2x72 Tilt Grinder Project (pics)

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I'm an aspiring knife maker. I've made many knife like objects, even some planer and shear blades, but no full knives as of yet. I have enough free time lately that I decided to just take the plunge. I fell in love with the 2x72 class of machines as soon as I saw them. I've been doing metalworking and related crafts for some time, and wish I'd gotten on the 2x72 bandwagon sooner. They're ideal machines for knifemaking, and incredibly flexible and useful for other custom work as well.

I've been doing some heavy duty lurking and looking at 2x72 designs, old, new, and homebrew. I can't say I'm really trying to reinvent the wheel, more just try to fill in all the checkboxes for my personal machine. I'm also on a budget, and I have access to adequate tools and equipment for the build, plus I just love building stuff like this. I was hoping that in addition to sharing my progress so far, I could maybe get a bit of advice regarding belts, and also any experiences with rubber coated drive/idler wheels. I'm wondering, do they make a significant difference in overall noise or feel?

So far I've picked up a couple grits of ceramic(blaze) belts, and a couple grits of aluminum oxide belts. I got a red scotchbrite belt, but it seems a bit rough for finishing, so I may need to see if I can exchange it before I use it.


This is a wireframe of the main components, at least the main components that are made from 1/4" mild steel sheet. The other pieces (some flat bar parts, tooling arms, idler arm) are not shown. I'm still finalizing some of that. I'm going to be using drilled and tapped 0.5"x1.5" bar for the crosspieces, both on the two tool arm sockets and the idler support arm socket. The arms will be .250 wall 1.5" square tubing. I designed a self contained idler/alignment wheel support arm, the tension spring will be hidden inside the arm tube, and the idler arm will pass over the top of it. You will be able to change the idler height, so you can change the overall geometry of the belt as needed.
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I went to a good friend's house today and made use of his plasma table. Considering how little work we did dialing everything in, I was happy with the results. There were some cosmetics issues here and there, but nothing that can't be massaged out. I decided to just drill the small holes on the mill, as plasma can be pretty iffy with smaller holes, even if using fine-cut consumables and spending some tuning time. I probably would have used laser or water if it was in the budget, but this is more than sufficient for my current needs.
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This is a little mockup I did, just to get a feel for everything with the motor in place. I'm pretty happy with it. It looks like everything will line up nicely. The line of holes along the bottom is for the tilt mechanism. It will be a heavy duty piano hinge, and the side shown will have two spring loaded draw latches for the vertical position, while the horizontal position will rely on rubber stops.
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Here's the current family photo. I'm still waiting on some parts and materials, notably the material for the idler and drive wheels, as well as the step pulleys, shaft material, and some fasteners/odds and ends. I got the motor from my old boss, it's a single phase 1hp/1750rpm take-off from a very nice Delta drill press that was refitted with a DC motor and speed control. I wish I could justify a variable speed setup right now, as I'm a huge fan, I've had variable speed on almost every machine I've used in the past years, and I love it. I'll just have to live with the 3-speed step pulley setup for now.
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As soon as I finish the drawings showing the idler arm assembly and the rest of the parts that weren't plasma cut, I'll update the 3D drawing at the top of the post. I am hoping to have the rest of my stuff in by the end of the week, so I may even be spinning belts by this coming weekend. :thumbup:
 
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Great job. Its great to realize that you want something else and make it your own. Good luck. Keep us posted.
 
I built my own 2x72, and have been using it for a couple of months. Yours looks really good. I dunno if you are already doing it this way, or still early enough in the process to add this to your hidden tensioner, but I put a pneumatic piston on the tensioner arm, and am really happy with how it works. Same tension over the full stroke of the piston rod for slightly stretched belts, and fast belt changes. I like all the curves in your side plates, those finished up nice.
 
Very interesting project here...............

I'm looking forward to more.

Syn
 
Thanks for the replies everyone!

I'm getting the last of my parts in by Friday (if the shipping gods allow), so I hope to be spinning belts this weekend, and will be sure to add more pictures. :)

I built my own 2x72, and have been using it for a couple of months. Yours looks really good. I dunno if you are already doing it this way, or still early enough in the process to add this to your hidden tensioner, but I put a pneumatic piston on the tensioner arm, and am really happy with how it works. Same tension over the full stroke of the piston rod for slightly stretched belts, and fast belt changes. I like all the curves in your side plates, those finished up nice.

I definitely considered that. I actually discussed a Dozier-like pneumatic tensioner with one of the guys down at the HT place. I actually came up with the idea before realizing someone had beat me to the punch by quite a few years. I like the use of an air cylinder and regulator because you can easily vary the tension, and also have a readout (in the form of a pressure gauge) of the belt's current tension.

The pneumatic spring also is a great option, because as you said it is probably able to deliver more consistent results than a standard compression spring.

For right now, I already have a couple suitable springs, but I may just jump on the air cylinder idea anyways.

Do you recall what the force was on the pneumatic spring you're using?

I'm probably going to handle the tension arm design tonight, so I'll update this post with the drawing most likely tonight.
 
I usually run about 40psi, or 50psi if I want a tight slack belt. You can see in the photo, it isn't pushing at an exact 90 degrees to the arm, and the angle changes as it extends, so some of the force is going to the hinge joint. I'm running a 1-1/16" bore air cylinder (about $35 bucks from McMaster) that is about 0.8 sq-inches, so it is pushing around 30 lbs of force at 40 psi. The hinges are all made from 1" OD tubing with 1/4" walls, swinging on grade-5 1/2" fasteners. I added a photo of my tracking adjuster in case you are still in the design phase in that. I'm pretty proud of this machine. It hums with that 2HP 220v motor, and plucks a musical note on the belt when you cut on that air cylinder.


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I usually run about 40psi, or 50psi if I want a tight slack belt. You can see in the photo, it isn't pushing at an exact 90 degrees to the arm, and the angle changes as it extends, so some of the force is going to the hinge joint. I'm running a 1-1/16" bore air cylinder (about $35 bucks from McMaster) that is about 0.8 sq-inches, so it is pushing around 30 lbs of force at 40 psi. The hinges are all made from 1" OD tubing with 1/4" walls, swinging on grade-5 1/2" fasteners. I added a photo of my tracking adjuster in case you are still in the design phase in that. I'm pretty proud of this machine. It hums with that 2HP 220v motor, and plucks a musical note on the belt when you cut on that air cylinder.[/IMG]

I didn't realize you were using an actual air actuator, I've seen some others using the air springs like you see on camper shells. The actuator was what I was planning on using, as it's great to be able to vary the belt tension with a simple knob turn. I will probably go traditional spring to start and then add the air tensioner on a future order (trying to keep budget under control).
 
Looks really nice. Clean too.

I noticed the flange bearings. What size wheel shafts do you typically use on grinders? 1/2? 3/4?
 
5/8" is a very common electric motor drive shaft size, but 1/2" and 3/4" are also common. It depends on horsepower, configuration, etc.

My particular 1hp motor has a 3/4" output shaft. My drive wheel shaft will be 5/8", as well as the 10" Contact wheel shaft. The idler/alignment wheel will be 1/2".



On another note, I just found out that all of my parts should be here tomorrow! I will have a running grinder this weekend (knock on wood, of course).

Hopefully soon I'll have some more impressive pics than a bunch of random grinder parts laying around. :)
 
I got my second to last order in today, but I'm still missing my hinge and latches (for the tilt mechanism). I also got the knobs (for clamping the tooling/idler arms in place), key stock, pulleys, steel bar for the crosspieces, shaft material, the 6061 billets for the drive and idler wheels, and the shoulder screws and oilite bronze bushings for the tension arm mechanism (probably overkill, but they're cheap and cool :)).

Of course, I forgot the drive belt. Luckily pops has a couple adjustable length belts at his shop to get me going until I have another supply order I can piggyback one on.
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The only real work I did today was boring the idler arm support brackets to 5/8" to accept the bushings for the idler arm pivots (1/2" shoulder screws). It's the first time I've used the my adjustable boring head on my small mill, and it worked quite nicely. It's kind of exciting to be doing real(ish) machining out of my own garage. :)
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I probably won't be able to finish this weekend, but Monday will be a big day. I'm going to borrow the big lathe at a friend's shop to hog out the idler and drive wheels, and while I'm over there I'm going to bore the 10" contact wheel for bearings. I also need to chop up the steel bar into all of the crosspieces plus drill/tap them, and machine some 3/8"-16 steel nuts to weld on to the side plate for the locking knobs.

I hope to have the final test assembly done Monday, but I need all day Tuesday to build the stand, which will be 2" Square tubing. This grinder is designed to be integral with the stand, they detach, but it is somewhat required to have a purpose built stand/table for the tilt functionality. It's not impossible to do without, of course, but I didn't see any purpose in coming up with a universal bracket for this particular unit when I was planning on mounting it on a stand anyways.
 
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I'm excited about this build.
Doing your own design and machine work really got my interest plus your presentation is top notch.

Mark
 
Very nice build! I see alot of care and quality and thought going into it, so I gotta bust your chops about using pot metal/aluminum pullies instead of cast iron! :D
 
The hinges are all made from 1" OD tubing with 1/4" walls, swinging on grade-5 1/2" fasteners. I added a photo of my tracking adjuster in case you are still in the design phase in that.

I forgot to comment on this before. It looks like a robust mechanism. I am kind of putting off designing mine, but I really need to have it done by tomorrow night. I want to try and have it be sturdy yet compact, not quite sure what angle I'm going to take at the moment. (edit: I think I came up with an idea, will possibly update this post later if it isn't stupid)


I'm excited about this build.
Doing your own design and machine work really got my interest plus your presentation is top notch.

Mark

Thanks!

I love doing stuff like this, I wish I had the budget/time to allow me to do it more. Right now it's way too easy to get lost in some new aspect of my contraption and forget that I'm trying to make knives! :D


Very nice build! I see alot of care and quality and thought going into it, so I gotta bust your chops about using pot metal/aluminum pullies instead of cast iron! :D

I know, I know, figured someone would razz me for it. :p

They were the only ones McMaster had, and I already was ordering from them, so I had to go with the budget conscious option. I do plan to upgrade to cast iron in the future, but I also will eventually go variable speed so I may just order everything at the same time. I did some hand dressing on them and had to tweak one a little, but they will (hopefully) be passable for now.

Plus I'm always building weird crap in my garage, and I have a spare 1/3hp motor I can use the pulleys for later on some other project. I might make a micro KMG with a 1/2" belt. ;)

Looking good.

I'd be interested in seeing photos of the wheels getting made.

I'll snap a few pics for you while I'm making them.
 
Man you are inspiring me to make my own grinder, I work at a welding slash Machine shop, so it could be done! Looking good so far, I can't wait to see how the thing runs.
 
I didn't get any of the stuff I planned on done today, but I did get the stand built, and the hinge and latches came in as well (for the tilt mechanism). I still need to mount the casters. I have a solid day of machining tomorrow though, so hopefully I can finally spin a belt.
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I assume your 10" contact wheel is the one from Grizzly. Let us know how it works out once you add the bearings. I am in the midst of my own grinder build (not nearly as nice- based on the No Weld Grinder), and while I expect to do most of my work on the platen, for about $80 and a little work, I may want to try the same.
 
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