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4.7 vs new 4.1

Discussion in 'Survive! Knives' started by OBX351, Jul 1, 2018.

  1. OBX351

    OBX351 Gold Member Gold Member

    Sep 29, 2014
    Sorry if this is a re-post or reopening an older debate. But I've been working with my new 4.1 and I really like the feel of the handle and size of the knife. Then I switch to my 4.7 and remember why I love it too. So which one is your favorite and why?

    For me, the 4.7 has a bit more power but the new 4.1 gives me a little more finesse. But if I had to carry or use 1 knife the 4.1 or 4.7, I don't know which one I would choose. I know either would do the job.
     
    amikee likes this.
  2. Oyster

    Oyster Gold Member Gold Member

    Aug 2, 2011
    To me, those two blades are so close that it probably really only comes down to hand size and which one feels more comfortable to a particular user.
    I have medium-sized hands and the 4.1 feels pretty perfect.
    If I need/want more heft, I’d reach for my CPK HDFK (still waiting for the GSO 6...). If looking to go lighter/smaller then it’s the CPK EDC2 (still waiting for the GSO 3.5...)
    I guess the beauty of it is that, in that size-range, S!K makes two phenomenal knives that give us the opportunity to really dial-in what fits our hands the best :thumbsup:
     
    amikee and OBX351 like this.
  3. OBX351

    OBX351 Gold Member Gold Member

    Sep 29, 2014
    Yeah, I would go with a 5.1 or a 7/7 for bigger and a 3.5 for smaller. Or a SJ TAC or a SAR 6 for bigger or LT Lagom or a smaller puukko if I had to go outside of the family.
     
    amikee likes this.
  4. ajvail18

    ajvail18 Gold Member Gold Member

    240
    Jan 12, 2017
    I have used my 5.1, 4.7, 4.1 on a few camping/hiking trips. I really enjoy using them all, but if I could only take one blade. It’s the 4.7 all the way.
     
    supertac916, amikee and OBX351 like this.
  5. tech25

    tech25

    125
    Dec 20, 2012
    I have the 4.1 f2 but chiral.grolim lent me his 4.7 to test and the handle fit much more naturally in hand. The 4.1 feels more nimble. The size difference is not too big but between the two I would pick the 4.7.
    When I had both in hand, I remember thinking that the handle of the 4.7 with the blade of the 4.1 would be the best combo for me.
     
    amikee, Fancier and OBX351 like this.
  6. XtianAus

    XtianAus Gold Member Gold Member

    Mar 3, 2016
    I have neither but I have a F2 4.1 on order. By going off videos/pictures and making a guess, I think the 4.7's handle looks more comfortable. I like the deeper finger guard area, looks like it would absolutely lock a hand into place. I like that in a knife.

    If S! fix their output by implementing their efficient plans with the SK series, i will definitely be grabbing a 4.7. If not, i'm betting the 4.1 will be amazing regardless.

    OBX or anyone else, can I ask how you have found the peened finish compared with the tumbled/stonewash in terms of corrosion resistance? Has it been affect positively or negatively at all?
    Survive say it improves C/R but at the same time the finish seems like it leaves micro-pockets. So interested in everyones experience.
     
    amikee, OBX351 and Oyster like this.
  7. Oyster

    Oyster Gold Member Gold Member

    Aug 2, 2011
    @XtianAus
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peening

    Can’t claim to understand all of this, and it seems counter-intuitive, but the above link might be helpful.

    (Counter-intuitive because, as you point out, peening creates micro-pockets (and a greater surface) where one would expect increased corrosion, but it appears to mitigate the effects of corrosion by reducing/inducing certain stresses in the material. Way above my (not metallurgically-trained) head...)

    Cheers!
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2018
    amikee likes this.
  8. Fancier

    Fancier

    Jul 1, 2012
    My knives stay pretty clean so I haven't had any problems with corrosion in either metal.
    The peened finish is much smoother and can be mistaken for a coating.
    The tumbled finish is rougher, and some prefer it because it shows less wear.
     
    amikee and OBX351 like this.
  9. Psybull

    Psybull

    620
    Dec 31, 2015
    I have seen corrosion [under the handles mostly] on all gens but the earlier the make and heat treat the deeper the pitting tends to be. I haven't had a D3V w/ any rust yet but the peened finish on the improved low temp 3v seems to just be very light surface corrosion and comes off very easily.
     
  10. XtianAus

    XtianAus Gold Member Gold Member

    Mar 3, 2016
    Thanks Oyster! Makes some-what sense but similar with you mostly above my lack-of-metallurgical brain :p

    And yeah Francier, I can see why people prefer the old stonewashed finishes. Thatd be my choice but the new specs have improvements that outweigh the lack of desired finish.

    Thanks for sharing your experiences Psybull. Ive heard D3V has greatly improved corrosion resistance compared with industry standard 3v. On your old gens where you did experience rust was that on 20cv too? Or just 3v?

    Sorry I dont mean to derail this thread OBX.
    So lads, whoever has both models what is your preference?
    @Silver Needle it'd be interesting to hear your thoughts.
     
    amikee, OBX351 and Fancier like this.
  11. Oyster

    Oyster Gold Member Gold Member

    Aug 2, 2011
    I wouldn’t worry about the 20CV (assuming you don’t store it in a creek)

    The D3V on my CPK (same HT afaik) - the EDC2 is my most-carried blade - hasn’t shown any signs of rust so far and I’m not concerned. (I believe Lorien commented something to the effect of treating his with a light coat of don’t-worry-about-it and he uses his blades in the wet PNW)

    If you’re still concerned, remove the scales (that’s where problems would most likely arise, if at all) and wipe down with TUF cloth (or similar product). The exposed parts of the blade are easy enough to wipe/dry after use.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2018
    amikee, OBX351 and XtianAus like this.
  12. Psybull

    Psybull

    620
    Dec 31, 2015
    Most of the used ones I traded for or bought would have some small amount of corrosion under the scales. The heaviest cases were on the 1st gen and earlier 3v models but some very light corrosion also has been under my 20cv and elmax models but those basically just wiped off. The stonewash 3v knives cleaned up easy enough with steel wool or similar but it was enough staining that the finish was affected after being cleaned, no big deal but there none the less. The earliest 3v knives like my prototype 4 has a pin head sized pit right in front of the scale from a spec of rust. That is the main reason I switched as many of my early blades over to torx screws just so cleaning under the handles was quick and easy plus it doesn't mess up the slotted screw heads.
     
    supertac916, amikee, OBX351 and 3 others like this.
  13. OBX351

    OBX351 Gold Member Gold Member

    Sep 29, 2014
    I didn't notice any difference. But I've never noticed any corrosion on 3v. I have had some staining on the edge but it came out with stroping. Have you seen these videos?




    These are at least 4 years old now and I handled all of these knives. The 3v knives (10 and 4.1) had a ton of staining but were structurally fine. I tried to buy them but Guy won't sell anything that not 100% perfect. 3v is very corrosion resistant but is not stainless. I have yet to see any S!K 3v knife with pitting, I have however seen surface rust, that can be removed, and staining. To me it's patina.

    Oh, one other thing, I do remove the scales of my S!Ks and wipe them down after being in the field. I also do it about 2x to 3x per year just to change the handles around. When I do this I check for staining.
     
  14. OBX351

    OBX351 Gold Member Gold Member

    Sep 29, 2014
    No worries, it's a good question. I think for this week if I had to carry one, meaning I couldn't carry my 5.1, it would be the 4.7 because of the power. I am sure I change my mind next week. But if I could carry my 5.1 I would back it up with the new 4.1 over the old 4.1, which is a big deal for me because my old 4.1 was my second favorite knife.
     
    amikee likes this.
  15. Silver Needle

    Silver Needle

    Jul 14, 2014
    You son of a gun... I'm quite jealous! I wonder if they put the blades back outside after moving to Meridian. I'd love to see an update on those.

    Xtian! A year ago I would have shouted my answer of 4.7 over 4.1 right on your face. Interestingly enough I've been using my new spec 4.1 a ton lately... almost exclusively. I've always liked the idea of a stout mid-sized blade like the 4.7 to do most anything and since the 4.7 is the spiritual successor to the GSO 5 (my previous favorite knife by a laaaaaarge margin) I always gravitated towards it. The blade dimensions and handle length and swell are all so perfect for what I like in a knife. Maybe because I'm trying to get a better feel for the d3v I've been making myself use the new 4.1 for anything I need a knife for and I have to say I really love it. I've thought for awhile that the 4.7 is the smallest big knife that S!K makes and the 4.1 is the largest small knife they make. The two models end up almost meeting in the middle exactly. My knife senses aren't anywhere near as in tune as OBX, so other than the slight difference in handle ergonomics the two are really interchangeable for my modest uses. I've been adding a Silky saw to my own version of a Nesmuk trio for a lot of things lately and when I'm adding a knife to a set of other tools I always take the 4.1 because of the advertised (yet minute in comparison) compactness of the 4.1 compared to the 4.7.

    As far as corrosion goes, I found some small spots of black staining under the handle of an old spec 3v 4.1 that I got second hand. It came off easily with a rust eraser. No signs of corrosion on any new or old models that I've gotten direct from the company and sometimes I'll keep them in the sheath for weeks with sap and goo and dirt on them purely for the sake of science.

    To me the old stone wash finish was very, very smooth to the touch. The peened finished has a little more texture to it, so like is above, it seems counter intuitive. My peened knives do show some almost smoothing in areas from use. My heavily beat upon old spec 5 still lookes brand new to me when I clean it up.

    This is awesome.
     
    Fancier, amikee, XtianAus and 2 others like this.
  16. Burke

    Burke Gold Member Gold Member

    Feb 25, 1999
    I think that's pretty spot on. Only knife? 4.7. Already carrying a hatchet or chopper? Add the 4.1 for finer work.
     
    amikee, Oyster, OBX351 and 1 other person like this.
  17. OBX351

    OBX351 Gold Member Gold Member

    Sep 29, 2014
    I don't know SN, "I've thought for awhile that the 4.7 is the smallest big knife that S!K makes and the 4.1 is the largest small knife they make." is pretty insightful! I've never thought of it that way, nonetheless, it's 100% correct. Though I would add that the old 5.0, one of my first and favorite GSOs, is the biggest medium knife S!K, or any maker I know, makes! They all fight above their weight.
     
  18. Apocryphiliac

    Apocryphiliac Gold Member Gold Member

    Jan 18, 2017
    I slightly preferred the 4.7. It had the most natural feel in my hand of any of Survive's knives.
     
    Silver Needle, OBX351 and Fancier like this.
  19. ATJ999

    ATJ999 Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 12, 2013
    My low temper 3V knives patina on the blade with extended use. I have had rust under the handles of 3V and 20CV. It comes off with some steel wool, wire brush, and some WD40 or CLP. If I put a coat of CLP under the handles, I don't have much of an issue at all, as long as I reapply it every month or two.
    As for the 4.7 vs 4.1. That is a TOUGH call! I would say the 4.7 started out way ahead, but now they are even, with the 4.1 possibly creeping ahead the more and more I use it. It has really grown on me! I'm Excited for a SK 3.5
     
    Silver Needle, Oyster and OBX351 like this.
  20. supertac916

    supertac916

    602
    Sep 6, 2014
    I use mostly my 4.7s when it comes to my go too backpacking and camping blade. I like my 4.1 but the handle seems a little small when I use it for long periods of time. Winter snow camping where I need to break down larger wood I use my 5.1. I will also usually bring a smaller blade like a 2.7, BR ULB, CPK EDC for smaller tasks. I'm actually growing fond of the BR Aurora LT in 3v for a "Bushcraft" style knife until the 4.5 comes out. It's gotten to the point where I dont knoe what companion knife to bring, but I always grab my 4.7 first as my primary.
     

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