A bit rough on the outside

harronek

harronek

Joined
Nov 29, 2013
Messages
2,493
I have been doing a lot of work under vehicles lately and my Leathernan sheath has taken a hammering being dragged across cement and dirt . The finish is really scuffed up and showing real signs of hard use .

Awhile ago I was making a SAK sheath and while I was waiting for some glue to dry I saw a piece of off cut leather and for no good reason I wet Molded it into shape , but with the rough side out .
It was just an experiment to see what it would turn out like .
I'm at home this week due to bad weather and while cleaning up I spied the " Rough " SAK piece of leather I had formed in the bottom of a scrap bin .
It dawned on me that Rough side out would be good for hard use .
So I sat down last night and quickly put it together .

It will be interesting to see how it lasts .

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Ken
 
Neat idea for the retention stud. Rough out gear was quite normal and popular back in my mis-spent youth, particularly rough out saddles and tack. You still see quite a lot of it if you notice things like that.

On another note…..I think it's time you were compensated generously for your work. Your quality and attention to detail certainly puts your work toward the top, so it's time for a payday. Come join the ranks of the pros.

Paul
 
Pretty nice Ken, great idea on the stud too, not much tension but it should keep things put neatly !
Clean job sir!
G2
 
Ultra cool man. Dave sent me some pics of rough out and stamped tack, looks amazing. I agree with Paul. I know you're feelings on the matter, but you really come up with some nifty stuff.
 
Ken I too know you like doing the leatherwork for fun but I also agree with Paul. Your designs are elegant in their simplicity and very practical. Your craftsmanship is fantastic, anytime you wanted to start selling, you're already there my friend.

I can tell you that roughout is extremely durable. I can say that as a crafstman and as an end user. I have had 3 roughout custom saddles. I wore the first two out and am on my third now. They are tough.

Very nice work on this sheath.
 
Thanks for liking my work guys .
It means a lot to me to have sheath makers of the highest caliber comment favorably about my attempts .
The sheath itself has a reasonable amount of retention because when I wet mold these SAK sheaths I don't use the knife itself , I use what I call a Form that I've made which is fractionally smaller than the knife . SAK's don't have contours to help with the retention , so a bordering on tight fit is the next best option .
But I always worry about losing a knife so I've been trying to come up with a way of securing the knife in the sheath without a flap .
The Lanyard fastener is one of the ways I've come up with , I have a couple of other ideas , but haven't brought them to life yet .
The lanyard you see in the Pic's is supposed to be just a standby one until I perfect my original idea of a leather tab on the end of some Paracord , the tab will have a proper hole and slot to fit the Sam Brown stud .
I haven't managed to come up with a working design that I like though , and in the meantime the simple leather one is working really well .
I've found that having the loop of the lanyard just long enough that it just pushes over the stud and the lifting the knife a fraction tensions it nicely .
If anyone has design ideas for a better lanyard feel free to contribute , I'd welcome some fresh thoughts .

I would love to see some pics or hear more about " rough out " sheaths and saddlery, and if anyone can add to this it would be really cool .

Ken
 
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Here's one of my Rangeflap holsters in rooughout. This one I did a borderstamp on.

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Here's a pair of leggings I made for a neighbor's girlfriend. Nichole made her wool vest and the silk wildrag too. I'll look around for those other pics. I know the ones Strig is talking about.
 
I'm gunna have to go to Tehachapi one day because you always seem to have pretty girls in your photo's , it must be the water or something .

I just remembered you showed a Rough out Scabbard just the other day which was really nice .
I must admit Rough out isn't something I've much thought to until recently , I think it needs further investigation :)

Ken

PS - nice Holster
 
Here's a pic of Nichole on her old mustang El Patron. We were working at a branding down in Leona Valley. Nichole's martingale (across the horse's chest) is a roughout one and her saddle is a halfbreed meaning that it is part roughout and part smoothout. I made the martingale for her, the saddle is by John Willemsma. Over the years roughout has been my most popular variation on this item. First it kind of goes with everything and then second its pretty darn bullet proof. This item takes a lot of wear and tear from the horse pushing through brush, sweat, mud etc. The roughout seems to really last. I make it smoothout on the inside against the horse, this seems to resist the horse sweat better.

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When I make something out of roughout I just oil it, no finish. On those leggings above I didn't do anything. Care of roughout is clean off any mud, sweat or dirt, oil or condition and thats about it. If the nap gets really worn such as on a saddle seat a guy can do a real light sanding with 120 grit. But most folks just leave that alone and feel like it looks broke in.

Here's Nichole's saddle brand new. This is the same saddle she is riding above.

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So the seat and seat jockeys are roughout on this saddle the rest is smoothout.

Same saddle a couple of years ago when we were cleaning our saddles. We'll spread a sheet on the floor of the living room turn on the tv and go to work. So this saddle has quite a bit of wear and tear on it from just plain use.

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Here are those pics I shared with Strig a while back. This is my firend Steve's new saddle by Bob Ray. I don't know Bob but he did an amazing amount of little detail work in this saddle and a lot of tooling on roughout. Steve had brought the saddle over to show us and to put it on one of our horses as he was horseless at the time a dire situation that has since been fixed. Steve is the guy roping behind Nichole in that branding pic above.

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A close up the seat and the beaver tail bucking rolls..

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A close up of the fender and the out side stirrup leathers. Look at that itty bitty little border stamp he used. That took days.

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The whole saddle. So this saddle is a half breed too, part roughout and part smoothout.
 
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I know nothing about Saddle making , but the work that has gone into those is just mind blowing .
How many hours of work do you estimate those Saddles took to produce ?
When your giving your Saddles a spring clean in front of the TV what products are you using to clean the leather with ?

Also I realise not much is ever said about the horses that you show in your photos .
I'm not much of a Horseman myself , I must have inherited that from my Father who always said " Bloody Horses they're dangerous at both ends and uncomfortable in the middle " , but even to my untrained eye I can see there is some very nice blood running through their veins .

Ken
 
I love the beaver tail buck rolls. There are so many hides that I want to try, but beaver tail is at the top of the list. You ever worked with it? Is it pretty supple? How's it stitch?
 
Hey Ken they say about 40 hours in cutting out parts and assembling just a plain saddle, no tooling. Thats if you've made quite a few and have it down. Warm water and a rag and or brush to get the dirt and dried sweat off, then we use Williams Saddle Dressing from down your way in Australia, both on the smoothout and the roughout. Thats good stuff. Thanks on the horses. Horses are in the dna of my family. Always been equestrians. Strig I've not used it but want to. Sheridan Leather Supply is a good place to get those beaver tails. Those bucking rolls on Nichole's saddle are shark.
 
I think it would be hard to improve on shark. I wear it on my wrist every day and it shrugs off abrasion like veg tanned cow only dreams about. Cow might outlast it in durability (?) but shark just plain doesn't show wear in the same way. My dad always told me that if something bites me to bite it back. I don't think he meant sharks though.
 
Cool boots .
You have just reminded me that my work boots are rough out leather and they really handle some abuse .


What makes this Waxed French Calf leather tougher than the rest ?
I wonder if its available here and what its like to work with .


Ken
 
Dave, what's the practical purpose for the tall heel on cb boots? Stirrups, spurs maybe?

Those you linked to are cool, especially the price. I would think handmade would be more expensive, but I'm more likely to wear Danner.
 
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Come to think of it so are the foot part of these boots of mine and they lasted many years. I don't know on the Waxed French Calf. I've never had a pair of boots with that leather. I know guys that have though and they talk about it being incredibly rugged. It also seems to be a custom boot deal only. I've never seen a pair of off the shelf boots in it. I know Horween will make a limited run of it now and then and maybe that is for the custom boot market.
 
Strig, the heel is to prevent the foot coming through the stirrup and the rider getting hung up. Very bad deal and in reality why cowboys carried pistols in the old days. It was for shooting the horse if ya got hung up, not for bad guys. Remeber what they did to Bruce Dern at the end of John Wayne's The Cowboys. Also why the boot is a pull on instead of laced. The idea being if you got hung up the boot will slip off. This I have seen happen and once I saw a girl that wished she had slip ons instead of lace up cowboy boots. Fortunatly she only got drug a couple of yards. But it did break her thumb back to her wrist. The heel also helps balance the foot correctly. If you were to go and take riding lessons the instructor would chant a mantra to you: Heels down, heels down heels down. Not only is this considered proper form but it really does help to pull your butt down into the saddle. A good boot will have a "spur shelf" for the spur to ride on and you can see that in my red boots above. That Paul Bond boot is a special in stock pre made boot. So its not really a full custom more of what they call a shop made boot. Thats how they can keep the price low like that. That boot is aimed at the working cowboy but even still that is about a 1/3rd of a month's wages for most working cowboys. Paul Bond will make you a full pair of custom boots but you ain't gonn get em for $600! I had a pair made some years ago by Slick Fork Bootery in Arroyo Grande. The guy has since passed away so not in business any more. I met him at a show in Paso Robles. He had me stand on a piece of heavy paper and the drew the outline of each individual foot and then took about 10 measurements per foot. They fit incredibly, its not like you're wearing anything. I rode in them for many, many years, they cleaned up nice and now are my going to town boots. Water Buffalo foot and Shark heel. I've had them resoled probably 10 times.
 
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This is a pic of my saddle when it was brand new about a year ago. This one (also made by John Wilmensa) is a full roughout except for the horn cap which John carved. This pic is good cause it really shows the depth of his carving.

These are my Tapaderos or stirrup coverings.

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My friend Carlos made these for me to match my saddle. We traded for them. He's a dyed in the wool Wicket and Craig man but also a good friend of John's. So he had John send him a side of his HO to make these for me. John has HO specially mill the sides he's gonna use for roughout saddles. The tapadero also helps prevent your foot from sliding through the stirrup, helps to balance the saddle (not as much rocking side to side), protect your feet from sage brush etc and man do they keep your feet warm, some are even lined with sheepskin for that purpose, these aren't. They sure eat up a side of leather to make though and so are pretty spendy. Dang they just look punchy too.

And to lay to rest all the abundant rumors that I don't have a head just a pumkin.....

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Just a grizzled old fart, with out eyes.
 
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