3 Mineral County school administrators arrested

Munk: there is actually very good book (fiction) by Robert Merle "Protected men". He had predicted some of things you have described. i.e. alienation of men to women and kids

I think he wrote it in the middle of 70th and I believe that it was under impression of millitant feminism, but its very actual today as it was when it come out.
 
Good job munk and hawkwind...your discussion went right up to the edge of dangerous ground and then you both respectfully stepped back. Both of you...dinner's on me. That's the kind of responsible adult behavior this place needs!

Bully! Bravo! Well done!


Ben - you can now resume leering at the pretty young girls...(save a spot for me)

.
 
I like conversations, and I like them better when everyone wins. We have a lot of new folks on the forum, and they seem to be top notch. Hawkwind wanted to be honest, but was cautious lest he offend.

Hawkwind, it would be very hard for me to read a book on sociology or cultural theory- I feel as if I've lived enough of it.


I hate to say this, because it's so silly, but Science Fiction predicted the 'outside male'. The rogue male, I guess, the untrustworthy and animal male.

And I don't like giving Harlan Ellison too much credit, but he pegged it with, A Boy and His Dog.

munk
 
munk said:
...A Boy and His Dog...
Click to expand...
We were listening to KZAP, our favorite underground rock station when they announced that there was a free movie at the Arden Mall so a bunch of us went over there.

A guy came out on stage and said he was the producer of the movie and this was a test showing. He said he was really proud of the movie which starred a new young actor who he thought had a bright future. He thanked us for coming, told us to enjoy the movie, and said that he would appreciate it if we would fill out the questionnaires that we got when we came in.

The movie was "A Boy and His Dog". We all know where Don Johnson's career would lead. The dog who played Blood, went on to star in the Brady Bunch as Tiger.
 
Poor Blood, he took quite a hit in his career.

Of controversy and 'flaming'; It's not the vulnerability and potential hurt that is to be avoided, it is the outcome and positive direction that must be insisted upon by responsible heads.

munk
 
Hard question. Society concerning sexual abuse, I mean. Personally, I've never driven around in a white van handing out candy. :) Nevertheless, images of Michael Jackson's Neverland Ranch aren't far from one's mind.

There's a problem in society, both in sexual abuse and the way we deal with it.

I certainly don't have the answers. But, then I suppose that's the great thing about America. I get to elect a bunch of idiots, and when they don't solve such problems, I get to gripe and vote again!! :D

And thus, western civilization approaches perfection...

NOT!!

:) :D
 
I think many of our social ills are due to the negative aura that surrounds sexuality as a result of repressive attitudes based in religious dogma.

Instead of a natural union, or an expression of affection, sex becomes taboo, a secret dirty act that instead of pleasure, produces guilt. Instead of an intimate act to be shared, it becomes a tool of manipulation.

No wonder some men are driven to seek children, who represent innocence and purity, as sexual partners.
 
What exactly is "sexual misconduct"?
Is that the same as rape, or what?
It seems rather vague for an arrestable offense.
Dont they have to be very concise when they issue an arrest warrant?

Our society is changing, and sexuality is a part of that change. Some things are getting better, some worse.

20 years ago, many women didnt report rapes because they were stigmatised and blamed for it.
That has changed, thank God.
 
A few comments:

Many people are afraid. So when something bad happens, they ask things like "How can we make sure this never happens again" - then somebody makes a rule. This is a real "somebody" - people look externally for someone that will come in and do something to save them. End result is that rare events end up coloring our perceptions of the world and leaving a tangled web of rules and paranoias to negotiate.

This specific case - a grown man contacting a child - is affected because the child and parents wonder what the man's intentions are - jumping to stories they've heard rather than reading the situation. The man himself questions whether he will be seen as a pedophile, which may curtail his actions.

My personal experience with this: as a teacher (high school) I never touched any of my students. On rare occasions, when I would put my hand on someone's shoulder, or even stand a bit too close, it felt a bit weird. It is a bit disappointing to think that in some situations where a hug would have been very useful and reassuring to the student, I did not feel comfortable with this option.
 
Instead of a natural union, or an expression of affection, sex becomes taboo, a secret dirty act that instead of pleasure, produces guilt. Instead of an intimate act to be shared, it becomes a tool of manipulation.

No wonder some men are driven to seek children, who represent innocence and purity, as sexual partners>>>>>>>> Benaround


The withholding of the 'prize' certainly impacts young men and this society, but men driven to youngsters are not normal and almost always have some real pathology in their own childhoods. I think they are swine for repeating what may have been done to them, but it is to be expected healthy individuals unsuccessful in the mating ritual will not turn to depravity or violence. It is to be insisted upon.

There is no doubt the women's movement proved a majority of women could assume the same dehumanizing clerical positions men endured. Meanwhile, the home was disenfranchised, it's value discarded by a shallow appraisel of what made people and society work. Most work is to be endured because there is a home, not the other way around.

Seeing women feign punches in dance videos, curse like men, and the rising violence and in women's prison populations are indicators of a bad thing.

The goal of a more unisex approach to life was to allow men to be sensitive and women assertive. Instead we have insensitive women behaving like as-ho-e men.

munk
 
I totally agree about the child molesters. Nasty stuff.

The women, though. That's tougher. It's not all the fault of women's lib IMO. I think there's something happening in our society far broader. The youth want to be more "adult" so they drink, do drugs, and have sex younger and younger. Problem is this: they only drink to get drunk, never learning to do so responsibly. They do drugs because it's "cool" and they're not supposed to. They have sex because that's what adults do and they want to feel some sort of affection.

I don't know a clear answer. If adults crack down, it will have little or no affect. The kids will just do it more because they're not supposed to. I think that a lowered drinking age/ emphasis on parental education of kids would help. I also support, to some extent, the libertarian views on some drugs, aka legality. Sex? I dunno. Maybe parents should just grow up themselves, set better examples, and teach that this comes from love, not just lust.

Basically this is my theory: Kids drink and do what they do out of a desire, both to grow up and to do something "adult" that they're not supposed to do. It's intriguing because it's a big deal.

My proposed answer: Make it no big deal. If kids learn to drink responsibly and casually, they'll be less likely to do so irresponsibly and only to get drunk. This will lessen teen automobile death and the incidents of alcohol poinsoning when sheltered kids get to college and suddenly have it available.

I think that, with any societal problem, the solution has to start with the parents and youth. That's where kids become who they will be for the rest of their lives, and thus, how they will raise their kids.

Namaarie
 
W :eek: W

All men are pedophiles, women are becoming obnoxious a$$......men and kids are doing all sorts of evil deeds in the name of wanting to be adults. :grumpy: and wanting to be accepted as being cool.

W :eek: W

From where I stand it's a sad world out there. People have problems and some men are overbearing and abusive....but not all. Some women are obnoxious a$$....men....but not all and some kids rebel and do everything they aren't supposed to......but not all. Unfortunately the only ones that make the news are the pedophile, obnoxious, rebellious ones. Too bad they don't have an entire news channel that did nothing but report on all the good people in the world. Wouldn't that be a refreshing relief to see every night at dinner time and before bed.

As for lowering drinking ages, legalizing drugs,etc. Would it help? Probably not. People will still abuse the stuff and commit acts of disgust while doing it. I speak from experience and also from a broken heart. I'm very sorry that men are so afraid of women because of all you have written. It's very true though. I've heard unbelievable stories from guys this past year and have seen that most of them are scared to death to even talk to one of us. I'm sorry for that. I've also seen how women have been to them first hand and get really ticked at the lousy women making it impossible for the rest of us to even get a decent conversation going. I do, though, also hate it when men treat women and kids like trash and then want them to love them and take them back and the cycle goes on.

A cure for all this........treat everyone like you would like to be treated. Don't lie just to get in the door. Live a life that is honest and full of integrity. Love everyone no matter what their skin color is, body fat content is and even if they have bad breathe. We are not all Sean Connery's or Halie Berry's, but we are all worthy of having someone to love and someone to love back. Respect everyone. What goes around comes around. Karma will find you out.
 
Well said, Mamav. That message about respecting others is important. I still believe what I said about the drinking ages and stuff, but I agree with a lot of what you said. There's nothing noble in abandoning relationships.

Thanks for a different perspective.

Namaarie
 
Mamav, of course it breaks down to the individual. But don't you think female roles have also been changing for the negative?

You want to know the future; watch rock videos and hollywood movies.

As for obnoxious men- Mamav- I think men wrote the book. Prison is still the largest secondary school for them. But women's violent crime numbers are sky rocketing.

I believe many young women are attracted to sociopaths- and taught to be!!! Growing up for those women is getting over that and looking beyond.

When all men are potential attackers, and the 'mating ritual' is younger and younger, children have lost their childhood.

There are many reasons for drugs and booze, but in the end, drugs and booze are the reasons for drugs and booze.
It is true that if society does not offer sufficient reward for being sober or productive, or the kids have not yet learned to harvest those rewards, then they are an accident waiting to happen. In the meantime, listen to rap music or watch the behavior of atheletes. What you see is what you get.
Though media is not strictly causal, it is part and parcel. That is- the circle of mimicry and destructiveness.

munk
 
I definitely think we need some more positive role models. That's where a good news channel....as in reporting good news might come in handy. But in the mean time, where do we turn. Music videos are absolutely sick most of the time. What are the movie makers really trying to say? Why do movie stars and athletes have to be the heros and the men over in Iraq starting to get the cold shoulder like the Vietnam men........

But your analysis of women, i think, is very true. And your analysis that we are reaping the "benefits" of our role models is true too. So where are all the good guys......I'd like one under my tree in 3 weeks :eek: :rolleyes:
 
namaarie said:
...they only drink to get drunk, never learning to do so responsibly...
Click to expand...
To get drunk was the only reason I ever drank. Why else would anyone want to ingest that nasty tasting stuff?

To me, "drinking responsibly" meant paying your bar bill and giving the bartender or waitress a generous tip.
 
"attracted to sociopaths"

I fell in love with a girl about 5 years ago, and to tell you the truth, I still am.
She was so cute.
Freckles, big green eyes, red hair. Big smile.
Double majored in international relations and business.
Very cute butt.

She told me that she liked me too much to date me. She only wanted to be my friend.
She said she never dated guys she really liked.

I was ready to marry her, I thought she was the one I was supposed to have.

After that I didnt know what to say. I asked my boss about it.
He said "dont look at me, I had to go find one in Canada and bring her back to Texas."
 
DannyinJapan said:
... She told me that she liked me too much to date me....she never dated guys she really liked...
Click to expand...
Yeah right. And she never ate food she really liked because it was too good to eat.

When a woman tells you she wants to be "friends", you can be pretty sure that she doesn't.
 
Oh, it took some doing, but she finally convinced me that she was no good.
She found several married/ex-con type boyfriends nd I finally started to believe her...
 
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