Belt/disc sander combination

Anyway this thread has somehow been moving along without pictures so 'I'll show you mine and then you can show me your's'. This combo sander was already used and from an old duffer's garage sale 15 years ago. I haven't used it a lot and had to use a tape measure (while taking the photos) in order to ascertain what size belt it uses. The whole works is not that big but it weighs a good 30 lbs (maybe even 40) and there is no plastic on it except for the control switch. Belt (near as I can tell) is 4 x 36. Yes, this very sturdy implement was made in Taiwan (Peoples Republic of China) and so too is the electric motor. Manufacture date of this is on the front plate and says 1989.

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Good idea 300 we all like pictures. I think it starts when we find Dads stash of magazines.

I have had this one about fifteen years also. Its a craftsman with a knick in the belt that I was going to replace when I bought it. It would run a little quieter and smoother. Deserves better than I treat it, but I don't love it. It gets used.
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I can see that adjusts and changes belts a lot easier than the dinosaur that I run. And I wish I had two tables so I did not have to switch it out between belt and disc. With my belt stood up I can use the slack side also. Nothing restores a axe bit as fast if it is not too damaged. Just have to be aware because I can walk the belt off its wheels from that side.
 
The temptation to sharpen axes with a belt sander must be high but I have so far been able to resist. Much like using an electric grinder on chainsaw chains, which renders them useless after 4-5 sharpenings, I can get many years out of a chain via judicious use of a round and a flat file. That method takes quite a bit more effort than the other and is slow going but it extends the life of the chain considerably. I would presume you can make a real mess of an axe (namely remove too much material) if you weren't careful.
 
There is a substantial difference of opinion on this regarding file vs sander for sharpening. I used the sander on two head to see what the fuss was all about. Granted, I chose heads that I don't care about, the Boss maul and a HF hatchet. The HF sander is so slow that I doubt it will to damage to the temper. The edges were just slightly warm after sanding. Again, this is a hobby for me so I don't need to sharpen anything super fast to get back to work. I want to learn how to use files properly and there's satisfaction for me in doing it by hand. I do need a little help here. I suck a sharpening, I don't know why, I just do. One problem seems to be angle, and knowing when to transfer from one tool to the next. Any advice would be appreciated.

I have the following equipment: Lansky puck, Course HF file set (the better one), Medium Pferd double cut file, Single cut fine Pferd file, Deluxe Gatco, sharpening kit, Smith tri-stone sharpening block, Lansky brass and steel field sharpening rods.
 
The ''green machine'' that's what mine looks like. Went back to HF, and for 7 dollars and change, with the 20% discount picked up a package of 4''x36'' 80 grit belts. Don't know how good they are, but, we'll see pretty soon.
 
vcbvcbvcb said:
The HF sander is so slow that I doubt it will to damage to the temper.
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Trust me, it can easily damage the temper of a tool. Even a wet grinder can create a hot spot.

The time to move to the next sharpening tool is when the current tool has produced and even burr all along the 2nd edge of the tool. I've been sharpening for 42 years so I can hold an angle in my sleep. But for the first 5 years I used gauges and checked my work frequently.

Here is an excerpt from 'The Complete Modern Blacksmith' by Alex Weygers. This is Filing 101. This guy knows what he's talking about.
http://cedarriverforge.com/Photo-index/axephotos/Filing photos/How to learn to file.pdf

Note how he has his bench vise set up in the drawing on page one. His feet can get under the vise and he can bring the weight of his body to bear on the filing. The filing motion is mostly in your hips not your arms or shoulders. You can accomplish a similar setup on the corner of your sturdy bench. A leg vise is better still. The jaws of your vise should be set at about navel height. The vise should be clamped on the poll and eye of the axe. Use wood wedges if necessary to get a good grip (e.g. - tapered poll). The bit should flair out over the jaws so you have positive support under the bit.

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What Square-peg said. Most of you know how I feel about this. Why take a chance on buggering up a good axe? If you dont know how to file an axe, my guess is you dont know how to grind one either. Learn to file correctly first, then learn to grind, if you have to. No power tool, of any kind, should ever be a substitute for craft skills. Always learn the skill with hand tools first.
 
Old Axeman said:
What Square-peg said. Most of you know how I feel about this. Why take a chance on buggering up a good axe? If you don't know how to file an axe, my guess is you don't know how to grind one either. Learn to file correctly first, then learn to grind, if you have to. No power tool, of any kind, should ever be a substitute for craft skills. Always learn the skill with hand tools first.
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You're 'bang on' with that observation. Power tools are a poor substitute for skill.
 
To the OP,
a 220 grit belt is the start of finishing level.

I use 40 grit for shaping/heavy removal, a 120 grit to clean that up. Then 220 for last machine finish, Sand by hand, 400G on up to 1000 depending on what I want.

I sharpen Knives & hatchets Aze etc on a variable speed 2 x 72" It can be done on a single 1750 rpm. Use FRESH belts and keep it moving along with a dip bucket of water to help keep things cool.

Dip, make a pass, Dip make a pass. repeat.:)
 
I am not going to make any apologies for my tools of choice. I could care less if it is politically correct on this forum or not. If I relied just on files and tried to clean up all the old damaged bits I have done in the last year I would have long ago had tendonitis and or Carpal tunnel syndrome. I learned how to do it with a sander from folks on this forum, and yes you can do it without ruining the temper. I love old hand tools and using them also. Arkansas stones, treadle grinders(I own enough of them I am embarrassed to say how many), and a box full of nice old vintage files. Just comes a time when you have to be smart.
 
garry3 said:
I am not going to make any apologies for my tools of choice. I could care less if it is politically correct on this forum or not. If I relied just on files and tried to clean up all the old damaged bits I have done in the last year I would have long ago had tendonitis and or Carpal tunnel syndrome. I learned how to do it with a sander from folks on this forum, and yes you can do it without ruining the temper. I love old hand tools and using them also. Arkansas stones, treadle grinders(I own enough of them I am embarrassed to say how many), and a box full of nice old vintage files. Just comes a time when you have to be smart.
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Garry,
Mr' Tesla invented the electric motor over a 100 years along with the AC electric system that fueled & illuminated our entire modern world.

Its fine to know how to do it with hand tools. But if it was good enough for Mr. Tesla, Its just fine by me!;)
 
Tesla, what about Edison? I didn't mean to cause another file vs. sander/grinder kerfuffle. I have to say, that in my case the file-o-philes are correct. Remember, I have no experience power sanding or grinding metal. I could screw something up a lot faster with a power tool than a file. I think a file is a good place to start for a beginner. I think the advice that Square_peg provided pointed out why I wasn't getting what I wanted out of my files. I'll just act like an old fashioned blacksmith until I get good at it. Garry3, I doubt if anybody on this forum is of the political mindset to pass a law telling you what tools you can or cannot use on steel. No apologies are necessary, if your good at power tools and get the result you want, all is good.
 
vcbvcbvcb said:
Tesla, what about Edison? I didn't mean to cause another file vs. sander/grinder kerfuffle. I have to say, that in my case the file-o-philes are correct. Remember, I have no experience power sanding or grinding metal. I could screw something up a lot faster with a power tool than a file. I think a file is a good place to start for a beginner. I think the advice that Square_peg provided pointed out why I wasn't getting what I wanted out of my files. I'll just act like an old fashioned blacksmith until I get good at it. Garry3, I doubt if anybody on this forum is of the political mindset to pass a law telling you what tools you can or cannot use on steel. No apologies are necessary, if your good at power tools and get the result you want, all is good.
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I am better with hand tools in general. It was years before I used my sander to sharpen or profile any axes. It was a wood working tool for me. I learned from some belt sander users on this forum what belts to use and then I was off and running.
I find hand tools more enjoyable but some times you have to get WORK done. The end result is the same.
 
Some people on this forum need to slow down and actually read what is written. My comments were directed at the raft of new axeophiles. When you show videos and comment in a way that makes power grinders/sanders the way for a beginer to fix his great old axe, it can mean that a historic axe gets ruined.
 
I'm an avid file-o-phile, but for initial profiling a 36 grit belt on a sander is hard to beat. It's not really that hard to keep from overheating, but I started out stock removal knifemaking so maybe I'm biased. If you're the type who can't remain concentrated the WHOLE time stick to files. Interestingly I still use files after removing the bulk of the material. A file in skilled hands can be very precise.
 
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