Is the premise here that Holes or Studs weaken blades to varying degrees? I for one don't understand how for practical purposes either design would be weakened to point that failure would be caused unless you are trying to break your blade. All this hard use Hoopla is lost on people who actual use their tools.
-
The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.
Best argument for 'The Hole' ever.
- Thread starter BladeScout
- Start date
One reason I buy Spyderco is the hole in the blade. I am not at all against studs. I have had many occasions when cutting something that the studs would dig into what I was cutting either messing things up or binding things up. The hole does not have these issues. Also, the hole is a lot, and I mean a lot, easier to find while not looking at the knife. I will go so far as to say I prefer the Spyderco hole to any assisted or automatic knife, as well, and I have owned a few.
Overall I think the hole, if done properly, is the easiest and most positive way to open a knife.
With a thumbstud or a flipper you have to position your finger just right to hit it. A thumbstud or flipper won't work for you at all if your finger misses it, or even if your finger slips off of it. You have to take a little time to carefully position your finger, then try to activate the opener, and you still might slip off of it. The single exception to this among all of the thumb stud knives I've tried is the Kershaw Blur- the sabertooth-tiger thumbstud on that one locks into your finger and doesn't slip, but it might shread your finger.
With a properly done hole, and I'm talking about the large sharp-edged holes of the Military/Paramilitary2/Manix2, it is easier for your thumb to hit it, and less likely to slip. With a poorly done thumb hole such as in some of the BM knifes, you might hit the hole but still slip out of it.
With a thumbstud or a flipper you have to position your finger just right to hit it. A thumbstud or flipper won't work for you at all if your finger misses it, or even if your finger slips off of it. You have to take a little time to carefully position your finger, then try to activate the opener, and you still might slip off of it. The single exception to this among all of the thumb stud knives I've tried is the Kershaw Blur- the sabertooth-tiger thumbstud on that one locks into your finger and doesn't slip, but it might shread your finger.
With a properly done hole, and I'm talking about the large sharp-edged holes of the Military/Paramilitary2/Manix2, it is easier for your thumb to hit it, and less likely to slip. With a poorly done thumb hole such as in some of the BM knifes, you might hit the hole but still slip out of it.
- Joined
- Dec 1, 2007
- Messages
- 3,798
I've carried and used knives with flippers, Spyderholes, thumbstuds, thumb disks, Axis locks, and side-open automatics and have never had problems with deployment or with blade or lock failure due to design. Anyone can train to use anything and a slipjoint can be used in defense with no catastrophic failure or injury to the user. Empirical evidence for the superiority of one opening or locking mechanism (or lack thereof) is missing for a reason.
how about on Ouroboros? I think that hole weakens the blade, it would be a concern for me.
otherwise i love the spydie hole.
- Joined
- May 16, 2010
- Messages
- 9,347
Wow...just wow... But quoted for posterity.
I laud the Spyderco hole (or sydie hole, as you call it) because its my preferred method of opening a knife ..., you claim I 'flame the Hole' - I suspect you dont know the meaning.
Im not trolling anything - after having had several polite conversations with Sal about recommendations for the development of Spyderco products in a specific market and having Sal send me knives to test, calling me out as a troll is a pretty rich claim, at which I can only laugh and shake my head whilst tut-tutting.
If you believe the title is a troll heading, I can only say that; 1. it was certainly not meant to be. 2. Our varying perceptions of how the English language works differ greatly.
In the spirit of Sal, Spyderco and what DocT wisely posted above, I will henceforth refrain from name calling etc in this thread and I would very much appreciate it if you (all of us really) would also keep a decent tone or maybe not post post at all in this thread, as its not very constructive. Thank you much.
- Joined
- May 16, 2010
- Messages
- 9,347
Thank you very much for your post, DocT. I wholeheartedly concur.
It was certainly not my intention, that the thread should rub anybody the wrong way - let alone turn into a train wreck.
Lets keep a polite tone - and thanks to all who took the thread in the right spirit and contributed with the several constructive posts.
- Joined
- May 16, 2010
- Messages
- 9,347
Several good points.
The premise was really only that I like the Hole. I read about the defects, where an oversize stud/post was squeezed into an undersize hole thus causing a stress fracture. That only made me even happier about the Hole, where this is avoided (of course as some has pointed out, even Spyderco knives fail).
I agree with you on the 'for practical purposes' argument. It must be said in advance though, that the pressing of an oversize stud/post into a too msall hole has of course nothing to do with user/customer error but is solely a (human) QC failure.
That being said, I personally dont get the hard use mania in regards to folders either - to each his own of course - everybody can use their knives the way they want, as its their money (I have to get the caveats out of the way
).I dont get the "I batoned with my folder and it broke! Bad folder, give me a new one on warrenty!"litany.
I use most of my folders for cutting and slicing. Seldom do I have other needs for them. Dont like to open paint cans with them either. Have a small CountyComm pry bar for that.
Thanks.
I like ZTs just fine - they make a quality products and Im sure the studs/posts work just fine in the vast majority of cases.
I concur; the Hole is also a major reason why I buy Spyderco knives (the overall quality, large variation of offered knives and the people standing behind their product are also some factors).
Im not against thumb studs either. Its just that when using a knife a lot, I notice the stud more than a Hole IMO. The Hole is more comfortable for me personally YMMW.
As a thumb stud on a blade can wear out the skin of a finger, some have lightly sanded the Hole for ease of use and to avoid chafing. I personally dont see that as a major problem, though I tend to use my knives a lot.
I likewise agree in the assisted or automatic argument. With the speed and ease of opening using the Hole, I dont see myself as having the need for an assisted or auto knife - even if I could legally carry an auto, which I cant.
I dont care much for assisted knives (and know some people 'de-assist' them) but thats a different kettle of fish.
- Joined
- May 16, 2010
- Messages
- 9,347
I agree with most of this.
Some flippers you have to open just right for them to work. A certain very popular knife has to have the flipper tab pressed more like inward than flicked, which is counter-intuitive to some people. I find after a bit of using, most work fine - the Hole being more positive overall, at least to me.
The wave is another opening device, which seems to work fine, when one has gotten used to using it. I was positively surprised. Just has to live with the wave being a jeans pocket eater, LOL. Its like the wear of a pocket clip x 10!
With some waved knives, one can remove the thumb disc if ones doesnt like it and rely solely on the wave....or buy a waved Spyderco and circumvent the thumb disc issue.
Yes on the PM2 - very happy with the design on mine.
Yes, its all of the individual. People should buy what works for them. Plenty dont get along with Spyderco knives. Customers can buy what they want, its their money.
The QC issue with some studs/posts being pressed into too small holes are of course in the minority and should not keep anybody from buying the knives in question - and I doubt it factors in.
Yes, even puny knives can be used in defense ... or attack as the case may be. As I know some cops, I was shown the police locker room containing confiscated weapons. One guy had stabbed and killed another guy with one (1) simple uncoordinated strike and I was shown the knife in question - just a cheapo small pocket knife (fake knife resembling a knife from a major knife brand). It doesnt take much. A knife in the right...or wrong place as the case may be...is all it takes. The guy in question had gotten a knife in a major artery and bled out in a matter of minutes. Sad.
Yup.
Good question.
I assume you refer the relatively small amount of blade on both sides of the Hole?
Dont have that knife - maybe some users can chime in.
No doubt Spyderco has done their research and as the knife presumably is a cutting/slicing knife, there shouldnt be an issue.
Yes that's what I meant. It's easy to imagine someone applying side-to-side force if the blade is stuck in something.
bearfacedkiller
Gold Member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2014
- Messages
- 2,631
Seriously, knives fail, it happens. I very, very much prefer the hole over any other method but I am fully aware that it is just a personal preference thing. I do not feel the need to find examples of studs failing in order to validate my opinion because it is just that, an opinion. If you like the Spydie hole then do what I do and buy tons of Spydies.
I usually get on the forum to discuss knives and usually leave the life coaching to those more eager to do it than myself but in this instance I gotta point out that you really need to work on how you react to people not agreeing with you. When you start a thread on the interweb you really need to be open to take whatever is thrown at you. Long defensive posts with lots of quotes usually turns a thread in the wrong direction.
I usually get on the forum to discuss knives and usually leave the life coaching to those more eager to do it than myself but in this instance I gotta point out that you really need to work on how you react to people not agreeing with you. When you start a thread on the interweb you really need to be open to take whatever is thrown at you. Long defensive posts with lots of quotes usually turns a thread in the wrong direction.
Last edited:
bearfacedkiller
Gold Member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2014
- Messages
- 2,631
This was brought up in a thread about the Ouroboros and the designer stated that Spyderco has a calculation for minimum cross section at the hole based on certain factors. So while your concern may be valid it is something that Spyderco takes into account.
- Joined
- May 16, 2010
- Messages
- 9,347
We have already been through this and decided to stick with knives (no pun intended) and dispense with the attacks. So please try to keep up and stay with the program.
When I want advice, Ill be sure to contact you. Dont hold your breath.
Please stick to debating knives in this thread or dont post at all.
- Joined
- May 16, 2010
- Messages
- 9,347
I could not agree more.
I have knives with plates, studs etc but do prefer the Spyderco Hole.
Waving an Emerson IS fun though (though youll tear up your jeans, LOL) but its equally fun to flip or Spydeco Hole open a Southard.
bearfacedkiller
Gold Member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2014
- Messages
- 2,631
My comment wasn't meant as an attack. I was offering some friendly advice. I'll keep the rest to myself as you request. I am sorry that it made you respond defensively with a condescending tone. That was not my goal. It is your thread and I should have just kept my opinion to myself. Again, I apologize. 
I'll get back to knives. Here is a pic of my Southard with a cracked hole. Is this the best argument for 'The Stud' ever?
In full disclosure, this is a factory second and I purchased it this way.
I am sorry that it made you respond defensively with a condescending tone. That was not my goal. It is your thread and I should have just kept my opinion to myself. Again, I apologize. I'll get back to knives. Here is a pic of my Southard with a cracked hole. Is this the best argument for 'The Stud' ever?
In full disclosure, this is a factory second and I purchased it this way.
Last edited:
Locutus D'Borg
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Dec 1, 2012
- Messages
- 5,214
Busted!