Anyway to tighten loose blade play besides tightening the pivot?

colubrid

colubrid

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Nov 26, 2005
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. What causes the loose blade play on new Emersons knives? is it the washers are to small?

What i keep hearing is the there is a bit of play in all Emersons. But when you tighten the pivot screw. It gets to tight to wave out.

So what do most of you do? Just get used to the loose balde and live with it? Or are there other fixes?


Also does anyone have an Emerson with a completly tight lockup (no side to side play)and super loose blade that you can swing open?

Just wondering cause I have been on an Emerson buying binge and I am starting to see a pattern.
 
I could not get either my new QCQ-7 or -8 to that sweet spot where it is loose enough to be flickable, but tight enough for no blade play. I prefer no blade play over flickablility, so I keep them just a tad tight and Loctite them down.

I just got a user/beater Blackbird (?), and it is worn in enough to be flickable with no blade play. So maybe its the new knives that give us a little grief when looking for that sweet spot.
 
I have no problem with my Super Commander,
I can even snap it out from full close with just
a flick of the wrist and lockup is super tight, I think
it's because it is a larger heavier blade because my
P-Sark was always a trade off between tight blade
and side to side blade play. Up and down play is not
a problem in either of mine.
 
Okay so the smaller models the blade is tighter? Or has to be super tight or there will be blade play?

I just got a new MINI CQC-7 in today and it has side to side play. I have to tighten up so hard it hurts my thumb to open.

Is there some type of fix for this? I have never taken one apart. But would different thinkness washrs make it tighter?

Seems strange to me that Emersons are loose but when Bencmade colabration with Emerson they were tight as a drum and you could lossen the blades up and they still have no play. What is Emerson doing different from the benchmade 975 and 970?


I also see something inbewteen/ or near the washers on Emersons that i don't see on the original colabroations 970 and 975. It looks like some sort of hook is sticking near the washer on the emersons to keep the blade pressed up (?). Anyone know what i am talking about?
 
50% of Emersons I have bought have this issue. You can loctite it, but trust me, it always finds a way to get loose in the long run.

I eventually dropped the brand sadly even though these are very cool knives. The indecisive pivot was just too much. I still wear the apparel though!

What I did was just tighten the knife with my thumbnail until it was perfect, and when it loosens you just redo it... repeat indefinitely.

I used to have a BM970 with the liner ALL the way to the right, and it still didn't have any side to side play and action was smooth as glass... I have no idea what changed but they almost feel like they're not even related.

The liner is actually touching the other liner.. BM sent the next owner a free replacement liner which was very generous and the knife was restored to full working order just like the day it was made nearly 20 years ago..
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Ive got the same problem with all my emerson's exept for my mini cqc15 2011 edition....this one is thight as a....
 
It's not a new problem... unfortunately it's just something you expect when buying an Emerson these days, they're still very tough and dependable and cool, but they're falling behind in the fit and finish department.

I had a 2001 Commander with the thinner liners and the knife was perfect, it almost felt like THAT was the 2010 I had, and that the new ones were not as good.

The screws have a tendency to bore out the liners as well since the screws tap into the liners as opposed to going into a standoff of some sort like what Spyderco does with their screw construction knives. This is all constructive criticism, I am not out to destroy Emerson knives, I wear their shirts nearly on an everyday basis.

Something needs to change... the reason their knives sell is through massive word of mouth presence on the internet, hence Emerson Knives not spending a dime on advertisement or paid reviews of any sort and their customer service is truly fabulous. But the hardware used to put such a fantastic knife design together is somewhat lacking. Again, you could buy a Benchmade instead, it wouldn't be nearly as cool, but it also wouldn't loosen out on you from day to day work.

Should I have to loctite a $150 knife? Heavens no. Not that I mind, but if I was out in the field with these, I doubt I'd have access to it... but I do appreciate that the screws are all standard type instead of torx.

The reason they loosen up is because of the size of the pivot screw.. it's a rather large one and due to the larger surface patch, it tends to exert more friction and therefore it's more liable to wiggle it's way out. Again it's a flathead, I've tightened mine with a credit card before. Ease of maintenance is clearly preferred to lack of maintenance with this design.

I've owned 8 Emerson knives, most of them had some sort of pivot loosening issue, loctite will prolong the time between tightenings, but not cure the problem. Blue loctite is still pliable... even red loctite is.... just much less so.
 
I take all my emersons apart and clean them. Then I find out where the sweet spot is where it locks up tight, but still open smooth. then I drop some blue loctite on it and use the crap out them. I do this to all my knives emersons included. All my emersons are fairly smooth and stay locked up tight, and I use them hard. My smoothest opening Emerson though is my Super 8!!
 
one of the first things i do is take it apart and give it a cleaning and lube.

i use plumbers tape on the pivot so that it doesnt loosen over time.
and if it does, i can fingernail tighten it.

i tighten the pivot to the point where there is no blade play, and it can still be dropped, and wrist flicked out easily.
thumb flicking does not work on mine, but then again ive never been any good at flicking out any blade whether it has thumb stubs, disc, or holes.

oh, and you dont have to torque down the screws really hard. these are small screws and can strip easily.
 
I am not talking about the pivot screw getting loose and using locktight. Gosh i wish that was the only problem and solution.

i am talking about Emerson knives where you have to tighten the pivot screw so tight to keep and wiggle out the blade hardly moves. As soon as you lossen it a tad, then there is side to side play.

I have several now and it is real annoying. There is NO SWEET SPOT!! Sheesh .., I wish!

BTW my Benchmade 970's and 975's i picked. No problem.

That is why i think that Emerson did something different. If you have a Benchmade 970 or 975, look inbetween the pivot area and compare that to a Emerson CQC-7. There you will see some weird piece they added. I think that is where the problem is.
 
Flash Owl said:
i tighten the pivot to the point where there is no blade play, and it can still be dropped, and wrist flicked out easily.
.
Click to expand...

I havn't found that to be possible.. There is to much drag once they get to the point of zero side side play.
 
Just to be clear. On my original post I was not referring to the pivot screw loosening on its own.

I was referring to blade play if you don't tighten the pivot screw so tight the blade drags.


After reading it I can see how it can be taken both ways.
 
OH no no the answer to that is literally just using them...

The reason when you tighten them to the point of no play and it's hard to deploy is because the ball detent is rather large on an Emerson... if you take it apart and "tweak" it VERY VERY slightly you'll get smoother action. My CQC7 felt like glass after this treatment. Less tweaking is better... just the slightest bit will do a world of difference since it's just a break-in thing
 
since you mentioned you havent taken one apart yet....
the washers are not metal, its a silicone type material. emerson says its "self lubricating".
so because it not metal it can be compressed and maybe thats why it feels like it has side play.
the inherit design of folders doesnt help that either because the blade is held down on 1 end, and you can get alot of leverage going side to side.

EDIT: the washers are made of nylatron. from what i found out, its nylon+teflon.
 
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Flash Owl said:
since you mentioned you havent taken one apart yet....
the washers are not metal, its a silicone type material. emerson says its "self lubricating".
so because it not metal it can be compressed and maybe thats why it feels like it has side play.
the inherit design of folders doesnt help that either because the blade is held down on 1 end, and you can get alot of leverage going side to side.
Click to expand...

Did the Benchmade 970 and 975 have these silicon washers?
 
Got my super karambit last week, noticed significant blade play. Simply took it apart, lubed the washers with Tetra gun grease, scotch brite the liners, adjusted the detent slightly, reassembled, VERY little amount of loctite red 271. Presto! Blade play is completely gone, smooth as butter motion. :D

OH, also anodized the titanium liner so now its nice and greenish/ blue :)
 
Well #1 can you post some pics. Espcially want to see the liner.

Also why did you use the red loctite? I thought the red was permamnent and needs to be heated to unlock , while the blue can break free? I use the blue. Does anyone else use the red loctite?
 
WhiskyJar said:
Got my super karambit last week, noticed significant blade play. Simply took it apart, lubed the washers with Tetra gun grease, scotch brite the liners, adjusted the detent slightly, reassembled, VERY little amount of loctite red 271. Presto! Blade play is completely gone, smooth as butter motion. :D

OH, also anodized the titanium liner so now its nice and greenish/ blue :)
Click to expand...

BTW i did that with a couple of mine and it made it worse. What happened was the blade leans furrther after cleaning and lube. I also did one last night that had the lockbar at 25% BEFORE I took her apart and cleaned. Not the lockbar sits over at 75%-80%. Sheeesh! Blade wiggle is still there unless i tighten down so much that the blade hardly moves.
 
colubrid said:
Well #1 can you post some pics. Espcially want to see the liner.

Also why did you use the red loctite? I thought the red was permamnent and needs to be heated to unlock , while the blue can break free? I use the blue. Does anyone else use the red loctite?
Click to expand...


Here is the anodized liner I did.

liner.jpg


I used blue before, and it works great, quite honestly probably blue would have been fine, but red gives me more peace of mind. Yes its permanent.... but.... only if you use a lot, I dabble a with a toothpick around 1 or 2 threads. I've taken the knife apart several times and it takes a good amount of effort. Every time I have to take a brush to scrape off the loctite before reassembling the knife.

I've taken this knife apart about 10 times already and works flawlessly each time I assembled it. If something is worst or not right, then you probably did something wrong. The parts are pretty simple and straight foward. Just washers, screws and metal fittings. Care to post some photos of the joints? Dont forget to adjust the detent. That has a lot to do with the friction you get when the blade operates. Also use quality grease/ oil. I use tetra gun grease (white tube) its smooth as milk. Zero blade and smooth operation, the detent lightly engages, knife is wrist flickable past the detent.

One last thing, when applying the grease/ oil apply it sparingly. 1/2 drop per washer is plenty. Better to be too little than too much. Excess oil/ grease can cause problems down the line when dirt/ debris build up around the joints.
 
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WhiskyJar said:
I've taken this knife apart about 10 times already and works flawlessly each time I assembled it. If something is worst or not right, then you probably did something wrong. The parts are pretty simple and straight foward. Just washers, screws and metal fittings. Care to post some photos of the joints? Dont forget to adjust the detent. That has a lot to do with the friction you get when the blade operates. Also use quality grease/ oil. I use tetra gun grease (white tube) its smooth as milk. Zero blade and smooth operation, the detent lightly engages, knife is wrist flickable past the detent.
Click to expand...

How are you adjusting the detent? Can you provide a brief explanation?
 
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