best all around steel

the steel is somewhat unimportant for all around knife. The most important factors are heat treatment and bevel grind.
 
skyliner32 said:
the steel is somewhat unimportant for all around knife. The most important factors are heat treatment and bevel grind.
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Brilliant first post skyliner32!!!!

Guys who focus on steel rarely focus on actually using their blades. Well thats what I find....Why? Well, the guys who know all about the steels have bought a hundred different knives to prove it. They still aren't happy with them. The guy who knows all about the blade, bought four or five and found what works from them....

In the end men are functionalized consumers. They need some kind of logic in order enforce an emotional purchase. You tell them that this steel is better than that one and then they have a little piece of logic to rationalize the purchase of something they already want. Thats why you get guys with 8 different versions of the military. They all have different steels. Yeah, they are all different colors to. They really want the colors, but their rational button says the steel is why they shelled out $179.00 for the tenth time.

My two cents...

Of course...I'm not one to judge. I've made lots of trivial buying decisions when it comes to blades. I just don't try to bother rationalizing them with steel type anymore ;)
 
Hi USCGGM,

Assuming that heat treat and edge geometry are optimal, and you're not going to get a custom forged differentially heat treated blade;

The question of the "best" steel is always very difficult as most call out a number or name that probably means less to you than to them. They're afi's and they are passionate. They just know more than most.

In steels there are 3 basic properties of importance to knife users, and a 4th I'll throw in.

1. Edge retention or sometimes called abrasion resistance.
2. Corosion resistance or the ability to avoid rusting.
3. Toughness or the ability to resistance cracking, chipping or breaking.

If you want top performance in all three categories, you will often pay more. hence;

4. Cost

Many steels will offer excellent performance in 2 out of the 3 categories.

So "best" gets back to you. If you want toughness and edge retention and will not worry about rust ('cause you will take care of it everyday, right?), there are many carbon steels to choose from. Go North.

If corrosion resistance is very important because you live in the ocean, then the "best" for you will something with lotsa chrome and / or Nitrogen. Go west.

If toughness is important, edge retention important, no corrosion problem, go south.

There are some steel alloys that do a good turn of performance in all three areas, just not exceptional performance, such as .9% carbon 15.0%, + other alloys. Usually quite satisfying to the majority of knife users.

I think you can see where I'm going. No "best". All good, just different.


sal
 
I've had more than decent results with almost every knife steel I've tried, from "low-end" 440A and 8cr13mov to S30V and VG-10. It really does tend to depend more on heat treatment, blade geometry, intended use, etc.

If price is a factor, I'd definitely go with an AUS-8 or a Sandvik steel for an all-round folder before any of the "super" steels. Haven't had too much experience with the "non-stainless" steels, though rave reviews are everywhere with the "as long as you take decent care of your knife" caveat.
 
Of course I have to have Sal post after I make a flippant remark on the Miltary, which I've owned and think is an amazing blade :D I think it would be an amazing blade in 10 different steels and thus it is offered in all those flavours. No disrespect meant to Spyderco, I just find the whole steel thing to be so overblown 4 or 5 years after really learning to like cutlery.....And maybe I was drinking (a teeny bit) at the time of posting.

Ken
 
kgd said:
Of course I have to have Sal post after I make a flippant remark on the Miltary, which I've owned and think is an amazing blade :D I think it would be an amazing blade in 10 different steels and thus it is offered in all those flavours. No disrespect meant to Spyderco, I just find the whole steel thing to be so overblown 4 or 5 years after really learning to like cutlery.....And maybe I was drinking (a teeny bit) at the time of posting.

Ken
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Heh...my policy is to try and candy coat my words, because you never know when you'll have to eat them. ;)
 
A.P.F. said:
Heh...my policy is to try and candy coat my words, because you never know when you'll have to eat them. ;)
Click to expand...

:D :D :D

I'm not good at sugar coating words, but I enjoy the odd yogurt covered peanut now and again...

I recently posted my amazement at a the performance of a 1070 forged blade from a local maker. A steel that most people shirk as being poor quality, yet I've managed to experience great edge retention mixed with high degree of toughness. Part parcel, much of this to do with an exquisite hand drawn convex profile by the maker. It really opened my eyes to knife versus steel. I think steel is about 20% of the story. From there, the maker is writing the script.
 
kgd said:
:D :D :D

I'm not good at sugar coating words, but I enjoy the odd yogurt covered peanut now and again...

I recently posted my amazement at a the performance of a 1070 forged blade from a local maker. A steel that most people shirk as being poor quality, yet I've managed to experience great edge retention mixed with high degree of toughness. Part parcel, much of this to do with an exquisite hand drawn convex profile by the maker. It really opened my eyes to knife versus steel. I think steel is about 20% of the story. From there, the maker is writing the script.
Click to expand...

I used to be a steel snob, but I have seen too many 'low end' steel blades with performance that borders on 'magical'. I think that we tend to quantify a process of manufacture that is really the art form of the maker. Most Bladesmiths have forgotten more about steel and it's treatment than I'll ever learn, so I just content myself with my purely subjective experience of what 'works' for me. :)
 
ElectricZombie said:
I like 1095 in carbon steel, and ATS-34 in stainless. As long as they are heat treated correctly, they are both great.
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My sentiments exactly. Never had a problem with either, easy to sharpen and durable. I like the 1095 best between the two.
 
There is no question that geometry is at least as important as steel, to a point, and that heat treatment can turn average steel into great steel or stainless steel into rusty junk.

The original question was about steel choice, not geometry or heat treatment, leading to assumptions that geometry and heat treatment will be comparable, if not equal. If you want to start changing all three, then the question of best steel really goes out the window, since 1070 with the right geometry and optimal heat treatment will outperform S30V in every respect except stain resistance.
 
It really does depend on how the knife will be used and where you will be using it. I like the North - South - East - West thing ...........but if I was forced to pick one steel and one steel only I would have to go with..............uh oh there's the wife - got a go
 
If I had to pick just one, for now it would be VG-10, out of (that I've tried) M4, VG10, S30V , ZDP189 (really limited :( )and AUS8. M4 doesn't get the nod simply because of corrosion issues.

If or when I get my hands on some sort of coating for my M4 Gayle Bradley, it'd instantly shoot above VG10. S30V just doesn't do it for me. Also I haven't tried loads of cool steels yet (think S90V, etc)
 
So far I like CPM S-90-V, ZDP-189, Stellite 6-K, and Cera-Titan Titanium although the last two are not steels. I just picked up a CPM S-110-V blade that might be added to the list. I would like to try CPM S-125-V, but the offerings are slim to none.
 
I'm no steel expert either but I sure do love the way the 1095 of my RC-4 goes from dull to razor sharp faster than a cat can lick his...well you get the picture! :D
 
Depends on a bunch of factors, as previously stated.......... there are a bunch of excellent ones out there. :thumbup:
 
kgd said:
Of course I have to have Sal post after I make a flippant remark on the Miltary, which I've owned and think is an amazing blade :D I think it would be an amazing blade in 10 different steels and thus it is offered in all those flavours. No disrespect meant to Spyderco, I just find the whole steel thing to be so overblown 4 or 5 years after really learning to like cutlery.....And maybe I was drinking (a teeny bit) at the time of posting.

Ken
Click to expand...

Hi Ken,

No problem on my end. We work for our customers. We are also among the few production houses that will experiment with different steels rather than pound on our chest about any particular steel. We try to be honest, fair and proper in our sharing of information. ("man who beat on own chest knock self over backwards")

The Military was originally designed as a test bed for mterials. Now we've added the Manix2 and Mule Teams (for steel).

If our customers were not interested in different flavors of the same model, we wouoldn't make them. Some collect, some wait for the right combination that they like.

"best" steel is a different issue.

I like all steels. I think steel is a remarkable human invention and the continual development to improve/refine/evolve the material is a fascinating study. From that study we all benefit.

sal
 
Sal Glesser said:
Hi USCGGM,

Assuming that heat treat and edge geometry are optimal, and you're not going to get a custom forged differentially heat treated blade;

The question of the "best" steel is always very difficult as most call out a number or name that probably means less to you than to them. They're afi's and they are passionate. They just know more than most.

In steels there are 3 basic properties of importance to knife users, and a 4th I'll throw in.

1. Edge retention or sometimes called abrasion resistance.
2. Corosion resistance or the ability to avoid rusting.
3. Toughness or the ability to resistance cracking, chipping or breaking.

If you want top performance in all three categories, you will often pay more. hence;

4. Cost

Many steels will offer excellent performance in 2 out of the 3 categories.

So "best" gets back to you. If you want toughness and edge retention and will not worry about rust ('cause you will take care of it everyday, right?), there are many carbon steels to choose from. Go North.

If corrosion resistance is very important because you live in the ocean, then the "best" for you will something with lotsa chrome and / or Nitrogen. Go west.

If toughness is important, edge retention important, no corrosion problem, go south.

There are some steel alloys that do a good turn of performance in all three areas, just not exceptional performance, such as .9% carbon 15.0%, + other alloys. Usually quite satisfying to the majority of knife users.

I think you can see where I'm going. No "best". All good, just different.


sal
Click to expand...

I think it has a lot to do with what the knife is going to be used for as some steels excel at one or two things , but not others.

I think it should be a best for (Insert use and type of knife here). :)

I am more of a fixed blade kinda guy so steels in folders for me really doesn't matter all that much as long as the edge doesn't fold over on the 1st few cuts and the blade isn't too brittle to use. :D
 
kgd said:
:D :D :D

I'm not good at sugar coating words, but I enjoy the odd yogurt covered peanut now and again...

I recently posted my amazement at a the performance of a 1070 forged blade from a local maker. A steel that most people shirk as being poor quality, yet I've managed to experience great edge retention mixed with high degree of toughness. Part parcel, much of this to do with an exquisite hand drawn convex profile by the maker. It really opened my eyes to knife versus steel. I think steel is about 20% of the story. From there, the maker is writing the script.
Click to expand...

AISI 1070 makes a great knife, machete or sword in the hands of a skilled smith. There is nothing fancy about 1070, which is precisely why it is so forgiving, has enough carbon to be fairly hard wearing and yet can be tempered to be impressively tough and springy. The bigger the knife, the more important the attribute of toughness becomes. It does not require a lot work to maintain, a light bit of oiling every now and again is sufficient for all the praise lavished on stainless and highly alloyed tool steels.

With warm regard,

-E
 
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