but if you think about what it is actually doing (removing metal) it is not a good thing. Read what rev wrote above. Polishing the blade is even worse. And for adjusting the lock bar, it most likely needs more detent not less to flip better.
 
I think you may have hit upon the problem. It's a bit difficult to do what you say because the flipper extension is right where the lock bar is when the knife is have open, but I DID adjust the pivot when I first got it (it didn't open for BEANS) so it's about as loose as it's going to get without the nut falling off. I can definitely feel resistance when moving the blade around in the 1/2 open position, so maybe a lock bar tweak is in order. I'll give it a shot. Just to add to this discussion, it's really only with the flipper that it has an issue opening. I find it easy to get a good purchase with the thumbstud and it opens like a rocket every time.
 
craytab said:
Polishing the washers is removing metal. Remove too much and you have ruined the washers. It is common for people to suggest this and I myself have even done it but if you think about what it is actually doing (removing metal) it is not a good thing. Read what rev wrote above. Polishing the blade is even worse. And for adjusting the lock bar, it most likely needs more detent not less to flip better.
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I know what polishing is, and you are not going to make a measurable difference in the thickness of the washer by running them across a strop with some polishing compound. If you did, an additional degree of rotation from the pivot nut would make up the difference. Should someone manage to destroy a washer, replacements are likely free from ZT and cheap from knife making outlets.

In my experience, poor flipping action has been more to do with too much tension from the lock bar rather than a weak detent. Either one can cause issues, and it can take a fine balance of the two in order to get great flipping action. If moving the lock bar one direction only makes it worse, try moving it the other direction. There is no guarantee that you can fix flipping issues by adjusting the lock bar, but it is free and and experiments like these can help people understand the mechanics of the knife.
 
I've had two ZT 200s. Both had weak detents. This is common with this model. Bending the lock bar out will further weaken the detent. Bending it in will strengthen the detent. This will make you use more force when flipping (to break the stronger detent) and thus make the blade come out faster. I did this with my latest 200.

OP, like what some other quality posters and one mod have said, I wouldn't mess with the washers. No sense in risking the damage.
 
OK, well, I made it worse. I didn't touch the washers - they seemed very smooth as is. I took the whole thing apart, bent the lockbar back just a tad, added press grease to the washers on either side and reassembled. Won't flip for love or money now. Some may be because the press grease is actually a bit tacky instead of slippery, but to the above point, yeah, the detent is much weaker. It doesn't "pop" out anymore. It only locks up if I use the thumbstud and even then only with considerable wrist action. Guess I'll be doing another disassembly tonight and moving it back over.
On the plus side, I'm getting pretty good at this. I should time myself next time. If anyone has a better suggestion for grease for the washers, I'm all ears.
 
rschuch said:
OK, well, I made it worse. I didn't touch the washers - they seemed very smooth as is. I took the whole thing apart, bent the lockbar back just a tad, added press grease to the washers on either side and reassembled. Won't flip for love or money now. Some may be because the press grease is actually a bit tacky instead of slippery, but to the above point, yeah, the detent is much weaker. It doesn't "pop" out anymore. It only locks up if I use the thumbstud and even then only with considerable wrist action. Guess I'll be doing another disassembly tonight and moving it back over.
On the plus side, I'm getting pretty good at this. I should time myself next time. If anyone has a better suggestion for grease for the washers, I'm all ears.
Click to expand...

Yup. This is why you don't want to remove metal from the blade or washers. You can't put it back on if you mess up. With the lock bar you can at least bend it back. No real harm. Just a waste of time. Most flippers flip good because of a strong detent. Weakening it as suggested above will make it flip worse. Strengthening it will make it flip better. As for oil, I use benchmade blue lube. There are others that a very good as well. I've heard nano oil is good.
 
Can you get the Benchmade blue lube in Ace or Lowes (a hardware store) or do you have to order it online?
 
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