Recommendation? ZT 0707 issue

aikiman56

aikiman56

Joined
Sep 18, 2022
Messages
36
Hi everyone...first post so please go easy on me for the newbie question. I recently purchased a ZT 0707 directly from Kai USA. I have several Benchmades and one other ZT, the 0450 which I love due to it being incredibly lightweight and very pocket friendly. I was interested in the 0707 due to the similar light weight but with a longer (3.5") blade.

So here's the thing...when I got the 0707 three weeks ago, I found the detent to be incredibly difficult, i.e., I couldn't flip the darn thing with my index finger no matter where I placed my other fingers (usually on/near the pocket clip). I know knives have to be broken in, but how can one possibly do that when it's practically impossible to flip open ? In addition, ZT states that the 0707 has something called the "tuned detent system" which supposedly makes it possible to flip open even with fingers resting on the liner lock.
I decided to send it back to ZT's warranty/repair dept. since I like everything else about the knife and figured they'd loosen up the action. So now I got it back with a letter from them stating that they only fix defective knives and that there's nothing wrong with the one they sold me. In addition I should be careful not to rest my fingers on the liner lock. Huh ??

So now I'm thinking about returning it to them for a full refund since I have a week left on their one month RMA window...the only way I can get the knife open is by using the flipper in conjunction with my other fingers on the blade, which is ridiculous. And yes, I tried loosening up the pivot screws...made no difference. Has anyone heard about detent issues like this ? And what was done to resolve it ?

Thanks in advance...
 
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Sometimes you just get unlucky honestly. I've had a few knives that were just funky on the detent. You CAN tune them if your brave and careful by drifting the detent ball a tiny bit further into the lockbar or by adjusting the lockbar pressure. The thing is every knife issue is different and you'd have to figure out what would work best for you and do it just a little bit at a time. I bet if you got another one it'd be much better. If not then I suppose you are putting pressure on the lockbar with your other fingers. Most of the time you don't even realize your doing it.

Edit: I've fixed soft detents by adjusting the lockbar to be a little stiffer, a little looser on another for the opposite problem. Never adjusted the depth of the detent ball but it can be done. I've only had to do it a few times though.
 
Welcome:)

I'd just send it back and be done with it. There are a lot of great flippers out there in the ZT pricepoint.

I had a ZT 0630 that was a bear to open with the thumb disk if you didn't want to use the wave. I had to hold it *just* so in order to not to put too much pressure on the frame lock. IMHO, it would have been a great knife to use their beefy liner lock like on the 0909.
 
Welcome to BF. :) Have you tried altering your "angle of attack" on the flipper tab? Sometimes just a shift from a light-switch approach to a push-button approach is all that's needed. Other times the angle or placement of your fingertip can make a difference.

I've never owned a ZT with an unflippably stiff detent, but I've owned at least one that was stuff until broken-in (an 0450).
 
I agree that you should just send it back and get a refund. If you still can't get it to work and they refuse to acknowledge the problem after a return visit but are willing to refund, take that option. Do not take it apart and try to adjust anything. Way too many options out there that come perfect, to put up with any nonsense.
 
Are you putting you index finger directly on top of the flipper tab or some other way ?
 
I have an 0630 that was a Mother F***er to open for a long time. I didn't want to sell it or trade it because it was discontinued and I had a custom scale being made for it. I ended up basically opening it 1.3million times while holding pressure on the lock bar. With enough repetition, I wore down the ball detent some to where it is flickable and easy to open. I literally bet my friends $100 they could not open the knife and won every time ( I didn't actually take their money). Anyways all this to say that if you want the knife badly enough it is possible to wear it in/down enough to where you will be satisfied. Maybe get a small piece of leather/cloth, grab some locking pliers, hold down the lockbar and go to town...... Its going to be a process. If not like mentioned above there are plenty of alternatives. I think it's somewhat shitty ZT wouldn't work on it for you, and that may have put me off if that happened with me but to each their own. I had a Sig Saur p320 with issues onetime that Sig wouldn't fix. I sold that gun and never bought another Sig again. I am now team Canik and Staccato lol. Good luck! 211CB4B1-2402-4640-B0B8-8E92702CBA2F-1822-00000170B220FE3A.jpeg
 
From ZT ad-copy:

"Tuned Detent System (TDS™) enables us to fine-tune the detent so it’s not too heavy, not too light and provides consistent opening even when pressure is applied to the lockbar"

If this is what they claim for the knife, but you can't open it even after a warranty return, and they are telling you there is nothing wrong and to not put pressure on the lock bar, I call bs. If you can return it, do so, and be done with them.

Sounds like their TDS is pure BS if they are literally telling you to not do something their own knife description is telling you it is okay to do. It is a selling point of the knife. What a stupid thing to say.
 
aikiman56 said:
So now I got it back with a letter from them stating that they only fix defective knives and that there's nothing wrong with the one they sold me. In addition I should be careful not to rest my fingers on the liner lock. Huh ??
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Got a pic of that letter? I mean, did they even look at the knife? It ain't a liner lock...
 
Thanks for all your responses...really appreciated ! Honestly, I think the spring that keeps the blade closed is simply too stiff (or new)...I've tried loosening the pivot screws and oiling the pivot axis. Even when the pivot screws are almost completely out and the blade decentered...it still won't open. There's some jimping on the flipper tab for the index finger...angle of attack makes no difference. I guess my best bet is to simply try to return it and get my money back...kinda sad imho that ZT's warranty dept. sends me a boilerplate letter saying I should rest my fingers on the clip, when in fact ZT marketing makes a big deal about their 'tuned detent system' that supposedly allows fingers on the liner lock. This is a pic of the jimping on the flipper tab...

ZT0707_04_zero-tolerance
 
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The frame lock is too tight, this can be corrected by removing the steel lock face and bending the frame lock a little away from the blade. Reinstall the lock face and it should be good.
 
Last spring I bought a knife that I found extremely difficult to open, no matter how I positioned my fingers. I contacted the dealer; and, since I had never returned a knife, they were willing to accept the return without any surcharge. I wouldn't "adjust" a knife I was thinking about returning; so I applied a little KPL to the pivot. Problem resolved, and that knife owned my RFP for the past year and a half.
tldr: try a little lube


Just put of curiosity - why buy manufacturer direct on a regular production item?
 
hhmoore said:
Just put of curiosity - why buy manufacturer direct on a regular production item?
Click to expand...

Precisely for the reason previously stated...in case there's a problem with the knife and it needs to be fixed. But I have serious doubts that ZT even thoroughly examined the knife...which is why it's going back this week.
 
craytab said:
Got a pic of that letter? I mean, did they even look at the knife? It ain't a liner lock...
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+1
I’m also curious that they called the 0707 a liner lock, I would love to see a picture of the letter. I have dozens of ZTs, about 90% of my collection, but have never had to contact them (I had to send one back to a dealer to exchange it for a defect on the pivot, that was it).
Edit: also saw on their website recently they offer parts, like bearings, screws, clips (some free I think) for a ton of models, even discontinued ones. I might take advantage of that, since I have a 0200 I want to send in for a sharpening soon.
 
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tony281sc2 said:
+1
I’m also curious that they called the 0707 a liner lock, I would love to see a picture of the letter. I have dozens of ZTs, about 90% of my collection, but have never had to contact them (had to send one ZT back to a dealer to exchange it, that was it).
Edit: also saw on their website recently they offer parts, like bearings, screws, clips (some free I think) for a ton of models, even discontinued ones. I might take advantage of that, since I have a 0200 I want to send in for a sharpening soon.
Click to expand...
I'd be glad to upload a scan of the letter if I could, but from what I can tell I can only link to other urls on the web. If there's some way to upload a scan please let me know.

After the first paragraph that describes how they only repair defective knives, this is what it says verbatim:

"The result of our evaluation is that we did not find a defect in the materials or construction. The blade deploys as intended. With this model, make sure your fingers and/or pocket clip are not resting on the lock bar when attempting to open the knife. Pressure on the lock bar causes it to press into the blade and can make it very difficult to deploy."
 
aikiman56 said:
I'd be glad to upload a scan of the letter if I could, but from what I can tell I can only link to other urls on the web. If there's some way to upload a scan please let me know.

After the first paragraph that describes how they only repair defective knives, this is what it says verbatim:

"The result of our evaluation is that we did not find a defect in the materials or construction. The blade deploys as intended. With this model, make sure your fingers and/or pocket clip are not resting on the lock bar when attempting to open the knife. Pressure on the lock bar causes it to press into the blade and can make it very difficult to deploy."
Click to expand...
Okay, so at least they said lock bar, which is accurate to the model. But still, the selling point of their trademarked TDS is that you can put your fingers on the lock bar. You clearly can't do that with your example and in fact they tell you so, indicating a problem with the TDS. The flawed deductive reasoning here is glaringly painful. Sounds to me, without knowing anything about the TDS, that the detent is too hard to break because something isn't right, like the ball sits to high in one part and or to high/low in another (the hole it goes into is too deep), making it nearly impossible to break free. I had a 550 and a 566 that were super tough to get the detent to break unless you opened the knife just right. It happens, but on a new knife bought from ZT, which claims to have solved this issue with a trademarked technology, and that has already been denied a warranty, this should not be happening. Return for a refund asap.
 
Hello aikiman56 aikiman56
I've tried to replicate your problem with my own 0707 and could not. I intentionally put alot of pressure on the lockbar with 2 fingers and the blade still deployed...this would normally cause even knives like hinderers and curtiss to have trouble with.
My normal hand positions:
20220925_094525.jpg
20220925_094536.jpg

What I tried, and the blade still deployed:
20220925_094512.jpg

The 0707 does have a stronger detent to break than the other ZTs (which are not light themselves), but definitely not impossible. Are you able to pull the blade out 2 handed like below?
20220925_095039.jpg

Mine is very easy to do, and you can get a good feel of how the knife detent is.

If all the above fails, I'd definitely return it to KAI. In my usual dealings with them, they were quite good (even on 30$ kershaws)...so don't get put-off by one guy.

If KAI won't take it, I would be okay trading you my 0707, let me know.

Good luck!
 
Dergyll said:
Hello aikiman56 aikiman56
I've tried to replicate your problem with my own 0707 and could not. I intentionally put alot of pressure on the lockbar with 2 fingers and the blade still deployed...this would normally cause even knives like hinderers and curtiss to have trouble with.
My normal hand positions:
View attachment 1940657
View attachment 1940656

What I tried, and the blade still deployed:
View attachment 1940658

The 0707 does have a stronger detent to break than the other ZTs (which are not light themselves), but definitely not impossible. Are you able to pull the blade out 2 handed like below?
View attachment 1940663

Mine is very easy to do, and you can get a good feel of how the knife detent is.

If all the above fails, I'd definitely return it to KAI. In my usual dealings with them, they were quite good (even on 30$ kershaws)...so don't get put-off by one guy.

If KAI won't take it, I would be okay trading you my 0707, let me know.

Good luck!
Click to expand...
Some awfully nice folks on this forum, good karma is coming your way Dergyll !
 
Dergyll said:
Mine is very easy to do, and you can get a good feel of how the knife detent is.

If all the above fails, I'd definitely return it to KAI. In my usual dealings with them, they were quite good (even on 30$ kershaws)...so don't get put-off by one guy.

If KAI won't take it, I would be okay trading you my 0707, let me know.

Good luck!
Click to expand...
Hey Dergyll,

Very kind on your part...let's see how it goes with an RMA tomorrow, hopefully it'll be straightforward.
 
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