bader vs kmg

M

medannyboyy

Joined
Jun 5, 2008
Messages
36
Hi yall im wonder what everyones thoughts and opions are on these two grinders and which is the best bang for the buck.
 
Hi medannyboyy.
Well this is a question a knife maker should ask be for making a purchase.
But it is subject that there are many opinions.
I would like to ask you;
What do you make your knives with now?
How many do you make a year?
If you plan to make only 10 knives neither machine will give you any " Bang for your Buck"
If you are in it for the Long haul the machine will pay off itself.
The KMG with what I like would cost over 2K.
2K. of profit will take me a while to make.
I will add more to this later.
Somebody is coming over to pick up a knife.
Have fun and learn all you can!!!!
 
You can get much more for your cash with a KMG if you're willing to put some of your own time and effort into it. Finding a motor, controller, mounting plate etc and making your own tooling arms can save you some money. Going with step pulleys over a speed controller can save you money if you require VS. If you get everything from Rob for a Cadillac KMG, it's not as much of a savings over the Bader, but still some.

The Bader comes with a small wheel but no platen in the base, the KMG comes with a platen but no small wheel in the base. The Bader is direct drive and the KMG is generally belt driven, folks have differing opinions on which is better. The Bader comes painted where the KMG does not.

I have experience with both machines and would highly recommend either. I feel that as soon as you "trick out" your KMG, the Bader becomes pretty much the same value. Imo, it's only if you decide to put the work in and DIY a couple things that the true savings come about with the KMG.
 
They're both great machines. Both are excellent. That being said, I am an advocate of the KMG. My reason for feeling that way is due to the customer service. Prior to ever hearing about the KMG, I had my heart set on a Bader B-III. I had saved the money to purchase a grinder...but there were certain things that I wanted (and I was willing to pay for what I wanted). I called Bader and told them my needs/wants, and that I was willing to spend the money to get what I wanted. The response I got was "if its not on the shelf, you won't get it from us". I thanked them for their time, and the next day I heard about Rob Frink and the KMG. I called Rob, and after a couple of days of calls and emails, he understood what I wanted, and was willing to work with me to ensure my needs were filled. I purchased the KMG with the customized options I wanted (the options can be seen here: http://www.caffreyknives.net/KMGarticle.html ) for A LOT less money than the standard B III would have cost. By the time I purchased a 3hp variable speed motor, controller, and a few other small items I needed, the total cost was less than $1,400.
In my mind, the major difference between the two machines is the customer service. That may seem pidly to some, but I have seen Rob overnight express a part for a KMG, at his expense. I know he takes a lot of time talking to people and helping them concerning the KMG, and just in general provides a level of customer service that is very hard to find these days. Each person is going to have their favorite, and either is an excellent choice, I just prefer the KMG for the reasons I mentioned.
 
I can add to my KMG alot more cost efficient than I can with any other brand. Period.....and I can even change parta out myself :)

Plus....I have the Ed Caffrey Platen system. Whats not to like about that!! Robs also the man! Great service.

That being said, I'd liek a Bader, just aint got the scratch :)
 
I'll shadow Ed's comments (this is getting predictable on my part ;) ).

Rob's service has always been way above and beyond.

I think the grinders themselves are VERY comparable... BOTH are Cadilacs. :)

Play with a B-III at the Vermont hammer-in and it is an EXCELLENT grinder. But so is Rob's machine.

I didn't really save money going with the KMG... I got it with all the bells and whistles, extra tooling arms, extra work rests, etc.... and it was about $2400 delivered. And worth all of that and more! :D

I accidentally ordered mine with the plain 10" wheel and I wanted the serrated. Rob made the switch very painless, just like when I decided I wanted the 6" drive wheel instead of the 4".

:thumbup:
 
ive done alot of research on the matter. after many nights pondering what grinder would fit my needs now and in 10 yers i chose the kmg. i actually got it yesturday and i am in the middle of assembling it. All i can say is the kmg is a very fine machine, very versatile something i choose over every other brand. I plan on making knives till im dead and the kmg just seemed like the right plan. Mr. Frink is very nice and helpful- i almost feel like i have a friend that i could count on for any problem i may have now and later.
 
I prefer the KMG for all the reasons above but also I had the opportunity to assemble both machines right out of the boxes. The Bader didnt track right which turned out to be the platen wasnt machined. It wasnt square. Robs KMG however went together and tracked like it was on rails. It took about an hour to true up the Bader (on my Burr King) and then took turns grinding with both machines. All of us agreed the KMG was heavier and more solid with no vibrations at all.

If I have a complaint of any kind about the KMG it arrives unpainted. I still want to hot gun blue mine when I get it.
 
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Both great machines. I have two B-IIIs and a KMG.

My first Bader B-III is over 10 years old, used daily with no probs.
 
I've used both a bader and kmg for along time and they are both great machines. Lately been using a burr king. hands down the best IMHO. smoothest grinding, the best tracking, and greatest control. really redefined and refined how I grind. kinda like heading out on a Ducati which I recently did too!.... :thumbup:
 
BADER, i prefer the direct drive to the belt drive. a little more pricey, but worth it in my opp. i do regret not ordering the flat platen when i bought, now seems like i never have the extra cash for it. soon though , very soon. (ive been saying that for a year now.) O-well ive worked on both and you really cant go wrong either way.


Andy
 
Two things-

First, I have never had a bad experience with Bader's service (haven't ever used it) I should have mentioned that.

Secondly, I have a Burr King as well... have for 12 years. It is an extremely nice machine, but I don't think it's smoother than the KMG. Mind you my KMG has the heavy base plate, Rob's 2hp motor, and it's mounted to the same heavy bench as my BK.

The tooling change on the Burr King drives me nuts. It seems like small stuff, but when you're in the middle of something really important and to get to the next step you have to change out idlers and that kind of crap, it's pretty frustrating.

It is indeed a fine machine though. :)
 
One thing that's usually not mentioned in these threads is;

The basic design of these two grinders came from Bader.

But I like my KMG almost as well as my B-III :D
 
I own and use and love my KMG. But it suprises me that nobody mentioned the Dozier grinder. It looked sweet as hell at BS. Is it that much more $??
 
I'm gona echo Nick now! :) The ease of changing setups is a paramount factor for me as well. It drives me nuts when I have to fiddle around changing this and that on a machine when I'm "in the grinding groove." Thats the reason I came up with the platen for the KMG......turning one socket head bolt allows you to move the platen to any position... flat platen, 1 1/2" contact wheel, 3" contact wheel, slack belt, or anywhere in between. (http://www.caffreyknives.net/PlatenPage.html) and changing to any available attachment is just as easy.

Someone mentioned the Dozier machine, and of course its a good machine too...but the reason I did not even consider it is based on my concept of working under the KISS principle. Not only does the machine require power, but also an air source for the belt tension....just one more thing to go wrong, and or adjust/worry about. I've been lucky enough to work on just about about every commercially available grinder during my career, but none have matched my overall satisfaction with the KMG. The machine is rock solid, super simple, and with the minor mods I made in mine, none come close it it's ease of use and versatility. Everybody has their favorite, and that's just MY opinion for my choice. And once again.....the customer service is unmatched.
 
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