AEB-L & O1 Edge Retention

Something that hasn't been mentioned is that Makers Love working with it because AEB-L is Very versatile.It's more of a Maker's Steel, more than a Users steel, in some ways.... I've said this before, if I was "on a deserted Is." I'd be totally happy making knives out of Just AEB-L. I can't think of too many steels that can make pretty much every type of knife...?

I can make a Chef, a fillet, a Survival, a Sword, a Chopper, an edc, a Dagger.......and so on.

In fact, a Hunter is probably it's least likely build........ 😜
but Everything else, It's Perfect!
 
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Alberta Ed said:
Greasy, gritty hide on moose and bear will take the edge off just about any steel, even high carbide super steels. Low carbide high carbon or stainless steels are easier to touch up in the field. D2 for some reason seems to hold up well when field dressing.
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I've heard this too about grease....I never knew that?
A guy at work used a little caping knife I made him out of PHB material (M2/HSS) he was dressing the bear for some 6-8 hours. Even though the blade shape wasn't designed for that, it stayed very sharp. He said the grease is hard on knives.
 
Crag the Brewer said:
I've heard this too about grease....I never knew that?
A guy at work used a little caping knife I made him out of PHB material (M2/HSS) he was dressing the bear for some 6-8 hours. Even though the blade shape wasn't designed for that, it stayed very sharp. He said the grease is hard on knives.
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Usually there is a lot of embedded grit, sand, etc., adhering to the greasy hide.
 
tony281sc2 said:
The question for me would be why isn’t AEB-L (or 14C28N) More popular than 1095 in fixed blades?
They both have better edge retention and toughness over 1095, and they are stainless too. Yet Tops and Esse both stick to 1095 for most of their knives. The cost can’t be all that much different.
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Simple carbon steels are abundant, they are used for spring, railroad, structures. Same thing for some tool steels and ball bearing steels. AEB-L was created for a rather niche purpose of being razor steel, which take time to accumulate stock. It's like how aircraft grade aluminum is cheap because they produce a lot for aircraft industry.

Outside of steel slobs, many people still have the stigma of edge retention is solely about carbon content and stainless can't hold edge. Many knife makers still use that to sell knives.
 
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I like AEBL , it gets the job done, no rust and easy to resharpen. I have hunted for 50 years and used a Randall for several years. Picked up a small edc from Duck Childress in D2 about 10 years ago or so and it was an amazing knife cleaning deer. Held an edge, super easy to resharpen, never did see any corrosion on it. I quit hunting and sold the knife here,back from whence it came. AEBL and D2 are some nice steel. M390 is my choice on every buy if it’s available.
 
I’ve made a lot of kitchen knives from AEBL. Users seem to appreciate the fine edge it takes and easy of sharpening. Most high end kitchen knife buyers are more concerned with geometry than having the latest super steel. I agree with them, and think it’s an excellent steel overall.
 
I think what makes AEB-L so popular is its balance. Edge holding is not the end all that some think it is. I've related this story many times in these pages but probably yet again won't hurt. I've done enough shows and talked to enough potential customers that I can tell if a guy looking at my knives in my booth is coming at them as a cowboy or as a hunter. First thing a hunter asks is "How well does it hold an edge?" First thing a cowboy, buckaroo, rancher etc asks if "How easy is it to resharpen." Coming from that background myself I can tell ya if you've got a 150 calves to do by lunch time it doesn't matter what your knife is made of its gonna be needing a touch up or resharpening. AEB-L really fits the bill for both. Sure there are steels that hold an edge better but can ya touch them up by stropping on your chaps, or the top of the truck window or the bottom of that old coffeee mug? AEB-L shines here.

Recently worked in a collaboration with two extremely experienced and successful professional elk guides Together we designed a new model for me that I call The Elk Guide. Add a little here, take off a lil there, that kinda deal. Both said the most important thing is being able to "steel" the knife partway through an animal and keep on going. As one put it:" I'm on some sidehill with a big bull we have down, it's getting dark, starting to snow and I'm part way through. I want to be able to steel that blade and be back in business now."

AEB-L just works. I have made many, many many, knives in AEB-L. If it wasn't working I'd of heard about it by now. Everything from kitchen knives to leather crafting roundknives and everything in between! Heck have another hundred plus I'm getting ready to send off to HT, (62-63 RC), It works.

Boars are kinda like bears and moose. Like cutting through mud soaked sandpaper that's been allowed to dry. First blood for the new Elk Guide:

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These two are literally on an elk hunt right now.

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Others, a couple of Cowboys:

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My roundknife is one tool that is never put away. I have two that live on my leather bench one on each side. I literally use these guys for hours at a time.

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On leather it's not so much when they start to drag but when they start to slip. Literally a couple seconds on a buffer and back past hair splitting. They see a belt or stone maybe every 6 months or so. Probably not even that often. See that maroon colored cutting board? I have to use that under my roundknives as they are too sharp and will get stuck in the roller mat designed for razorblades.

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Cutting out welts:

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AEB-L just works:

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As others mentioned great in the kitchen too. Recent set of steak knives made for one of the guides to give his parents as a Christmas gift:

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I hate AEB‑L. It takes all the challenge out of life. Want cutting to be a workout? Nope, effortless slicing. Want to struggle sharpening your knife when it does need it? Too bad, AEB‑L embraces any sharpening method and laughs at dullness. As a maker, hoping to be limited by steel choice? Sorry, this stuff is so bland it works for everything. If you value suffering and frustration, stay far, far away. AEB‑L will ruin your life like it ruined mine.
 
Lots of fanfare for AEB-L here but I know I am not the only one who does not like it for a hunting knife... I even make many knives out of AEB-L and 14C28N but if someone primarily wants the knife for game processing there are better steels.

The biggest animal I butchered from field to freezer was a free range heritage pig that weighed 560 pounds. The farm has swamp mud wallows so she was about as dirty as they come.

It was right after Magnacut came out so just used a single Magnacut knife, 63Rc, for testing. Yes it needed to be sharpened after I was done but still was able to slice newspaper. AEB-L would of not even came close to this level of performance.

I often get the feeling that the majority of people who hang out on forums like this collect way more than they actually use their tools.
 
I don’t have a hunting knife in it and coarse wet nasty fur and fat are the worst but the way my little river hawk handles dirty corrugated cardboard and plastic straps and rope and canvas in warehouses and in the field (I work for a utility company) I’d say it wouldn’t be horrible for it. It sharpens really easily. I even used it in a pinch to strip some coated 4solid for one of the linemen.
 
S Seedy Lot , in war, sometimes you need special forces, like your Green Berets (3V), or Navy Seal snipers (Maxamet), but there are times when the Marines are just what the mission needs. Guess who they are in my analogy.
 
Seedy Lot said:
Lots of fanfare for AEB-L here but I know I am not the only one who does not like it for a hunting knife... I even make many knives out of AEB-L and 14C28N but if someone primarily wants the knife for game processing there are better steels.

The biggest animal I butchered from field to freezer was a free range heritage pig that weighed 560 pounds. The farm has swamp mud wallows so she was about as dirty as they come.

It was right after Magnacut came out so just used a single Magnacut knife, 63Rc, for testing. Yes it needed to be sharpened after I was done but still was able to slice newspaper. AEB-L would of not even came close to this level of performance.

I often get the feeling that the majority of people who hang out on forums like this collect way more than they actually use their tools.
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Oh yeah, Magnacut is brilliant. I've used it to clean wild hogs and enjoyed results similar to yours. It is a bit more expensive than AEB-L and takes a little more effort to sharpen (at least for me), so Magnacut might not be the perfect choice for everyone while AEB-L still works. I, for one, like having the option to use either depending on my mood and tasks for the day.
 
DeadboxHero said:
The CATRA chart shows when variables are isolated to show what steels have more cutting edge retention which is extremely helpful to understand how things work.

In use outside of a controlled testing, geometry has a big effect and is a huge variable for cutting edge retention, cutting ability and durability.

Roman Landes and Cliff Stamp have argued and preached for over +20 years that the "geometry cuts"

Meaning you should technically be able to take a steel like AEB-L and maximize the HT to increase the edge stability and "cheat" by using a much thinner geometry then could be used with other steels.

However, where it gets lost in translation is people often use the AEB-L steel too soft to take advantage of this or only chase the maximum hardness at a consequence of poor microstructure making up that hardness.

We can use the CATRA equation Dr Larrin created using a regression formula based on years of data to see the effects of geometry.

TCC (mm) = -157 + 15.8*Hardness (Rc) – 17.8*EdgeAngle(°) + 11.2*CrC(%) + 14.6*CrVC(%) + 26.2*MC(%) + 9.5*M6C(%) + 20.9*MN(%) + 19.4*CrN(%)


Using the regression formula you can "sandbox" the relationships and behaviors of the different Steels.

You input the included edge angle, HRC, carbide type and carbide volume.

We can take two different steels at the opposite ends of the spectrum and see how they sperate and match each other.

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That is the power of geometry.
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I think that regression model is incredibly accurate for getting edge retention from the steel composition at the edge angle Larrin typically uses for his CATRA tests but not particularly robust for other edge angles. For example, here is the edge retention vs edge angle for CPM-154 and 154CM:

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Using the regression model from 20 to 40 degrees you get a TCC decrease of 356, but in reality it's almost double that for this steel. The relationship is not particularly linear, and the regression model is more accurate for larger edge angles, but this only reinforces your point that geometry is even more influential on edge retention than blade steel.

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ShaiHulud said:
AEB-L is a steel that works great for both heavy choppers and fine cutting knives, heat treated well its an amazing steel and a wonderful choice for a custom piece. I know battle horse knives primarily used O1 steel and while its tough and is a decent cutter it needs more maintenance because it can stain or rust if moisture is left on it. I believe for that reason people may choose AEB-L over O1 and is why more custom knife makers prefer it over O1, if for no other reason being more popular. Example is LT Wright AEB-L knives sell out super fast while the A2 pieces may linger for a good while longer.
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O1 rusts just by looking at it. I really think the whole O1 movement was popularized by Ray Mears and Alan Wood... all of the "bushcraft" knife makers started heavily leaning on it after that. AEB-L is my favorite steel for a woods knife but I still use a lot of 80crv2.
 
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