Advice on how to handle stolen or missing package

[sf fanatic]

I swear, I will beat a porch pirate within an inch of his life. Can’t stand thieves.

I’ve only had a couple things go missing in many years, but it was low dollar stuff which I either reimbursed or was being sent as a gift.

When I’m sending something high dollar, it goes insured, delivery confirmation, signature required.

Let’s not sugar coat it, OFF WITH THEIR HANDS!

 

[Triton]

First I didn’t shrug it off. Second, I take getting my parcel to the buyer seriously. What I do take offence to is why you quoted MY post. I was agreeing with another member. Also, if you paid with F&F and receive an empty box or “trash in a box”, shame on you. You have no recourse.
If you paid G&S, if it says delivered and someone signed for it, and now it’s missing...what do you want me to do? I can’t claim insurance now, and how do I know you aren’t screwing me.
Like I said before...you are stirring the pot.

Then you are easily offended. Your post illustrated something I wanted to respond to it had little to do with you. I'm glad to hear that you take your customers satisfaction seriously. Customer relations is a full time gig.

 

[Sharp & Fiery]

Then you are easily offended. Your post illustrated something I wanted to respond to it had little to do with you. I'm glad to hear that you take your customers satisfaction seriously. Customer relations is a full time gig.

I don’t get easily offended...however, your issue of empty packages or “trash in a pack” is only worrisome for folks who pay with F&F option...which is highly frowned on here for good reason. You have been here long enough to know this. Hence, why I saw it as “stirring the pot.”
I noticed we both have 100% positive sellers ratings, I’d like to keep it that way. I’m sure you would too. A few folks that have left feedback know how much I track a package and even have called the PO when it was arriving late or didnt move for a while.

I see it as if you quote someone, and pose a question, it is directed at the quoted person. Hence why I answered.
Have a good week, and now that I think our stance on this subject is the same, it’s time to drop it and not derail the thread any more.

 

[LastRodeo]

Notably, I am not accusing you of anything. I was pointing out that simply shrugging and saying "well it says delivered, so now it is your problem" is not historically been the norm around here. The norm is (was?) that the deal is not done until both parties are satisfied.

If it is still the sellers responsibility after it is delivered, how long afterwards can the buyer come back to the seller and say it was not delivered? A day, week, month, year?

 

[Peter Hartwig]

Just a couple thoughts on shipping responsibilities and deal not done until both parties are satisfied and why they exist
1st satisfied-The reason for this IMO is that this is an internet transaction. Until delivery the buyer has not had a chance to inspect the item. I don't believe this has anything to do with delivery. If the item is lost or stolen(unless insurance pays off) someone isn't going to be happy. It is however the sellers responsibility to get the item delivered.
The reason the seller is responsible for delivery is that he is the one in control of the shipping. He chooses the shipper, how well it is packaged , and how clearly it is labeled. Once it is delivered the control areas fall to the buyer. He chooses the location and is the only one that can control how secure that area is and how quickly it gets picked up. The seller has no idea what situation he is sending it in to.
For these reasons I think the seller is responsible until deliver, but not after(other than problems with the item). However in normal times a signature guarantee will neutralize the after delivery problem and insurance "May" solve the transit issues.
of course I could be wrong

 

[Triton]

If it is still the sellers responsibility after it is delivered, how long afterwards can the buyer come back to the seller and say it was not delivered? A day, week, month, year?

It's a good question and I don't have particular brilliance. It seems like a week or so would be reasonable. Of course that's just my opinion ymmv.

 

[sharp_edge]

Agree with P Peter Hartwig . I also wonder how PayPal normally handles claims submitted by the buyer that the package was not received while USPS tracking showed it's delivered. I assume PayPal's decision should be in favor of the seller in these cases?

 

[KELAMA]

Just a couple thoughts on shipping responsibilities and deal not done until both parties are satisfied and why they exist

It is however the sellers responsibility to get the item delivered.

Once it is delivered the control areas fall to the buyer.

^ As always, perfectly stated, PH!

And FWIW: I always (pandemic or not), use signature confirmation, as an extra level of accountability, for any knife that I don't feel comfortable taking a total loss on; and I never purchase insurance. If something were to go sideways- I'm prepared to take a total lo$$. And although I realize that some people here may not agree- I personally have had a 100% successful relationship using the USPS as my carrier- & as a seller, I would refuse to use anyone other than the USPS.

 

[tltt]

Agree with P Peter Hartwig . I also wonder how PayPal normally handles claims submitted by the buyer that the package was not received while USPS tracking showed it's delivered. I assume PayPal's decision should be in favor of the seller in these cases?

Paypal sides with the seller generally. There is a signature requirement after a certain price point, but I'm not sure how they are handling it in these Covid times.

 

[Heirphoto]

I was one that commented on responsibility ending with delivery. I meant that only in the context of a package, delivered to the correct address being stolen. If the buyer gets it and simply does not like it or feels my description was off it is still my responsibility.

This thread is about stolen or missing packages and that is what my "responsibility ends" comment applies to, nothing more.

 

[sharp_edge]

Right. If the package is lost or stolen before reaching its destination, the seller unfortunately should refund the buyer; how/whether the seller can get some or all money back from the carrier is entirely on him/her. If the package is stolen after it is delivered to the correct address, from the mailbox or the front pouch (or in some rare cases from inside the house/apt), the seller should not take any responsibility IMO.

 

[LastRodeo]

Right. If the package is lost or stolen before reaching its destination, the seller unfortunately should refund the buyer; how/whether the seller can get some or all money back from the carrier is entirely on him/her. If the package is stolen after it is delivered to the correct address, from the mailbox or the front pouch (or in some rare cases from inside the house/apt), the seller should not take any responsibility IMO.

I agree. I have seen too many stories where the package was delivered and went missing from the communal mailbox, office mailroom, the doorman, etc.

 

[Thomas Linton]

UPS does have the most reliable and consistent real time tracking that I’ve experienced. You can’t get real time GPS of the vehicle due to safety (there is a lag time), but the package scan is live time. Sometimes it’s worth it to just pay a little extra for your delivery, depending of course on your location.

A 4.4 lb. Surepost box (15"x15"x7") that UPS said was expected to be delivered by USPS on 10/03/2020 by 9:00 PM was delivered today, the 9th, at 3:30 PM - to my front door. Then I got an email saying I got it at 1:45 PM. Maybe that is the "most reliable" as the IRS is the"Most reliable" federal tax agency that we have: inaccurate and slow, but the best available. Far better than the USPS, which says it has had a small parcel since 12/3 at a location fifteen minutes away, has not delivered, and has - still today - disconnected it's telephone. Next Spring, they will present their multi-$billion bill to Congress.

 

[Thomas Linton]

My package from 194 miles of dry roads away, said to have reached my local PO by UPS early on 12/01/20, has still not been delivered. The PO telephone is still disconnected ("busied out") by USPS. They push a button and callers get a 120-cycle busy signal. UPS website says my legal name and my password or user name are "invalid" and will not allow me to create a new account. Telephoning UPS resulted in a hold to speak to "internet support" and disconnection after a three hour wait. The shipper, a class outfit, is going to try again with FedEx.

This is an inconvenience for me. For businesses that rely on shipping, it is much more.