ZT 561 Standoff Anomaly

[hoxhunbe]

Hey fellow ZT users,

Just received my 561, and it's a beast for sure. Great design. Smooth flip. Unfortunately, I've noticed a curious "flaw" regarding this specific unit's standoffs, particularly the bottom two. Basically, out of the box, there were very wide gaps between the standoffs and the scales, such that the space between scales effectively widened as you looked down from the pivot. Unfortunately, I didn't think to take a picture of the knife out of the box.

Naturally, I figured the standoff screws just needed a bit of tightening, so I broke out the torx screws and gave it a go. Unfortunately, the screws were already very tight and I couldnt screw them down much more. Additionally, I could only screw/unscrew from the titanium side, as the G10 side screws seemed absolutely stuck and wouldn't budge in either direction. Is that by design? I'm afraid to go after them too hard as I don't want to break or crack the G10. As you can see, the gaps are now smaller but still evident, and I literally can't get it any closer. I tried loosening each standoff and the pivot, tightening from the bottom up, to see if that made any difference, and it didn't. Curiously, the two standoff screws in question are much more "gummy" when screwing or unscrewing compared to the pivot and center standoff. They just slowly release the tightness instead of having that tangible point of release, if that makes any sense. So this is what the knife looks like now (better but not perfect):

Also, there seems to be a rough angle or crack in the steel scale beneath the G10. I can't get a good look without taking the knife apart, and it very well might be nothing, but it's worth pointing out (hard to get a good pic of, see the leftmost side of the hidden liner):

I emailed ZT three days ago to ask if they had any other similar issues crop up, and I also asked if disassembling the knife will void the warranty. I'm still awaiting their response (phonecalls are harder for me to place, as I work night hours usually). In the meantime, does anyone know ZT's stance on disassembly? I've read that taking apart your Spyderco will void its warranty, but I am not clear on whether or not this is an industry-wide practice. If possible, I'd like to disassemble the knife and put it back together to see if that makes a difference, or to see if there are any structural flaws (i.e. bent/broken liners) that might be causing this issue.

Don't get me wrong, I really love the knife. This little problem is just annoying the bejeezus put of me...

Thanks for your help, guys!

 

[mkelsey6]

I'm not seeing any pics and yes you can disassemble your ZT. They discourage it if you do not know what you are doing but it will not void the warranty like some other brands.


Edit* Now that I can see the pics personally I would take it apart and see if there is a burr or a missthreaded standoff screw or anything else easily fixable before I started thinking about sending it back but thats just because I hate to have to send new toys away right after I get them.

 

[oregonknifenerd]

I see the pics now are working, but I can't any issues from the pics. I'm not sure exactly what I'm looking for though. I don't see any light between the standoff and the scale indicating the standoffs aren't touching the scale. Maybe something on the Ti side but I think I just see reflected light off the metal. Nor do I see anything that looks like a crack in the liner. There is maybe a little rough bit or tiny wave in the liner I can maybe see if I use my imagination a bit but I don't see anything looking like a crack. I can't see much of anything though. Throw these in MS Paint or Photoshop or GIMP or whatever you have and draw a line pointing to the issue or circle it and then put new pics up that indicate where you see the issue?!?

 

[Reeek]

Try heating the screws up with a soldering station then tightening them

 

[mkelsey6]

I see the pics now are working, but I can't any issues from the pics. I'm not sure exactly what I'm looking for though. I don't see any light between the standoff and the scale indicating the standoffs aren't touching the scale. Maybe something on the Ti side but I think I just see reflected light off the metal. Nor do I see anything that looks like a crack in the liner. There is maybe a little rough bit or tiny wave in the liner I can maybe see if I use my imagination a bit but I don't see anything looking like a crack. I can't see much of anything though. Throw these in MS Paint or Photoshop or GIMP or whatever you have and draw a line pointing to the issue or circle it and then put new pics up that indicate where you see the issue?!?

Its kind of hard to see but if you look at the middle standoff in the top pic you can see its not quite flush, at least thats what it looks like to me

 

[Biginboca]

On the standoff issue, it could be a bur on the standoff or the screws could be too long and touching inside the standoff before the scales are fully seated. I would try removing whatever screws you can and using shorter screws if you have them, or shorten the factory screws a mm using a dremel.

 

[mmike1357]

I had an issue with the pivot screw on my zt 550. Zero Tolerance seems to be using a lot of thread lock, it was slathered in the standoffs of my knife. Heat them up with a hairdryer, that did the trick for me. I would take down the knife and degrease it, as suggested there may be some gunk hindering (ha) a perfect fit and finish. If not it gives you an opportunity to compare the parts, diagnose any problems.

 

[mmike1357]

If the 560 is put together anything like the 550, I was just looking over all 23 parts of my 550. The standoffs have a ridge that sits into a countersink on the frame lock and the liner, quite snugly too. If the knife was assembled without the standoffs fully pressed into the countersinks I could see your situation happening.

 

[Reeek]

I'd send it in - especially if the liner appears cracked - it will come back good as new

 

[hoxhunbe]

Hey guys, just an update. First, thanks for all your advice. Naturally, since it doesn't void the warranty, I elected to disassemble my 561 and see if I could determine what was causing my issues. I took some pics of the process:

By my figuring, the 561 has 23 individual parts (not counting the pivot washers' individual bearings and the blade's lock stops). As you can see, I couldn't get the three G10-side standoff screws to budge at all. I tried the hair dryer method, but until I get access to a real heatgun, these babies are stuck. Here's why:

The threads are just filled with some kind of locking compound, and -- if you're able to zoom in on the above image -- you'll see that this stuff is in there pretty thick. (I probably won't try to get them off again until ZT or Mr. Hinderer release custom scales for the 561.) Props to reeek and mmike for calling it! I was very pleased to see that there were no cracks or visible abberrations in the liner. What I thought I saw before disassembly turned out to be the little cutout "tabs" present in each machined section of the liner.

After removing what thread glue I could, I oiled the pivot area and reassembled the knife. Everything is very easy to take apart and put back together on this model -- All you need is a couple of torx screwdrivers and you're good to go. Here's the knife, clean and fresh and with my standoff gaps almost completely closed. They're still there, but they are acceptably slim now, and once I am able to de-gunk the standoffs from the G10 side, I believe the gaps will shore up 100 percent. I'm thrilled not to have to send my brand new knife in after all!

Here's the reassembled knife from both sides, and a nice video of the flipper action (and a few "thumbstud" openings):

[video=youtube;Dq9aBSLex94]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dq9aBSLex94&sns=em[/video]

If you can't view the embedded video above, you can watch it at this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dq9aBSLex94&sns=em

Thanks again, everyone!

 

[mkelsey6]

Glad to see you got it mostly taken care of. You can get a little hobby soldering iron for next to nothing at a radio shack(think I spent $4 or $5 on mine with half a dozen different tips) or just about anywhere that sells hardware. Just let it heat up and touch it to the standoffs very briefly one at a time and it should be very easy to heat the locktite they use enough to remove the standoffs. Then just clean the gunk off and redo them with a normal amount of locktight.

Not sure where but I know I have seen other people around here commenting on the very liberal use of the locktite(?) on their 0560/1's so someone probably just got a little extra happy with it when they were assembling yours.

 

[hoxhunbe]

Glad to see you got it mostly taken care of. You can get a little hobby soldering iron for next to nothing at a radio shack(think I spent $4 or $5 on mine with half a dozen different tips) or just about anywhere that sells hardware. Just let it heat up and touch it to the standoffs very briefly one at a time and it should be very easy to heat the locktite they use enough to remove the standoffs. Then just clean the gunk off and redo them with a normal amount of locktight.

Not sure where but I know I have seen other people around here commenting on the very liberal use of the locktite(?) on their 0560/1's so someone probably just got a little extra happy with it when they were assembling yours.

Yeah, I think you're right. I will get a soldering iron and/or heat gun hopefully this weekend and see if I can't tighten the knife up just a little more. All this notwithstanding, ZT did a marvellous job with the 560/1, and it's already one of my favorite knives. It feels so solid and light for its size, and it carries really well. Unfortunately, it doesn't make me want a Hinderer XM 18/24 any less, which I was hoping it would. Just gonna have to save up, I suppose...

 

[Brandon M]

All you need to do is screw them in as hard as you can even when it gives resistance trust me this happens everytime I take my ZT apart and that always fixes it