all round gun for self-defence and survival

If you want stopping power..... the Barrett .50 will stop anything short of a charging sperm whale.

For similar stopping power in a smaller/lighter package, check out the Alaskan Guide lever action, in .50 Alaskan.

Otherwise, I would recommend the good ole' Remington 870 12 ga, or a Winchester 94 in .30-30. Can't go wrong with one of these.

TheSurvivalist
 
Temper,

The weight of the ammo in such a circumstance isn't all that important. He isn't planning to fight a war only do some hunting/defending. On my Alaska hunt last year I carried a .30-06, .41 magnum, and a .22 revolver. On my person I carried 18 rounds of '06, 18 of .41 mag, and a box of .22 lr for the revolver in the backpack. The rounds I actually used on the hunt were three rounds of .30-06, and about a box of .22 lr.

In a defensive situation if you survive two shotgun reloads then you are a true life action adventure hero. Most situations resolve themselves with few shots fired. Actually most defensive gun uses are resolved with no shots fired, but you can't count on that. Ammo is always a good thing but you don't need a backpack full of it unless you are in a war. Mac
 
Sorry I misread or skipped the first part too fast.

I thought we were talking about an all round survival gun for an undetermined time on your own.

If it was an all rounder in a survival situation where resupply could be a long way off what calibre would you guys suggest?
 
That would depend on if I am moving or staying in one place. Staying in one place where I would have room to stash ammo it would be still the 12 gauge. But maybe I would consider a .22 Hornet/12 gauge o/u combinatin with a decent supply of ammo + reloading equipment/powder/caps/ bullets etc. for the .22 Hornet.
.22 Hornet because its precise, small, packs more punch than the .22 magnum, for reloading you need very little powder.
While moving probably a .308 /.22l.r. combo
In both cases the bigger caliber would be mainly for self defense, for hunting I would try to use the small bore caliber when ever possible.
But it depends on the situation. Without danger from wild critters it would be a smallbore rifle in one of the mentioned calibers.
Also depends, like I mentioned in this tread before, where I am. Artic, Desert ?
In both cases I rather take a o/u combination rifle(2 rifled barrels) like .308 + .22 hornet
 
Will said:
I am starting to get into shooting, and want to start getting into hunting. I am looking from advice from those of you who are avid hunters. I work in the backcountry where many people carry guns for self-defence against polar and grizzly bears. An ideal first firearm for me would be something for self-defence that would also be good for survival hunting should I be stuck spending a few unplanned nights out.
Will
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If you're fighting off bear it will probably be at close range. The 12 gage would be my choice. Half a box of 6s and a box of slugs and hope you never need to use them. For hunting, specalized weapons are more appropriate,but as long as money is tight and one gun is all you can have right now get a 12gage. You can always get more guns later.:)
 
my grandpa carries a 357 w/ 6 rnd cylinder, 2 slug bullets for bigger animals, 2hollow points for big people, and 2 bird or snake shot for well snakes or birds or dogs or wolfes or small rabid rabbits or anything you can put down with a shot type of bullet
 
My two cents worth.

My first choice for a survival firearm is the FN Five-Seven. It is very lightweight even when loaded with a twenty round magazine. It shoots flat to 200+ yards. 200 rounds of spare ammo weigh about the same as 50 rounds of 9mm. Being a former Marine Corps Staff Sergeant I am a firm believer in shot placement.

I am not going to argue the effectiveness of a 12 ga slug. What I will argue is the weight of the weapon and the ammo. The lighter your load, the faster one can move and the less it will slow you down.
 
Yep, McBros .50 Cal is an all around weapon. You can kill deer, moose, elk, caribou, bear, elephant, rhino...you can even stop a car and keep a small airplane from taking off! :eek:
 
LSkylizard said:
Yep, McBros .50 Cal is an all around weapon. You can kill deer, moose, elk, caribou, bear, elephant, rhino...you can even stop a car and keep a small airplane from taking off! :eek:
Click to expand...

You'd be surprised at how large a plane you can stop with the .50...:eek: :D ;)
 
LSkylizard said:
Yep, McBros .50 Cal is an all around weapon. You can kill deer, moose, elk, caribou, bear, elephant, rhino...you can even stop a car and keep a small airplane from taking off! :eek:
Click to expand...


I was actually commenting on the quality of the Mcmillin rifle not the caliber. If I buy a 50BMG I would buy one from them. They are about the oly company who sell one with a wood stock.
 
Will said:
I am starting to get into shooting, and want to start getting into hunting. I am looking from advice from those of you who are avid hunters. I work in the backcountry where many people carry guns for self-defence against polar and grizzly bears. An ideal first firearm for me would be something for self-defence that would also be good for survival hunting should I be stuck spending a few unplanned nights out.

For a night out, I probably wouldn't be looking to shoot large game, and though a small caliber rifle like .22 would be good for little things like squirrels, I don't think it would be suitable for bear defence. A larger caliber like a 30-06 might not be the best choice for survival though. One guy I worked with carries a small 12 gauge shotgun loaded with slugs for bears, and carries shots for survival purposes. His thinking is that the slugs will stop a polar bear, and the shots can be good for hunting small game and birds should weather or some other unforseen factor prevent the helecopter pick-up at the end of day.

What do you guys think about this?

Will
Click to expand...

Your friend at work is dead on. I used to live and work out of Fairbanks Alaska and this is the preferred backcountry weapon. It doesn't raise the eyebrows of the canadian gummint like a hand gun would and more than meets your survival/self defense needs.

The only addition I would like to see in a survival situation is a .22 rifle. Maybe you could coordinate that with your work partners? You bring a 10/22 and he brings the shotgun? Otherwise just pack along another 12 guage.

For purely self defense in Alaska the preferred weapon was a .44 handgun. Usually in a chest holster. Potent self defense and could be used for hunting in a pinch with proper ammo selection. I am not sure that is a legal possibility in Canada though.
 
Hiya cOLD,
I think you are referring to the Savage Model 24. It is available (at different times) in .410, 20 and 12 gauge lower barrel and the over barrel is available in .22 LR, .22 Win Mag rimfire, .223, .30-30 and (I think) even a few others. It is only a single shot for each barrel of course, so I am not sure it would be all that great for a bear defense gun, although a .30-30 170 grain backing a 12 gauge slug may work out pretty okay.

Conquer yourself first, all else will follow.
KJM
 
Hiya Will,
If you are stuck with Kanada's Stoopid rules about handguns, you are going to be kinda limited.

The 12 gauge shotgun with both slugs and shot in bear country is a good idea. If you could carry a handgun as well a .22 revolver, specifically a Ruger Super Single Six in stainless steel, with both a .22 Long Rifle and .22 Win Mag Rimfire cylinder would be great for small game and economy. The .22 WMRF loaded with solids makes a pretty good impression even on big brutes (four legged type) with head (end of nose or eyeball shots) or neck/spine shots. With Magnum Hollow Points you can add defense against two legged big brutes and add chest (heart, lung and thoracic spine) shots to your repertoire to the above list.

If you are interested in centerfire rifles instead of the scattergun, I would start with the Marlin or Puma stainless leverguns. For just flat out easy shooting and versatility the .357 Magnum is great, but light for big bears, although not a blunt spear by any means, especially with 180+ grain hardcast bullets at high velocity. The .44 Magnum is more power and more recoil, but with .44 Specials for small edible game, it does pretty good on both ends, with a lot more authority on the top end for serious stompin’ power. Above these, the .454 Casull in the Puma Model 1892 is kinda the same, .45 Colt squib loads for lightweight tasty critters with little meat damage and +P .45 Colt on up to the full house .454 Casull loadings for big bruiser bruins. The Puma is also available in a 16 inch barreled carbine and that makes it just about as handy as a pistol. Just be aware that as you change loads you will be changing your bullet impact point as well. Handloading can make this less of a problem, as you can tailor your loads to your needs and your guns sights (sometimes). With factory ammo, you just have to learn where your gun shoots with a couple different loads. Keep it simple if you go this route, don’t go more than two different loadings, it’ll give ya headaches.

There are others (.30-30, .45-70, .450 Marlin, .475 Linebaugh / .480 Ruger, bolt actions, autoloaders, .308, .30-06, .338 WinMag, .375 H&H, .458 Winchester, just to name a measly few) and if that suits you, go for it. Part of gun ownership should be that you get to own and shoot a firearm that you enjoy and like. Something that I might love to death may be a complete Ho-Hum to you, and what gets your metabolism going may not trip my trigger. So find something you LIKE! Just remember, no matter how big a gun you shoot, if you miss, it doesn’t matter one bit what’s stamped on the barrel. A .416 Rigby is worth less than a .22 if the first is a miss and the other goes down the optic nerve canal.

You can carry extra rounds for any of these shootin’ irons in buttcuffs. The shotgun can carry 5 or 6 extra, the lever carbines up to 18 or 20, if you double stack the rounds butt to butt, centered inside the cuff’s 9 (most common) or 10 elastic sleeves.

Ideally, I would go with a Levergun / Revolver combo in the same caliber (.45 Colt / .454 Casull for my personal choice) and then a .22 pistol backup. The big bore sixgun may not get a lot of use in the hunting or defense department versus the carbine, but I don’t live in Kanada and am free to carry a sidearm and prefer it that way. I also don’t much care for shotguns. See what I mean about shooting what you LIKE!

Best of luck to you. Shoot early, shoot straight and shoot often.

Conquer yourself first, all else will follow.
KJM
 
My vote goes to the Ruger Mini-Thirty (7.62x39mm).
More accurate than the SKS or AK varients IMO.

Good luck,
Allen.
 
I would suggest a 12ga 3in magnum Kalashnikov variant like this as far as shotguns go,it's as light as a Benelli but mag fed and AK reliable

http://www.hunt101.com/showphoto.php?photo=351866&size=big&password=&sort=7&thecat=500

In regards to a Ruger Mini-Thirty(7.62x39mm) it is a low profile sedate image weapon that appeals to conservative type but it is not as accurate,reliable,well supported or inexpensive asmost of the midrange AK47's available today.

I personally like the registered SBR mini-AK loaded with custom 198gr soft points and a suppressor,it has higher enery than a handloaded 44Mag,can hold 20-75rds and is reputedto be the most reliable repeater money can buy,period.

http://www.hunt101.com/showphoto.php?photo=344854&size=big&password=&sort=7&thecat=500
 
Avoid the stockless pistol grip configuration unless you plan to hunt alligators in the sewer system. These give the illusiuon of portability but drastically reduce the effectiveness of the gun. I only mention that because I have seen them carried that way for bear defense and I think it is a mistake.
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For people lacking true gun experiance, I've seen people make some amazing shots with my Berg 500. pistol grip, nada for a stock. Fired from waist level, most people can pick it up, and hit stuff.. it's apparently a more "natural" way to fire a weapon. Mine's loaded with bean bags, and is here for my girl's defese when I'm not home.

When I'd go bow hunting in Canada, or even in the Adirondaks, I'd carry a .45 pistol of some type. Against a charging bear.. I'd lean more towards a mini-30 ... I'd just like to see it survive 20 7.62 rounds.
 
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