AEB-L and toughness in larger blades.

darrin sanders said:
AEB-L/13C26 has always been and still is my favorite SS. I was fortunate enough to be introduced to its qualities not long after I started making knives. Johnny Warner turned me on to it. He lived in AK for years and has dressed/skinned literally hundreds of animals. He gave me a sheet of it in .145" (yes it exists but its very rare) to play with and I fell in love with it.
As far as H/T, this is what works for me. I ran this by Devin Thomas and he says this is exactly how he treats it except he uses LN and I use dry ice & alcohol.
1. Heat to 1950 and soak for 30 min..
2. Plate quench.
3. As soon as you can handle it remove it from the foil and correct any warpage.
4. Water quench to room temp..
5. Sub-zero freeze or LN cryo.
6. Temper twice for 2 hours each time. Temper between 350 & 500 depending on your equipment and desired hardness.

-95 is all you need to convert any RA but if you have LN why not use it.
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Same heat treat Ive been using, I normally temper at about 375°
 
I had my first batch done by Peters. I may have to troy to play the home versions of the game next time. LOL
 
Nice work Hunter. I've always wondered why the Sandvik strip steels weren't used more often on larger blades as well. I've had lil luck with search engines in regards. Was thinking of
picking up a few different bars (AEBL/13c26, 12c27/M, 19c27) to test out at some point, but glad you put this up here.

I'm with Cashmore on the possibilities of using 12c27/M for your machetes. While AEBL has a lil more carbon for edge holding, you have more corrosion resistance and toughness with 12c27.
12c27 also happens to be the stainless of choice many bushcrafter types prefer if you look at the popularity of the Mora series within that community. Can't go wrong with either steel really, but
I'd opt for the slight benefit in corrosion resistance if salt water environments is your concern. I have knives made in both steels and like them equally. They sharpen and perform so closely that I can't really tell the difference. Love the edge stability and resistance to wire edge on both steels. With kitchen knives made from AEBL/13c26, its also the free chromium that isn't "tied up" with the carbon that allows it to hold an edge nearly as well as plain higher carbon steels such as Hitachi Blues and take an edge as keen as the Hitachi Whites. For your application, it may be interesting to play with some 12c27 along the way if you're still testing for stainless steels. Admiral steel carries 12c27. As an aside, I've always wondered how 19c27 would fare for large blades as well.

Looking good so far. Can't wait to read more of your findings.
 
Yeah I really think 12c27 is worth a look. While AEB-L brings more to the table for smaller knives (more abrasive wear, higher hardness and as a result greater edge holding) none of those attributes really come into play with a chopper.

However, if as a knifemaker you plan on using the AEB-L for other things I can see simplifying things and just using AEB-L across the board so as not to order two different steels. Or also AEB-L may be slightly more marketable than 12c27.
 
Grayzer86 said:
I just picked up some .070 myself for kitchen knives and plan to get some .130 for some hunters and things. What hardness are you suggesting is best for edge holding and could you possibly give me any advice on your heat treat process. I am sending mine out for ht but am very curious how you go about getting your best performance
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That's what I'm looking for! Where did you find it in .070?
Or anything less than 1/8.
 
Thanks! Alpha has roughly 1/8, nothing thinner on their web store, but Aldo got it back in it looks like.
 
Grayzer86 said:
I just picked up some .070 myself for kitchen knives and plan to get some .130 for some hunters and things. What hardness are you suggesting is best for edge holding and could you possibly give me any advice on your heat treat process. I am sending mine out for ht but am very curious how you go about getting your best performance
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I'm tempering around 400 F for about 60-61 RC. I use a textbook heat treat, Darrin Sanders explained it very well. The sub zero cycle is crucial, I do not snap temper either.

I think AEB-L is a good one to send out for ht, I do all of mine myself but consider sending off a group of AEB-L. It's not too tricky to ht right though.

The austenitizing temp, soak time and sub zero process all have a huge impact on final hardness. I kept a coupon to test roughly and am testing every blade extensively before final finish.
 
Cashmore said:
Yeah I really think 12c27 is worth a look. While AEB-L brings more to the table for smaller knives (more abrasive wear, higher hardness and as a result greater edge holding) none of those attributes really come into play with a chopper.

However, if as a knifemaker you plan on using the AEB-L for other things I can see simplifying things and just using AEB-L across the board so as not to order two different steels. Or also AEB-L may be slightly more marketable than 12c27.
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Thanks for the tip on 12c27. I'm definitely not done with my search for a stainless machete steel. It something I'm very interested in providing but Ill have to see if theres a demand for it first. But if you need to use a machete in the mangrooves, 52100 is going to just get eaten alive by rust.

BTW your machete is nearly finished and will be shipping early next week. Looking forward to your feedback!
 
KalEl said:
Thanks for the tip on 12c27. I'm definitely not done with my search for a stainless machete steel. It something I'm very interested in providing but Ill have to see if theres a demand for it first. But if you need to use a machete in the mangrooves, 52100 is going to just get eaten alive by rust.

BTW your machete is nearly finished and will be shipping early next week. Looking forward to your feedback!
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Of course. When I think about it, the cost may be the deciding factor in favor of 12c27. While on paper it's more appropriate for a chopper, I do wonder how many people could actually see a difference in use. Then again, it's more appropriate qualities t may also lead to a greater percentage of success in the choppers, by which I mean where as you may see problems with 2 of 100 machetes in AEB-L, maybe it would only be 1 in 100 with 12c27. I don't know. I'm just thinking out loud here. But if you're experimenting 12c27 is definitely worth a look.

As for demand, I'd be interested...not right now as I'm tapped out :(, but I can definitely see a spot for it in my life, haha.

And thank you for the update!
 
Re: cost... indeed that's a factor. It's weird; I know people who will happily pay $200 for a nice custom bushcrafter, but not for a handmade machete... :confused:

ETA: lest anyone get the wrong impression, what you guys are saying really does make a lot of sense... seems to me like these alloys would be excellent choices for this application (and more), not just because they're "cheap". As we've covered, AEB-L is very highly-regarded for top-end kitchen cutlery.
 
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james terrio said:
Re: cost... indeed that's a factor. It's weird; I know people who will happily pay $200 for a nice custom bushcrafter, but not for a handmade machete... :confused:

ETA: lest anyone get the wrong impression, what you guys are saying really does make a lot of sense... seems to me like these alloys would be excellent choices for this application (and more), not just because they're "cheap". As we've covered, AEB-L is very highly-regarded for top-end kitchen cutlery.
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I had to drop the price down on my machetes to 200 to get them to sell. It is amazing how people wont think twice about paying that much for a hunter from the same materials.

Truth be told my machetes are my lowest profit item. They use about 5 times the steel and kydex, twice the handle material and about 3x the belts of a 5 inch knife. Add in the DHT which is 10 a blade and the huge shipping costs and theres not much left to take home.

People associate machete with cheap and thats a problem. The machetes we custom makers create are a whole different beast than a $15 made in china piece of rejected sheet metal you buy at walmart.

Sorry that turned into a rant. But im going to keep making machetes because I really think its the most tool you can get for the money and is a game changer for guys who need a dependable tool.
 
I like machetes too, but I haven't made any yet, for exactly the reasons you describe. Like you said, hunters are just a lot easier to sell and way more profitable.

The good news is, you don't have a lot of competition when it comes to really good ones.
 
I love Aeb-L. Below is a picture of a knife I call the backwoods companion. I made it with .136 AEB-L. Which is the thickest Alpha sells. It has a Bos heat treat and c ryo, then tempered to 61rc.

uploadfromtaptalk1393049715216.jpg
 
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Was hoping to see some more discussion. I have been wanting to find a parang/machete that was somewhat more resistant to corrosion. Has AEB-L not panned out or have folks just lost interest?
 
I could make you one. If you're interested use the contact info. listed below to get in touch with me.
 
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