Bear Grylls VS Les Stroud Knife Deathmatch!

Thomas Linton said:
Has anyone tried the Camillus "Carnivore Machete"?
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Sorry to reply to a two year old question... this thread has been interesting though! For anyone reading this for future purchases, as hopefully Thomas has found his answer by now, but the Camillus "Carnivore Machete" is garbage. Chinese stainless wont hold an edge, chips if used as intended, crap geometry, junk.

And Les is way better than Bear, no doubt. I feel like Bear is a monkey being told what to do by producers and a team of survival experts. "we are going to check the depth of the base of this water fall, then you are going to jump down it" 'This water is frozen, so your going to swim through it, and show that it can be done" type scenario.

I know that Les is a survivor. May not be perfect, may not be as entertaining, but he is the real deal.
 
coping said:
So yours and everyone elses opinion is the same as you described my *opinion* as. Prospective future and no fact but less educated than mine?

The only fact is you cant keep it in the sheath ;)
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I have a bk14 I used a brick to baton through a 3" tree branch with no damage but a few flecks of finish, an Ontario Marine Raider Bowie that chopped out an oak limb around 5" that didnt even damage the finish, much less the edge, a BK15 that I gave to my dad to process his deer that only needed a quick rinse to bring back to factory fresh and you want me to crack stones together to hopefully get an edge that maybe could do one of those jobs well.
How many calories expended cracking stones vs carrying like 3 lbs of knives?
 
Buy a knife because of the materials used not who's name is etched in the blade.

I didn't read every post....but what is the exact use you want to get out a knife?
 
As far as Gerber letting Bear use the LMF design for a survival blade is laughable, be Camillus has put out some nice USA made knives is 1095, I haven't tried them, but the design looked solid....oh and WuGod..why did you use a brick to baton with? :confused:
 
BrianLS1TA said:
Buy a knife because of the materials used not who's name is etched in the blade.

I didn't read every post....but what is the exact use you want to get out a knife?
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Material is something, but heat treatment makes or breaks it beyond materials used. Further, you only have the maker's word on the material used, so the maker's reputation is what you are really depending on.

Further, you can't see heat treatment. although you can experience it. As a result, your happiness again depends significantly on how trustworthy the maker is.

So who can be trusted is far more important that material allegedly used.
 
Great read. Interestingly, I spoke to my 11 year old Scouts about knives and we got them passed off on the knife totum chip (so they can carry and use knives). We sent out an email to the parents concerning teaching the boys how to use knives. In the email I indicated I would be available to discuss what is acceptable and recommended they stay away from cheap knives. Of the 11 scouts, about 50% showed up with knives that were dull, rusty, and dangerous. About 5 out of 11 showed up with the BG Gerber. I'd say that is their target market. Beginner knife users. Moms buying knives for someone at wallmart that don't know or care about what makes a good knife. Most of us would not be considered the target market.
Is it a Good knife? Eh, better than they 4/11 that showed up with no names or the 2/11 that didn't have a knife.
Can it accomplish the basic skills I'm attempting to teach them (firestarting, traps, shelters)? yes
Am I going to buy or recommend them? No
Did any parents call me for recommendations? Not a single one.
 
Thomas Linton said:
Material is something, but heat treatment makes or breaks it beyond materials used. Further, you only have the maker's word on the material used, so the maker's reputation is what you are really depending on.

Further, you can't see heat treatment. although you can experience it. As a result, your happiness again depends significantly on how trustworthy the maker is.

So who can be trusted is far more important that material allegedly used.
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Yeah, I have to second Thomas on this one. what a knife is made of is only a small part of the puzzle... when i see a trusted knifemakers name etched on the blade, i feel a lot more secure that i have a quality item that i can trust.
 
rustyrazor said:
Yeah, I have to second Thomas on this one. what a knife is made of is only a small part of the puzzle... when i see a trusted knifemakers name etched on the blade, i feel a lot more secure that i have a quality item that i can trust.
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Yep, people who base their purchasing decisions solely on the type of steel used totally ignore all other factors that make up a knife:
  1. The design
  2. The heat treatment
  3. The amount of steel and other materials used
  4. Fit and finish
  5. The post-purchase service
  6. The sheath (for fixed blades)
An example of #3 is the Boker Plus Bob. I've seen some people (probably here on BF) look at the blade steel (AUS-8), then the price, and say "They're charging this much for AUS-8?!" Never mind that the steel has a maximum thickness of of 7 mm and weighs 9.5 oz. If the thickness and weight is too much, then fine, but reject it on that basis. It's simply erroneous to say that a knife made of a particular steel must have an upper limit on its price. If we are to take this method of judging a knife's value to its logical conclusion, then no one should ever buy any knife because the price would be compared to per unit wholesale price of unprocessed bar stock straight from the mill.
 
The premise of this thread is a bit off. It's not about how decent a particular knife is relative to price -- getting a decent knife on the cheap is easy. For me, it's about where the money I just spent on a knife ends up.

I just don't like the idea of my money going into the pockets of advertising executives and everyone else along that non-production food chain. Yes, there's always non-production overhead, but the more of my dollars that go into the actual production of the knives I buy the better I feel about those purchases.
 
If your knife shopping at walmart, about all I can recommend is a Kershaw Blur. Great knife that everyone should own.
 
I have no experience with the specific knives the OP asks about but I do have an observation FWIW.
I don't really have anything against celebrity endorsed products , at least as far as quality is concerned , but the price differences do bug me.
eg: in the guitar world you can get a Les paul std. for around $2200 or a Fender Strat for maybe $1300, but as soon as you want a "Jimmy Page" model Les Paul or a Eric Clapton "Blackie" strat the prices skyrocket just because of the artists name being attached to it. (sometimes by as much as 4x the reg. price)
There may be some minor differences between the 2 but nothing that comes anywhere near justifying the price increase.
Anyone noticed this phenomenon with these knives?
 
dejard said:
The premise of this thread is a bit off. It's not about how decent a particular knife is relative to price -- getting a decent knife on the cheap is easy. For me, it's about where the money I just spent on a knife ends up.

I just don't like the idea of my money going into the pockets of advertising executives and everyone else along that non-production food chain. Yes, there's always non-production overhead, but the more of my dollars that go into the actual production of the knives I buy the better I feel about those purchases.
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There are probably lots of knives that have very little marketing overhead, but you probably never heard of them. :)

The thing is that the larger the company, the smaller the percentage of the price of a single knife goes to marketing, due to economies of scale. A one-man custom knifemaker has to spend time he could be using to design and make knives to attend trade shows and post on social media to promote himself. That means he has fewer pieces to sell and has to mark up the price accordingly to pay for the time he spends not making more knives.
 
Hiro-kun said:
There are probably lots of knives that have very little marketing overhead, but you probably never heard of them.
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? Maybe I'm misunderstanding your statement. I'm obviously a member of BF and a knife enthusiast otherwise I wouldn't be here. I spend more time perusing the Knife Exchange than any other forum. How would I have "probably" NOT heard of "knives that have very little marketing overhead"?
 
dejard said:
? Maybe I'm misunderstanding your statement. I'm obviously a member of BF and a knife enthusiast otherwise I wouldn't be here. I spend more time perusing the Knife Exchange than any other forum. How would I have "probably" NOT heard of "knives that have very little marketing overhead"?
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It was a bit of a jest. The less a knifemaker spends on getting the word of his products out, the less likely it is for you to have heard of him. You can't know about the vast majority of knifemakers who don't advertise.
 
dejard said:
? Maybe I'm misunderstanding your statement. I'm obviously a member of BF and a knife enthusiast otherwise I wouldn't be here. I spend more time perusing the Knife Exchange than any other forum. How would I have "probably" NOT heard of "knives that have very little marketing overhead"?
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well... if someone doesn't waste much time or money on marketing, how can you have heard of them? other than posting a few pics on here to show what I'm up to I don't think there is a picture of one of my knives anywhere, and you likely haven't heard of me. granted, I'm far from a full time maker, but I've been a maker for over 20 years.

just saying.. that is how I read that post.
 
dejard said:
? Maybe I'm misunderstanding your statement. I'm obviously a member of BF and a knife enthusiast otherwise I wouldn't be here. I spend more time perusing the Knife Exchange than any other forum. How would I have "probably" NOT heard of "knives that have very little marketing overhead"?
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That being true, you need to be helping at the Bernard Levine Knife Collecting and Identification forum where he try to help with sorting out the 10,000's of makers.
 
Hiro-kun said:
A one-man custom knifemaker has to spend time he could be using to design and make knives to attend trade shows and post on social media to promote himself. That means he has fewer pieces to sell and has to mark up the price accordingly to pay for the time he spends not making more knives.
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Yes, but he's the "one man" who actually makes my knife.

The several men, women, and children who make my hypothetical Bear Grylls Gerber knife in a Chinese factory only receive pennies on the dollar for their work on my knife. In other words, Chad Vincent, the CEO of Gerber Legendary Blades, along with a cadre of other executives and their staff are never within a thousand miles of my hypothetical Bear Grylls Gerber knife. Yet, the vast majority of the money that I spend on that knife goes into the pockets of individuals who live on entirely different continents from where that knife was made.
 
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Hiro-kun said:
It was a bit of a jest. The less a knifemaker spends on getting the word of his products out, the less likely it is for you to have heard of him. You can't know about the vast majority of knifemakers who don't advertise.
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That goes without saying. I clearly misunderstood your jest...
 
Actually I saw some customs for around the same price with sheath that are better knives right here in knife makers for sale section.;)
 
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