2004 Model Survey

Sal Glesser

Sal Glesser

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2004 Model Survey

Well it’s that time of the year again when we have to make our decisions regarding which models will be carried for 2004 and which will be discontinued. In order to make room for the new designs, older designs must be disco’d. As in the past, getting opinions from dealers, distributors and ELUs (End Line Users) is helpful in our decision making process. The new designs for 2003 that are not yet out have not been listed as they will be carried into 2004 unless there is a severe glitch. Would you be so kind as to indicate your opinions on the models listed below. Thank you in advance.

sal

SPYDERCO KNIVES

Item # Description Discontinue For 2004
C07S Police Stainless
C07P Police Stainless
C08S Harpy Stainless
C08SBK Merlin FRN
C10P Endura Stainless
C10PS Endura Stainless
C10S Endura Stainless
C10PBK Endura FRN
C10PSBK Endura FRN
C10SBK Endura FRN
C10TR Endura Trainer
C11P Delica Stainless
C11PS Delica Stainless
C11S Delica Stainless
C11PBK Delica FRN
C11PSBK Delica FRN
C11SBK Delica FRN
C11TR Delica Trainer
C12GS Civilian G-10
C12SBK Matriarch
C13PS ProGrip Stainless
C13PSBK ProGrip FRN
C14SBK Rescue 93mm Black
C14SBL Rescue 93mm Blue
C14SOR Rescue 93mm Orange
C17PSBK Catcherman
C28P Dragonfly Stainless
C28S Dragonfly Stainless
C28PBK Dragonfly FRN
C28SBK Dragonfly FRN
C29P Cricket Stainless
C29S Cricket Stainless
C29PBK Cricket FRN
C29SBK Cricket FRN
C36GPE Military CPM-S30V
C36GPSE Military CPM-S30V
C36GSE Military CPM-S30V
C41PS Native Stainless
C41PBK Native FRN
C41PSBK Native FRN
C45SBK Rescue 79mm Black
C45SBL Rescue 79mm Blue
C45SOR Rescue 79mm Orange
C46GPBK Bob Lum Tanto – Black Blade
C46GPSBK Bob Lum Tanto – Black Blade
C63GP James Keating Chinook II
C63GPS James Keating Chinook II
C64JPBK MeerKat
C64JSBK MeerKat
C64PBK2 MeerKat – Reverse S
C64SBK2 MeerKat – Reverse S
C65P Lum Chinese Folder
C66PBK Frank Centofante Vesuvius II
C66PSBK Frank Centofante Vesuvius II
C68GPS Bram Frank Gunting
C68TR Bram Frank Gunting Trainer
C69GP Lil’ Temperance Leaf
C69GS Lil’ Temperance Leaf
C69GP2 Lil’ Temperance Trailing Point
C69GS2 Lil’ Temperance Trailing Point
C71PTI Salsa – Titanium
C71PSTI Salsa – Titanium
C71BLP Salsa – Blue
C71BLPS Salsa – Blue
C71CBP Salsa – Cranberry
C71CBPS Salsa – Cranberry
C72P Pride
C73GP Impala with Guthook
C73GPS Impala with Guthook
C73GPS2 Impala
C75P Kiwi
C77SBK SpyderHawk

JBKP Jester – Black
JBKS Jester – Black
JGRP Jester – Lime Green
JGRS Jester – Lime Green
LBK Ladybug – Black
LBL Ladybug – Blue
LRD Ladybug - Red

FB01 Bill Moran Featherweight
FB02 Bill Moran Drop Point
FB03 Bob Lum Tanto
FB04 Fred Perrin
FB05P Temperance
FB05S Temperance
FB05TR Temperance Trainer
FB09P Ronin

T01P SpydeRench
T01PS SpydeRench
T01S SpydeRench
T02S SpyderSaw

K04SBK Utility Knife – Black
K05SBK Small Utility Knife – Black
K05SRD Small Utility Knife – Red
K08P Santoku
K09P Paring Knife

We Welcome Your Comments and Suggestions:
 
I would suggest eliminating this:

C12SBK Matriarch

As it has been made redundant by the Spyderhawk which has both utility and defensive applications.

If the Trakk'r is expected to materialize,then I would eliminate these two:

C13PS ProGrip Stainless
C13PSBK ProGrip FRN

I would wait on market acceptance of the Assists and D'Allara rescues before deciding the fate of these:

C14SBK Rescue 93mm Black
C14SBL Rescue 93mm Blue
C14SOR Rescue 93mm Orange

Keep them in "abeyance" for now. But ultimately the large FRN rescue knife is over-respresented within the lineup IMO, and should be narrowed to one or two base models (with additional variants). If the Assist succeeds I would suggest also replacing the Rescue 79mm with an "Assist III" with 60mm blade.

Between the Cricket, Meerkat, and Salsa lineups, these now seem a bit outdated and perhaps ready for retirement:

C28P Dragonfly Stainless
C28S Dragonfly Stainless
C28PBK Dragonfly FRN
C28SBK Dragonfly FRN


I would cull one of the blade types for the Meerkat. The reverse-s is so shallow that I don't find much of a functional difference between the two. Having two blade types is unnecessary SKUs.

C64JPBK MeerKat
C64JSBK MeerKat

or

C64PBK2 MeerKat – Reverse S
C64SBK2 MeerKat – Reverse S

I think the Jester is a worthy successor to the original, which can be honorably retired:

LBK Ladybug – Black
LBL Ladybug – Blue
LRD Ladybug - Red
 
After seeing pictures of the Assist models and reading some recent threads on them, I can see that they were designed specifically for what you call the SAS market. IMHO, the Rescue models have broader applicability beyond this market and make great general utility knives. So, I would like to see both the Rescue and Assist preserved. If you need to reduce the number of models, I would suggest keeping the Assists and reducing the Rescue models to one. Maybe something like the Rescue Jr, but with a 2 7/8" blade with a small plain edge tip, like the current full-size Rescues.
 
My thoughts parallel those of Carlos in regard to the Matriarch and the Rescue series.

Not sure how sales of the Ti Salsa have fared, but I would consider this as a possible candidate for D/C considering the value offered by the Alum Salsa.

I see SS Enduras & Delicas in all 3 edge configs. You MAY wish to keep the best-selling 2 configurations in each style. (Like in the Police line)
 
You guys kill models like I do. Not good enough, that's why we need opinions. We need to knock out 25-35% in order to make room for the new models coming out now and for the next 12 months. The reasoning behind your choices are also helpful.

sal
 
Sal...If Spyderco DC's any of the Police, Endura, or Delica models, I'm going to start looking for a very tall building to toss myself off of!.:(.
 
IMHO, Spyderco makes tactical knives. Everyone's opinion as to what tactical means is different and keeps expanding. If one keeps to the tactical format, as a lot of the newly introduced Spydies seem to be, many of the knives listed could be discontinued. For instance:
The Ladybug and Jester line serves a limited purpose today. Too much emphasis on metal detectors and security to keep one on a key chain.
The smaller Rescue knives seem to have been updated, both by the 93 version and the upcoming Assist.
The Progrip series is dated.
The old model Native should be replaced, not kept in addition to the new model.
The Salsa's, although great knives, should be scaled back, maybe to just the Titanium model.
The Meerkat seems repetitive.
Eliminate the kitchen knives. I love them, but, the market is saturated.
The Civilian and Matriarch are redundant. I personally carry the Matriarch, but, one of the two could be eliminated.
I like the idea of several models sharing the same handle as in the Endura, Matriarch and Spyderhawk. Makes sheathing easier.
The Dragonfly could go, I guess. For a knife that small, others are more useful.
The Pride was a great idea, but I'm not sure it caught on the way it should have.
The Catcherman, well, it has a niche.

All that said, my favorites are the Police, any model, the Matriarch, Lil'Temperance, the Ronin, the Harpy/Spyderhawk, Cricket, Endura, Salsa, and the Military. But I'm probably not a good example as I already own all of them, most in triplicate, as well as many, many others.

And all of that is just my opinion. I've been carrying a Bali-song lately as it's something to play with when I'm not cutting something. Might be a good idea.

Ken
 
I have to say I don't have any Spyderco
pocket knives at the moment,
So as someone out side of the normal
spyderFan group on BF.

Here are the models that I'm interested in.

C29P Cricket Stainless

C45SBK Rescue 79mm Black
C45SBL Rescue 79mm Blue
C45SOR Rescue 79mm Orange
C65P Lum Chinese Folder
C68GPS Bram Frank Gunting
C68TR Bram Frank Gunting Trainer
C72P Pride
 
I think the Dragonfly should definately be kept.
All the others being put forward as replacements (Crickets and Meerkats), are all hollow ground, whereas the Dragonfly if flat ground.
If you were going to cull some knives in the small knife range I would prefer to keep one flat ground and one hollow ground in each size.

I'm going to have to take some soap and water to Hawkbill's mouth in a minute. Don't even THINK of D/C'ing the Ti-Salsa. Not only is this one of the best knives Spyderco have released in recient years, I would say of the recient crop it is probably the one that has recieved most respect from non-Spyderco fanatics who are impressed with it's high quality materials and intergral lock. If anything I would say it's blade steel should be upgraded to S30v in order to improve it's standing with other knife knuts even more.

I do think the reverse-S Meerkat could go. We have the small Cricket, and we are getting the larger Dodo, whereas the Meerkat is just a slight size variation in the middle. Plus I'm not a great fan of the phantom lock ( not so easy to close one handed).

As much as I really like the Ladybug, I would have to admit the Jester is better. Although I would like to see the Micarta Jester made into a full production model, there's almost a complete shortage of good quality, high class key chain knives like the M/J out there.

Until it's issues with the compression lock are sorted (more thumb room needed), I would nix the Vesuvious. A great knife in all other respects (I'd even by another if thumb problem fixed), but at the momment it gives the compression lock a bad name.

I can't think of any other particular knives to add to the D/C list, but my general feallings are :
Sub 2.5" knives (with the exception of the Cricket), don't really need serrations.
As stated I'm not a great fan of the Phantom lock, it's the hardest to close one handed.
I'm not a fan of small Reverse-S blades, with again the exception of the Cricket. On the other hand I would like to see a 3.5"+ Spyderco knife with a traditional (subtle) recurve blade.
Spyderco are IMHO about the best in the industry when it comes to full flat ground blades, but there seem to be less and less in Spyderco's line up. I say keep all the ones we have, and seriously think about adding some more. Come on Sal, you know you really want to :D

BTW - Thanks for asking / listening :)
 
Please leave the Endura/Delica in production. There aren't enough ambi knives out there as it is for us southpaws. The Delica has been a constant companion for years. He about to get a couple of brothers. A blue one and one thats black one. He's hollow ground so I need to get a flat one. :)
 
If the 'fly gets discon'ed, I'll have to buy up most of the ones out there. This model is too great to get rid of. Maybe even bring out a lefty version for us ambi and southpaws.

my post on the home forum is model by model.
 
I'd keep the FRN Delica and Endura models. I've bought several of each over the years, and I think they're still the pinnacle of lightweight one-handed knives.

Regards,
Clay
 
Okay, I targeted 15 in my first post, but if you want at least 30%, I'll have to kill off another 15 here.

I wouldn't mess with anything in the "Classic" lineup (C07 - C12). Unless sales are poor on any specific variant. These are the bread-and-butter which define the rest of the collection.


Allow the Native III to replace the Native, thus freeing up some production capacity at Golden:

41PBK Native FRN
C41PSBK Native FRN


I suspect this model has seen its day, unless you really want to keep as a "save and serve:"

C46GPBK Bob Lum Tanto – Black Blade
C46GPSBK Bob Lum Tanto – Black Blade


I would (painfully) suggest streamlining Lil' Temperance production and sales by eliminating one of the blade variants, probably the trailing point. The leaf appears to be in the heaviest demand. The original trailing point design could be brought back in the future in a full-size Temperance folder - which would probably suit the blade design better than the Jr. model does:

C69GP2 Lil’ Temperance Trailing Point
C69GS2 Lil’ Temperance Trailing Point



Reduce the aluminum Salsa to a single colour, by eliminating these:

C71CBP Salsa – Cranberry
C71CBPS Salsa – Cranberry



I don't know what the sales is on these, but I have a feel that the Ronin is the new 3" FB darling:

FB01 Bill Moran Featherweight
FB02 Bill Moran Drop Point


I would bring the Kitchen knife series to a close. I think this is a segment you either go after completely, or just leave alone. As it is, there aren't enough Kitchen models to make a complete kit, and the dominance of Wustoff and Henckels more or less means you are fighting for the market share scraps. And neither does there seem to be much of a market here for high end kitchen knives as there is in Japan. I'd just leave this niche alone.

K04SBK Utility Knife – Black
K05SBK Small Utility Knife – Black
K05SRD Small Utility Knife – Red
K08P Santoku
K09P Paring Knife
 
All the others being put forward as replacements (Crickets and Meerkats), are all hollow ground, whereas the Dragonfly if flat ground.
Click to expand...

The Salsa is flat ground.
 
Hi Carlos
"The Salsa is flat ground." - Yeah I know, but you can't have too many flat grinds :D

On the Bill Moran's vrs Ronin, I think that they are too different to be interchangable.
Yep, the Ronin is at the momment probably the better seller (keep meaning to pick one up myself), but it probably wouldn't make a good skinning knife like the Moran, too many pointy bits.
Although the Ronin is probably the current "FB darling" at the moment, I have a feeling the Moran's have better staying power sales wise.
 
Sal - I tried to be objective - but since you wanted opinions, I going to be more selfish this time than I usually would try to be.


(I never have like the Endura or Delica stainless models - they just seem very redunant to me at this point. There are too many nice Ti scale models out and about. If this is a price point thing - well, that's the way it is)

C10P Endura Stainless
C10PS Endura Stainless
C10S Endura Stainless
C11P Delica Stainless
C11PS Delica Stainless
C11S Delica Stainless

(Never understood the Matriach model in the first place)
C12SBK Matriarch

(Dated design - especially if the Trakkr' comes on line)
C13PS ProGrip Stainless
C13PSBK ProGrip FRN

(Never liked the FRN version, plus the SS model is an improvement in so many ways)
C29PBK Cricket FRN
C29SBK Cricket FRN

(The FRN Native is a better design)
C41PS Native Stainless

(Don't need any black blades per se. I would rather see Spyderco offer the Military or Paramilitary with black blades instead. Plus, I just never liked the ergo's on this model.)
C46GPBK Bob Lum Tanto – Black Blade
C46GPSBK Bob Lum Tanto – Black Blade

(MeerKats never appealed to me)
C64PBK2 MeerKat – Reverse S
C64SBK2 MeerKat – Reverse S

(FRN handle on this one just kills the design. The blade begs for something better. I wish Spyderco would push this as a high-end design)
C66PBK Frank Centofante Vesuvius II
C66PSBK Frank Centofante Vesuvius II

(Can anyone really carry this in their pocket? Just make a longer Ti Salsa and dump this model)
C69GP Lil’ Temperance Leaf
C69GS Lil’ Temperance Leaf
C69GP2 Lil’ Temperance Trailing Point
C69GS2 Lil’ Temperance Trailing Point

(Don't like no Aluminum knives - but the Blue seems to be a good seller)
C71CBP Salsa – Cranberry
C71CBPS Salsa – Cranberry

(Yike!)
C72P Pride

(Partially serrated seems redundant)
C73GPS Impala with Guthook
 
Looking forward to the ATR, and the Para-Military (mythical?).

These I find most useful, therefore desireable:
  • Police
  • Military
  • Native
  • Rescue
I would like to see:
  • SS Police with a black coated handle. Not a coated blade, just a handle and clip that does not stand out as much against dark clothing.
  • The same goes for the SS Native.
  • A Military, with either a steel handle, or steel lined G-10 scales on BOTH sides, and something other than a liner lock.
  • G-10 Native, Spyderhawk
  • A darker blue FRN 93mm Rescue. Perhaps in "Cop Uniform Blue, Deputy Uniform Green, and Fire/Rescue Black".
See a pattern here?
 
Okay. I'm lacking access to sales figures, which might change my opinions, but the following are the ones I'd cut and why:

C07S Police Stainless
C07P Police Stainless

I just see very little reason to have a model with a 4+ inch blade, unless it's a mega-folder. The blade length on the police always seemed too big to appeal to the general market and too small to appeal to the big knife market.

C12SBK Matriarch

Superceded by the Spyderhawk.

C14SBL Rescue 93mm Blue

Black and orange is good enough. Or, if the blue sells real well, lose whichever of the three doesn't sell as well as the other two.

C45SBL Rescue 79mm Blue

Ditto above.

LBK Ladybug – Black
LBL Ladybug – Blue
LRD Ladybug - Red

Like whoever above said, I don't think there's really a need for two keychain sized knives.

Speaking of which, I'd kill at least a couple of the non-kitchen fixed blades. They all seem to fill mostly the same niche to me.

T01P SpydeRench
T01PS SpydeRench
T01S SpydeRench

Either lose the PS or lose the other two. I don't think people are going to say "Wow, I don't want the Spyderrench because it doesn't come in PS." It's a multitool, the blade steel is more of its selling point than the blade configuration. I would assume anyway.

K05SBK Small Utility Knife – Black
K05SRD Small Utility Knife – Red

It's a kitchen knife. Again, just lose whichever sells worth.
 
It's easier to list the keepers:
Delica FRN
Endura FRN
Native FRN (the latest incarnation)
Cricket (all configurations, especially the SS)
Merlin
SpyderHawk
Salsa (Ti and one color aluminum)

More Ti models sure would be nice.:D
A spear point Cricket would be great.:cool:

Paul
 
I would lose the following based on my own preferences which probably have an inverse relation to the sales figures:

Native SS
Endura SS
Delica SS (what can I say? I'm not a fan of SS or AUS6)
ProGrip SS and FRN (not filling a unique function in the lineup)
Matriarch (overlapped by other models, probably not great sales #s))
Ladybug (jester is a worthy replacement)
any and all trainer models (thay are handy but how much do they really sell?)
Impala (again, it's too specialised and yet not really unique enough to keep)
Titanium Salsa (it's a neat knife, but too novelty for such a serious variant)
Catcherman (too specialized)
Gunting (too specialized)
cull the rescue lineup somewhat
take out the reverse-s meerkat
all the kitchen knives (for reasons eloquently stated above)

Take what you have to, but just get that paramilitary made!! :D
 
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