1. Washington action alert - Spring blade knife ban repeal thread. Hearing is Tues, Vote is Friday, let your voice be heard!

A radical theory, and leaving the world of expensive modern knives behind

Discussion in 'General Knife Discussion' started by Chopaholic, Mar 6, 2019.

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  1. Danke42


    Feb 10, 2015
    Super! I just want to make sure no one's feelings get affected yet.
  2. slyraven


    Feb 19, 2019
    I love cheap knives. Even the mtechs and z hunters of the world, they often look really awesome even if they are not the best durability. Great for display.

    But I am a collector, and I like what I like even if its expensive. if its JUST for practicality, all you need is 1 fixed and 1 pocket and be done with it...both of which could be a affordable a rat 1 and the ontario hickory knife..what else do you need? Maybe a smaller blade just get a mora. done deal, under 100 dollars, and you never have to worry again.

    But again, that is no fun to me, I like buying new knives, and appreciating their beauty, design and craftsmanship.
  3. Khanvoy44

    Khanvoy44 Gold Member Gold Member

    Oct 22, 2016
    I like what I like. Not because it's new, old, cheap, expensive, thin or thick. Won't defend it, justify it or force my opinion on anyone else. Opinions are good when asked for. Otherwise it's like teaching a mule to play a harmonica.... It's a waste of your time and annoys the mule. ;)o_O:cool:
    Love ya'll, byebye.
    Natlek, palonej, hexenjager and 2 others like this.
  4. Chopaholic


    Aug 20, 2018
    I do not think a musket is better than a machine gun.

    I did not claim that anyone here is stupid.

    Most knife enthusiasts I have personally met were clueless about sharpening.

    I have gotten a splitting maul shaving sharp.

    I processed a tree with a pocket knife to prove that the task could be done with a very common, albeit completely inappropriate tool in an emergency situation.

    I stand by my comments that the differences in the performance of blade steel are probably irrelevant for most knife users. The steel's potential is only realized when sharpened skillfully. Sharpening is a fine art that very few people (though probably many people here on this forum) are acquainted with, let alone proficient at, and an improper or absent sharpening job nullifies any advantage in cutting performance the steel might have offered. Even among other professional knife users, such as butchers and chefs, I commonly see evidence of very poor sharpening knowledge and skill. Such people will not benefit in any way by buying expensive knives, and often ruin them immediately.
  5. Danke42


    Feb 10, 2015
    This whole screed reads like someone who had a couple $40 knives from Lowes and a gas station Zombie Hunter Karambit and then found out the kitchen knives jammed in a drawer cut stuff better.

    None of the folks yet coming on here extolling a huge collection and vastly superior experience and smarts ever put their money where their mouth was and showed any of the collection. It was always locked in a safe or their cellphone camera was broken or some other issue prevented them from succeeding.

    Maybe someday one of those people will deliver the goods but I'm betting it aint' today.
    craytab, Quiet, LX_Emergency and 3 others like this.
  6. 91bravo

    91bravo Gold Member Gold Member

    Jun 29, 2008
    I agree. Let's see some utterly useless thick knives that no one can sharpen, on a knife forum at that...
    craytab likes this.
  7. jbmonkey

    jbmonkey Platinum Member Platinum Member

    Jun 9, 2011
    sharpen knives 50 hours a week is a whole lot of sharpening.....

    interesting topic.......gonna go read more pages now........
  8. T.L.E. Sharp

    T.L.E. Sharp I support the 3rd amendment! Platinum Member

    Jun 30, 2016
    But do it keep the hoes in line?

    craytab, palonej, Minh762 and 10 others like this.
  9. Twindog

    Twindog Gold Member Gold Member

    Apr 6, 2004
    Perhaps the biggest advantage of today's high-tech powder steels is that they can support a more aggressive and effective geometry, which is the thrust of the OP's rant. But, yes, you still have to know how to sharpen them. Fair point from the OP.

    My two Phil Wilson knives have edge widths of 0.008 inches or less. They cut like the Dickens. You need a really, really good steel to support that kind of geometry. 1050 at 55 Rc won't do it.
    jux t, danbot, Mark McKenzie and 7 others like this.
  10. Chopaholic


    Aug 20, 2018
    I don't post personal photos on the internet of any kind, never have, so I'm afraid I'll have to be a disappointment to you.
  11. 91bravo

    91bravo Gold Member Gold Member

    Jun 29, 2008
    No pics, no proof. It's all just hot air and words on a screen. No credibility, no proof, no nothin'.
  12. GIRLYmann


    Nov 7, 2005
    Buying habits are what which decides
    the knife industry's continued need for design and styling.
    The old standards may work well.
    But "sexy" products sells better.
    Nobody intentionally goes all out to date a drab queen
    Even though the homely and domestically capable sharp girl next door,
    rather than the poster "dream machine"-
    would serve the traditional breadwinner best.
    And so a majority of folks continue to fall pray to sweet young things because they are mesmorized by the allure of imagined promises...
    The pleasure of cutting must surely be the result of blade geomatry.
    Super thin is great at that.
    However a compromise in less steeper edge angles allows better all round general performance for the outdorrsman.
    Who may or may not be aware of the science behind what that is requiref to make a knife great for specific knife usage or tasks.
    All eveyone wants is a "sharp" knife.
    And if that is not enough, a super edge that will stay sharp forever; even if in some circumstances a knife may not the right tool for the job.
    So imho, the cutlery industry will always have to make attempts to fulfill the wants of the general outdoorsman, through research and with technological means to satisfy the criteria of robustness.
    Sure some things don't need fixing but in general things must appear to move on even if at times it may seem like little progress to some.
    Old maybe gold.
    So do we need change? Maybe.
    Is change necessary?
    Not if human contentment derives from the state of being in complete stagnation..
    Just think, a knife has for centuries consisted of a point and a sharp edge.
    Could anything more be unnecessary? ;-)
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2019
    FortyTwoBlades likes this.
  13. jceckrosh

    jceckrosh Gold Member Gold Member

    Mar 2, 2016
    Pictures of knives or your sharpening set up are personal photos? And you are paranoid of whom in regards to showing your super sharp butchery operations?
    Insipid Moniker and hexenjager like this.
  14. Chopaholic


    Aug 20, 2018
    Proof of what? Of my subjective opinion as to what works best for me? I posted this to see if anyone else had reached similar conclusions in their own lives, not to change anyone's mind. If you like cutting stuff with crudely sharpened crowbars that cost as much as used Glocks, I really don't care. I'm tired of living that way. Too much wasted money, too many frustrating afternoons trying to bring down stupidly thick bevels. Screw it all. Get some butcher knives from the manufacturers I mentioned and experiment with them yourself. They're not expensive, and you'll have fun.
    Mark McKenzie and Night Rider like this.
  15. Chopaholic


    Aug 20, 2018
    I have never uploaded photos to the internet. Never used social media either, other than anonymous forums like this. I'm really not interested in having some formal debate with peer-reviewed sources being cast like wizard spells, I just posted this to see if any other knife nuts were on the same trail as me or if I was an oddball.
  16. jceckrosh

    jceckrosh Gold Member Gold Member

    Mar 2, 2016
    Looks like you're an oddball. Or odder ball.
    palonej, Quiet, BilboBaggins and 2 others like this.
  17. Chopaholic


    Aug 20, 2018
    At the very least, there does appear to a sizable number of users here who agree that there is a distressing tendency for modern knives to be excessively thick, which was the most important point I was trying to make.
    Night Rider likes this.
  18. Night Rider

    Night Rider Gold Member Gold Member

    Apr 16, 2018
    Op I kind of get jist of where you're coming from, Thick versus Thin blade stock and using the right tool for the job and all plus there's no doubt that their has been a trend towards folding knives ( Tank knives ) with crazy thick spines like Heeters and Medford's but most people buying them are not going to take them camping let alone use them for smashing thru fire wood, clear out underbrush, and dig a latrine but some will and do just that and good for them. Your (Blanket) statement that most knife owners have no clue as to how to sharpen the knives they have is only partially true. From what I read here on the BF is Many of them do know how and many more are willing to learn. Also let's not point a finger at the people who collect knives for the love of their form and build quality because most of them have no need to sharpen their knives for the fact that it could/will lower the Value of that knife for resale or trade and I respect that. That said a thin stock blade worked great for me all last year on my camping outings and the edge held up great because I also brought a hatchet and a folding limb saw but let's face the small fact that there is nothing more sexy (I'm talking blades) than a nice thick fixed blade with well placed swedges and or compound grinds that cannot be achieved on a butchers knife. These are the two knives I used camping last season, I bet they look familiar Op [​IMG] A confession Op, I was one of those people who couldn't sharpen knives effectively so I got this [​IMG] And by asking questions here and very little practice learned how to do this [​IMG] and this [​IMG] So lets not pigeonhole all knife owners Op and BTW this stuff^ (Edges/Micro bevels) and sharpening in general is far from Wizardry or Rocket science but hats off to the guys who take it to that level and choose to share that knowledge with the rest of us.
    buckfynn, slyraven, palonej and 6 others like this.
  19. Mossyhorn

    Mossyhorn Enlightened Rogue Platinum Member

    Dec 6, 2009
    Your unwillingness to post photos that would prove your rather dubious claims, only lends credence to the disingenuousnessof this thread.

    Information contained in photos can easily be removed by a EXIFR app. Your excuses are baseless . Trolling behavior is very evident.
  20. FortyTwoBlades

    FortyTwoBlades Baryonyx walkeri Dealer / Materials Provider

    Mar 8, 2008
    Slap a title on that and it's a fine free-verse poem. :)

    That's what an abrasive file is for. Tools for tasks, dude--c'mon! :p :D ;)

  21. Chopaholic


    Aug 20, 2018
    If you need proof that a thin knife cuts better and sharpens easier than a thick knife, is lighter, that many modern knives have shitty point geometry and lack finger guards, or any of my other truisms, I'm afraid I'm going to decline. Do you want proof that steel is better than copper for knifemaking too?
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