1095 quench medium?

A

Alec Wachtman

Joined
Mar 22, 2018
Messages
32
Hi guys (and girls)! I'm relatively new to knifemaking and I have a question: What is the best medium to quench 1095 in? I've looked around on this forum and others and found that there are multiple different answers. Canola oil and Parks #50 seem to be the most prevalent. Could someone give it to me straight? I thought motor oil would work until I decided to snap some steel....
 
BTW, really sorry if this is answered in another thread already. There just seemed like too many threads to go through.
 
If Parks 50 is unavailable or difficult to come by, canola oil works great.
 
Last edited:
Alec Wachtman said:
Ok, what would the difference in hardness be if I quenched in canola?
Click to expand...
That depends on how you are heating the steel before quenching but you will get a higher as quenched hardness from the parks 50 since it's a shallow Hardening steel.


Just remember it's not the quenchent that will make your 1095 excellent. It's the sum of all parts.

You need more control with how you are heating.

If you can't do that due to lack of equipment just use a different steel.
1080 with a decent heat treatment will SMOKE 1095 with poor heat treatment due to lack of control.




You should ask this question in the "general makers area" you'll find more knowledgeable practical information from those that are making knives all the time.
 
Canola or peanut heated to around 130 F will work just fine for 1095. I've done a dozen knives that way and they've all turned out quite hard. But what are you using to heat your steel? 1095 is picky about temperature.
 
DeadboxHero said:
You need more control with how you are heating.
Click to expand...

No kidding. I forgot to mention that I'm using an Evenheat Kiln with a digital controller, which helps immensely.
 
I'm just heating it in a propane forge :D. I need to build a HT oven soon. For now though, I think I'm going to get some 80CRV2 and a bit of 1084. Stacy E. Apelt recommended both.
 
The people who are saying canola or vegetable oil works perfect for 1095 likely don’t own a hardness tester. Yes it will get it hard, but it won’t get it fully hard. They just don’t cool fast enough. 1095 really should have parks 50. You are better off hitting 65 out of the quench, and tempering to 60 rather than hitting 61 and trying to temper down to 60. Additionally, if you don’t hit full hardness, tempering temp charts won’t be accurate because they are based on max hardness.
 
Grayzer86 said:
The people who are saying canola or vegetable oil works perfect for 1095 likely don’t own a hardness tester. Yes it will get it hard, but it won’t get it fully hard. They just don’t cool fast enough. 1095 really should have parks 50. You are better off hitting 65 out of the quench, and tempering to 60 rather than hitting 61 and trying to temper down to 60. Additionally, if you don’t hit full hardness, tempering temp charts won’t be accurate because they are based on max hardness.
Click to expand...
Good point! I'll definitely take that into consideration.
 
Grayzer86 said:
The people who are saying canola or vegetable oil works perfect for 1095 likely don’t own a hardness tester. Yes it will get it hard, but it won’t get it fully hard. They just don’t cool fast enough. 1095 really should have parks 50. You are better off hitting 65 out of the quench, and tempering to 60 rather than hitting 61 and trying to temper down to 60. Additionally, if you don’t hit full hardness, tempering temp charts won’t be accurate because they are based on max hardness.
Click to expand...

Most people quenching in parks 50 also don’t own hardness testers. There’s a BF thread in the knife making section where they measured some canola quenched 1095 and reported 63-64 Rc out of the quench on 3/16th stock.

I would not be surprised if small, thin blades fully harden if heated to correct temperature in the first place.
 
Alec Wachtman said:
I'm just heating it in a propane forge :D. I need to build a HT oven soon. For now though, I think I'm going to get some 80CRV2 and a bit of 1084. Stacy E. Apelt recommended both.
Click to expand...

Yeah, 1095 in a non-temp-controlled forge is going to be all over the place. Honestly I wouldn’t bother, just send it out for HT.
 
zhyla said:
Most people quenching in parks 50 also don’t own hardness testers. There’s a BF thread in the knife making section where they measured some canola quenched 1095 and reported 63-64 Rc out of the quench on 3/16th stock.

I would not be surprised if small, thin blades fully harden if heated to correct temperature in the first place.
Click to expand...
Should harden well if it's under 1/4" with Canola, but it's not ideal. A purpose engineered oil will always be better and worth the extra cost. It's not like you only use it once or twice. Canola oil is cheap, but it won't last long.
 
zhyla said:
Most people quenching in parks 50 also don’t own hardness testers. There’s a BF thread in the knife making section where they measured some canola quenched 1095 and reported 63-64 Rc out of the quench on 3/16th stock.

I would not be surprised if small, thin blades fully harden if heated to correct temperature in the first place.
Click to expand...

I don’t own a hardness tester either, but I send samples from my batches to people who do so that I know what’s going on with my results. What I’m saying is it probably skates a file but may not be getting the most hardness or performance out of the steel. I have done fillets and hunters in 1095 with canola and not had problems. My point is that it’s not ideal, and relies on several factors not just the oil. Lots of steels will harden in canola, but it can be hit or miss and relies heavily on not just temp control of the kiln, but also on the temp of canola oil. Canola oil outside ideal temp range can give varying results, where a commercial quenchant typically works within a much wider temp range. A lot of this depends on the intended end user. There is nothing wrong with using canola oil for knives for OP and his buddies, but when it comes down to selling a knife with your name on it, it’s just not a variable I am willing to deal with. I feel like I owe it to those who buy my knives to give them the absolute best knife I can. Limiting variables or potential sources of error in that situation is important to what I do.
 
Grayzer86 said:
I don’t own a hardness tester either, but I send samples from my batches to people who do so that I know what’s going on with my results. What I’m saying is it probably skates a file but may not be getting the most hardness or performance out of the steel. I have done fillets and hunters in 1095 with canola and not had problems. My point is that it’s not ideal, and relies on several factors not just the oil. Lots of steels will harden in canola, but it can be hit or miss and relies heavily on not just temp control of the kiln, but also on the temp of canola oil. Canola oil outside ideal temp range can give varying results, where a commercial quenchant typically works within a much wider temp range. A lot of this depends on the intended end user. There is nothing wrong with using canola oil for knives for OP and his buddies, but when it comes down to selling a knife with your name on it, it’s just not a variable I am willing to deal with. I feel like I owe it to those who buy my knives to give them the absolute best knife I can. Limiting variables or potential sources of error in that situation is important to what I do.
Click to expand...
Well stated Sir.
 
Grayzer86 said:
The people who are saying canola or vegetable oil works perfect for 1095 likely don’t own a hardness tester. Yes it will get it hard, but it won’t get it fully hard. They just don’t cool fast enough. 1095 really should have parks 50. You are better off hitting 65 out of the quench, and tempering to 60 rather than hitting 61 and trying to temper down to 60. Additionally, if you don’t hit full hardness, tempering temp charts won’t be accurate because they are based on max hardness.
Click to expand...
well said you are exactly right.
 
i made a fillet knife from 80crv2 today. i held it at about 1550 for about 6 min. quenched in 11sec oil tempered it twice for 1.5 hours each at 385. i hacked a 2x2 into then hacked it into a oak board 50 wacks lol. then i beat chunks of deer antler off all along the whole edge of the blade.
i think all that done was hone it a little. its flexible and tough as nails. i didn't have any nails in the shop or i was going to cut one into with it. after all that the edge is still perfect. it cuts paper like a razor. i don't imagine 100 pan fish will dull it at all.
 
crank78 said:
i made a fillet knife from 80crv2 today. i held it at about 1550 for about 6 min. quenched in 11sec oil tempered it twice for 1.5 hours each at 385. i hacked a 2x2 into then hacked it into a oak board 50 wacks lol. then i beat chunks of deer antler off all along the whole edge of the blade.
i think all that done was hone it a little. its flexible and tough as nails. i didn't have any nails in the shop or i was going to cut one into with it. after all that the edge is still perfect. it cuts paper like a razor. i don't imagine 100 pan fish will dull it at all.
Click to expand...
Wait, 80CRV2 requires a soak time? Is that necessary? I know that there are threads on here that debate the necessity of soaking a blade.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top