Art Knives? Or Not?

Kevin Jones

Kevin Jones

Joined
Oct 28, 2006
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Thor I am; raised a good and valid point which is probably shared by many while posting on Coop's Guild Show thread regarding Don Hanson's Guild Show "Art Knife" award.

Thor I am said:
I like Don's knife. It is a beautiful bowie. I am a little perplexed about the art knife award though. No offense meant, I do think it is a beautiful knife, but "art knife" makes me think of Rigney and Warenski daggers, of Dwight Towell and Virgil England. Bowie's usually don't make me think "art knife" unless they are highly embellished with engravings and such. I congratulate Don on getting an award, I just wonder if this one makes sense. BTW, I like both the blade and handle on this knife :p
Click to expand...

I thought this subject deserves additional discussion without taking away from Coop's intention to review and display his photos of the Guild Show. So I hope him or Thor don't take offense to my starting this thread.

IMO, Fine Art implies not just fine embellishment, but artistic, unique and adventurous use of material and medium. And Don's selection and use of ivory as demonstrated here in utilizing the natural raw end supports this theory along with his signature single gold pin and his creative use of damascus guard and hammon patterns. Therefore making it very deserving of the award.

HansonArtKnife.jpg


I have often thought that we should broaden our definition of the term "Art Knife" to include more examples from traditional forgers such as Fisk (ant knife, boo daddy) Dunn, Dean, Hanson (many folders examples), Hancock (forth of july hunter from other thread), Fuegan and Hendrickson among others.

I'm very glad the AKI is moving towards this direction with forgers such as Tim Hancock, Larry Fuegan and now Harvey Dean being included as makers representation this highly respected show.

Do you generally consider pieces such as these examples below as "Art Knives" or just highly embellished pieces?

Please post other examples for discussion as you see fit.

Fisk Ants: A photo from David Darom's book "Custom Fixed-Blade Knives"
FiskAnts.jpg


Dean
Dean-Dguard.jpg


Hancock
Hancock1Bowie.jpg


Hanson
Hanson_Sinistre_07.jpg


Fuegan
Larry_Fuegan_MS-Damascus-Art-Dagger.jpg


Hendrickson
Hendrickson_HK01-ww.jpg
 
Those all are very sweet looking knives. Don's knife is outstanding and looks like it had been a user, in a past life. Great knives Kevin!
 
I think that the knives you posted here would fit the definition of "Art Knife", but I wonder how encompassing that definition should be? When I see some of the knives that have won Best Art Knife at shows, I have thought to myself that if that is an art knife then so are many of the others that were exhibited.
 
Art knife is a funny term. Of the forgers mentioned, I think that Mr. Fuegen has done the most of what many would call "art" knives. However, I wonder if there are a goodly number of folks who consider "art" and "unusable" to be the same thing when talking about "art" knives. Many art knives could be used in a pinch, but many more are pure abstact expressions that only remotely resemble a cutting tool. I think that the broader the defintition, the better. And congrats to Don :thumbup: I would love to know if his use of that unusual piece of ivory is what made the judges consider this piece to be an art knife? As for the Guild, good for them. After the troubles they had in the past, it is good to see them attracting more great makers back into the organization. That can only help all of us knife knuts.
 
Art, being in the eye of the beholder, or dictionary editor, can be many things.
If I say it's art, it's art to me.

art [ aart ]

noun
Definition:

1. creation of beautiful things: the creation of beautiful or thought-provoking works, e.g. in painting, music, or writing


2. beautiful objects: beautiful or thought-provoking works produced through creative activity


3. branch of art: a branch or category of art, especially one of the visual arts


4. artistic skill: the skill and technique involved in producing visual representations


5. study of art: the study of a branch of the visual arts


6. creation by humans: creation by human endeavor rather than by nature


7. techniques or craft: the set of techniques used by somebody in a particular field, or the use of those techniques
the art of the typographer


8. ability: the skill or ability to do something well
the art of conversation
 
In the broadest of terms any knife that is appreciated for it's artistic appeal rather than used as a tool or weapon could be considered an "Art Knife".
 
I think for the purpose of having their own category that art knives should have a defined meaning. I don't think they should have to be fantasy knives, but I do think they should have to have a good degree of embellishment.
 
How many makers wish to have their work defined simply as an 'Art Knife'. It may also be perfectly suited to the task, yet be artistic. In fact, wouldn't THAT be neat!

Needs embellishment..? :confused: How about the simplest of shapes defining an Art Knife:

orig.jpg


And yet this may be, ultimately, best-suited for utility. So which is it?

Where is the dividing line? Never ever going to happen.

Art knife:
standard.jpg


Non-art knife:
orig.jpg


Art Knife:
orig.jpg


Non-art knife:
orig.jpg


Lots of room for discussion here.

Coop
 
I would classify ALL the ABS forger's knives I posted as "Art Knives".

Coop, I would agree with your assessment on the ones you posted.
Particularly interesting is the Bona as some may see it as a simple utility and others (including myself) as a work of Art.

IMO, simple manipulation or provision of shape and/or material can instill Art, but ultimately its up to individual preference.
 
SharpByCoop said:
Art knife:
standard.jpg



Coop
Click to expand...

Here is some discussion for you.....that "knife" is a frikkin' abomination!:barf:

Tasteless, and completely indicative of what is wrong with much of America today.....expensive and shiny does not automatically equate to "art" or "style".

That is the Paris Hilton of knives, blonde, and attractive to some, but just absolutely skanky to the core. And the engraving is not very good, either.

It gives me a greasy, gagging experience.

The Mensch is simply beneath comment.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
I'm afraid I can't contribute much as, for me, the term "art knife" is essentially meaningless. Coop is spot on in observing that simple shapes and attractive lines can be very artistic indeed. And as STeven has indicated in his own inimitable way, and excess of gaudy embellishment may not. I just don't think the term lends itself to meaningfully defining or even describing a category of knives.

This thread brought back an experience I had at a CKG gathering some years ago, when one of the tactical guys looked over a knife of mine and said it was a real nice art knife. The knife in question was a Roger Massey carbon steel bowie with a maple handle and oval guard. When I asked what made it an art knife, he replied, "Well, it's got a fancy wood handle and a fancy (hand-rubbed satin) blade finish." Oooookay then.

Roger
 
Kohai999 said:
Here is some discussion for you.....that "knife" is a frikkin' abomination!:barf:

Tasteless, and completely indicative of what is wrong with much of America today.....expensive and shiny does not automatically equate to "art" or "style".

That is the Paris Hilton of knives, blonde, and attractive to some, but just absolutely skanky to the core. And the engraving is not very good, either.

It gives me a greasy, gagging experience.

The Mensch is simply beneath comment.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
Click to expand...

As is much of today's so called "Fine Art", but that doesn't mean its not ART to some. :barf:;)
 
STeven, I thought the 'Mensch' would be your kind of knife :D

Just to be clear. I didn't consider my big bowie/fighter an 'Art Knife'. I submitted it to the judging room and the judges labeled it so.

I also have a customer who calls my folders 'art folders', not a problem, as he's happy, I'm happy.

I've never thought of my knives as 'art knives'. These knives will be different things to different folks.
 
Do the larger knife shows that have award categories for art knives not have a defined parameter they use for each?? I can see how the definition of that category might vary from show to show. Roger is right in that it is hard to define, but those parameters must exist?

- Joe
 
An art knife is defined by the maker. The knife part is the canvas created to display the embellishment, either for admiration or ceremonial use with no intention for use as a knife. As for the art part, who knows? So much passes for art that is ridiculous in my eye but is bought, displayed and admired by others. I believe an art knife worthy of the term is one that does not have it's utility diminished by the embellishment or sacrifice utility for the sake of a weird profile. It's what separates an art knife from a nonfunctional replica of a knife (soft blade and weak tang) shown in the fantasy knife ads.

I see the subject as parallel with firearms: a highly engraved and inlayed sidelock SxS is not worth much if it can't be used to shoot a target even though the maker knew it would not LIKELY be fired. I once owned a beautifully engraved rifle with exquisite silver animal inlays that wouldn't shoot better than 4 MOA- I couldn't stand it and had to sell it before expending another several hundred dollars in ammo and gunsmithing trying to make it shoot. The embellishment , to me, became pointless. Regards, ss.
 
Much of what is refered to as art today....isn't.

IMO to be art, something must speak simply, eloquently, to
some inner beauty.

I think the Hanson does that.
 
I disagree. Russ. That art of which you speak is, in fact, art. However, this does not mean that it is GOOD art:D But "schlock art" is art, nonwithstanding its inherent aesthetic qualities. If all art had to conform to what the general public considers to be "art" then how would we have ever ended up with the Impressionists and many other modern painting styles that followed them? The Impressionists had to set up their own art show because the mainstream glarries and salons would not dispay their work. I suspect that many folks in mainstream America back in the 40's considered Jackson Pollack's work to be something that their kids could do with fingerpaints. Same thing with Warhol's soup cans. If you ever get a chance to see one, do so. Technically, they are very fine paintings. The subject matter is somewhat mundane. However, that was his intention.
 
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