AR-RPM9 Thread

I recently re-profiles an Artisan Arroyo and found the process surprisingly easy. 34 degrees using a KME system with standard diamond stones… I’m no genius at sharpening but it took a very fine edge and polish with less effort than Vg10 or D2. 9cr18mov was similar.
 
dirc said:
you'd think with all the trouble of getting a patent, they'd come up with something with more than 0.1% vanadium...
if the other rare earth is Nb, then it could be more interesting... but if its just a pm version 9cr18mov then I don't get it

I wouldn't pay a premium for it, personally
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So basically kinda like CPM S.01V?



Sorry, couldn’t resist. 🙃
 
Chronovore said:
The uncommon thing here is the price. This is a PM version of an already decent budget steel. They're using it in budget knives at budget prices.

Some of these models are priced very similarly to the initial Civivi offerings in 9Cr18Mov. I'm curious to see how the steel compares. Michael Emler had positive things to say about the toughness and corrosion resistance. Does anyone do scientific or carefully controlled testing on those qualities? As far as edge retention, I'm sending a Sea Snake over to Outpost 76. (His 9Cr18Mov video is linked a few posts up.)
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AR-RPM9 is not PM version，it‘s still electric arc melted steel ，upgrading the chemistry base on 9Cr18MoV，PM is just marketing …..
 
KYN said:
AR-RPM9 is not PM version，it‘s still electric arc melted steel ，upgrading the chemistry base on 9Cr18MoV，PM is just marketing …..
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As far as I know, Artisan claims that AR-RPM9 is made through powdered metallurgy. Do you have a source that proves them wrong?

I've already been underwhelmed and disappointed in AR-RPM9. In cut tests, it isn't much better than regular 9Cr18Mov. It is definitely worse than 9Cr18Mov with a good heat treatment from WE.
 
Chronovore said:
As far as I know, Artisan claims that AR-RPM9 is made through powdered metallurgy. Do you have a source that proves them wrong?

I've already been underwhelmed and disappointed in AR-RPM9. In cut tests, it isn't much better than regular 9Cr18Mov. It is definitely worse than 9Cr18Mov with a good heat treatment from WE.
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The first PM production line in China is in Tiangong 2 years ago，they are ranking top 3 Chinese biggest mold steel manufacturer（volume point of view），brands such as Kubey use their D2 ，I can 100% sure to tell you they are not making the PM martensite steel yet as it‘s not their interest yet from they told me ，there’s no commercialized PM stainless steel in China yet，I know where is AR-RPM9 coming from，but sorry it‘s sensitive topic can‘t talk it in public，it’s not PM version ！！
 
what’s AR-RPM9 steel you ask? It’s a value priced powdered stainless steel. Apparently, Artisan wanted a powdered steel that functions somewhere between 14C28N and D2. They wanted the corrosion resistance of 14C28 with the hardness of D2 that not only holds an edge but is also easy to sharpen. Finally, they also wanted a steel they could provide at an affordable price.
 
Monofletch said:
what’s AR-RPM9 steel you ask? It’s a value priced powdered stainless steel. Apparently, Artisan wanted a powdered steel that functions somewhere between 14C28N and D2. They wanted the corrosion resistance of 14C28 with the hardness of D2 that not only holds an edge but is also easy to sharpen. Finally, they also wanted a steel they could provide at an affordable price.
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Except D2 and 14c28n can achieve and are typically run at nearly identical hardness (depending on the qualities you are looking for).

I haven’t had great results with ar-rpm9, and get better edge retention from knives with 8cr and a heat treat that is known to be good. I have doubts that it’s even a powdered version of 9cr. It just seems like regular 9cr with a poor heat treat to me.
 
AR-RPM9 performs like 9cr, I honestly dont notice the difference. They both perform better than 8cr, which in my experience rolls instead of "wear evenly". I hate 8cr13mov, I don't care who heat treats it :D

.....unless it's pricesd very provocatively lol

I dont notice AR making anything better, my Maileah behaves like any budget folder.

I notice currently 12c27 14c28n family steels are still a bit pricey compared their D2 counterpart. Now that CiWEvi and other overseas makers have started making knives out of them, and NitroV, their prices will start to come down because I do like them very much.

On a side note, anyone try CiWEvi's 10Cr15Mov/VG10? It's doing pretty well in my book, surprisingly tough in my elementum fixed, very stainless...its my pineapple knife lol.
 
I also have some Kubey is AUS10 that is holding up rather well. I have to admit the CruWear Adamas is damn near indestructible!
 
Monofletch said:
what’s AR-RPM9 steel you ask? It’s a value priced powdered stainless steel. Apparently, Artisan wanted a powdered steel that functions somewhere between 14C28N and D2. They wanted the corrosion resistance of 14C28 with the hardness of D2 that not only holds an edge but is also easy to sharpen. Finally, they also wanted a steel they could provide at an affordable price.
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check the microstructure of AR-RPM9 ，you will get your judgement if it looks like powdered steel or not ，the fact is AR-RPM9 is coming from a small tool steel manufacturer in east of China，the Chinese version VG10 is also coming from this factory，you can tailor made the steel composition you want at this mill，but they never claim they make a powdered stainless steel，they don’t have the equipment，it‘s electric arc steel .What Artisan is saying doesn’t means we need to take it 100% as truth，I can bet once China has a mill can make powdered martensite steel，you will soon find there’s Chinese “similar ”version of S35VN，M390，30V …in local market，but there isn't ，one mill can not survive if they only supply 30t of “powdered” steel to Artisan if they are powder steel manufacturer ，the production line cost around 40 million USD，check any expert who is in special steel industry in China，you will get your answer if China make powder martensite steel
 
KYN said:
check the microstructure of AR-RPM9 ，you will get your judgement if it looks like powdered steel or not ，the fact is AR-RPM9 is coming from a small tool steel manufacturer in east of China，the Chinese version VG10 is also coming from this factory，you can tailor made the steel composition you want at this mill，but they never claim they make a powdered stainless steel，they don’t have the equipment，it‘s electric arc steel .What Artisan is saying doesn’t means we need to take it 100% as truth，I can bet once China has a mill can make powdered martensite steel，you will soon find there’s Chinese “similar ”version of S35VN，M390，30V …in local market，but there isn't ，one mill can not survive if they only supply 30t of “powdered” steel to Artisan if they are powder steel manufacturer ，the production line cost around 40 million USD，check any expert who is in special steel industry in China，you will get your answer if China make powder martensite steel
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You are saying Artisan Cutlery is lying about their proprietary steel? I doubt they are…….
 
funny how the devil is always in the detail... I think I recall hearing something similar to what K KYN is saying...

my fuzzy memory says it was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacuum_arc_remelting
which, kinda could be called a 'pm' steel, (if you're a marketing executive type that stretches some word meaning/definitions...)

anyway, interesting rabbit hole in either case
 
Monofletch said:
You are saying Artisan Cutlery is lying about their proprietary steel? I doubt they are…….
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It‘s a modified electric arc steel base on 9Cr18MoV，people want to trust what they hope to see，that‘s fine，you can insist to trust it’s “PM steel”， It‘s not a difficult question to find out ，time will give you the truth . I only respect the truth …..
 
Calling VAR or ESR steel “powder metallurgy” would be false advertising. Those are not PM under any possible definition. So either Artisan is very confused or our friend here on the forum is.
 
I am just going by their website. I don’t know squat about grain structure and stuff like that. I will trust your expertise.

I copy and pasted straight from Artisan.
 
Nobody in China is calling an ESR /VAR steel as Powder Metallugy steel，they are thousands miles away from each other ，name is totally different ，I will notice you once China has it‘s own PM martensite steel ，but not yet so far
 
KYN said:
Nobody in China is calling an ESR /VAR steel as Powder Metallugy steel，they are thousands miles away from each other ，name is totally different ，I will notice you once China has it‘s own PM martensite steel ，but not yet so far
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are you sure they don't? Bohler-Uddeholm has been in China for a long time now, and they do PM steel

History - BÖHLER China

www.bohler.com.cn www.bohler.com.cn

in 2016 -> New factory of Bohler Special Steels (Shanghai) Co., Ltd. was inaugurated
 
dirc said:
are you sure they don't? Bohler-Uddeholm has been in China for a long time now, and they do PM steel

History - BÖHLER China

www.bohler.com.cn www.bohler.com.cn

in 2016 -> New factory of Bohler Special Steels (Shanghai) Co., Ltd. was inaugurated
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I‘m sure，Bohler Special Steel Shanghai only has cutting ，milling，heat treatment ，stock service etc.，it‘s a service center，they don‘t have melting facility in China or Asia，M390，N690 etc. is sold through Bohler Shanghai，but the steel is produced at Kapfenberg，Austria. Their sister comany Uddelhom do the same ，they sell the Swenden steel through Assab Shanghai -also a service center
 
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