Best carry system for long knife

[Gaucho]

Trace Rinaldi is in the process of making a custom clip point Warhawk in A2 for me. It will have a 7" blade, and its OAL will be aprox. 12".

I intend to carry the knife daily and wish to have a JSP Bladerigger carry system made for it. I need your help in deciding which system would be the most appropriate for a knife this size.

I normally wear a dress shirt and slacks to work without a suitcoat, vest, etc. Thus, I will have to carry the blade next to the skin, inside either my shirt or pants.

Does anyone out there have experience carrying a blade of this size? Which system- shoulder harness, inside-the-pants, small-of-the-back, etc.- would allow quickest access to the blade while being comfortable throughout the day?

TIA


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Gaucho

Tuvo muy mala suerte...se callo en mi cuchillo.

 

[HJK]

It sounds like your best options are inside the pant strapped to your leg or small of the back:the former if you sit alot;the latter if you don't and if you're big enough to keep the knife from protruding too much.I prefer the behind the back, but I'll always wear a vest to conceal on the rare occasions I carry a big knife in an urban area with a domesticated constabulary. If the knife/sheath combination is flat enough, or if you don't mind the knife being completely obvious, you have other options like someone who carries in the field.
I often carry knives 7"+ when "out on the land". I don't carry knives that big in the city, although I do keep them handy ie in car, in office. Re wear options, it really depends what you will be doing. Probably the most comfortable way to carry a big knife is a shoulder rig[behind the back ], but that doesn't work if you will be carrying a pack or wearing a suit. My favorite carry is behind the back[small of the back] but for a big knife you have to be pretty big yourself and again, it doesn't work well with a lowriding pack or if you intend to sit down much. A belt carry, beside the leg with the possibility of strapping to the leg or sliding behind the back, is versatile, but you definitely will know your knife is there if you climb or sit. If the activity doesn't permit a comfortable carry of a 9" knife, I'll strap to a pack or deck and carry a smaller knife too.
As I said, I don't carry knives this size in the city, so I too would be interested to know which method people prefer, especially if you don't intend to wear a vest or jacket

[This message has been edited by HJK (edited 19 October 1999).]

 

[Attila]

I've got a bunch of JSP carry systems but I myself need to look into picking up a spinal backup 3 & a V-stat high/low patch. Generally the execulite is VERY comfortable & fast as hell! I've got an Ops Elite set & those 2 blades just FLY out for presentation!!! It's quite unnerving if you are on the receiving end let me tell ya ^_^. For the larger blades I generally use a horizontal belt sleeve with a cowhitch set up for the middle of back draw. The only way I have found this rig to be even the slightest bit uncomfortable is to be laying down. For deep concealment talk to James & he will make a rig to suit your needs. When i'm not geared up to take out the 4 horsemen of the apocolypse, I feel that regular cowhitched iwb carry is perfectly fine & if your dress permits add a backup with the belt sleeve.

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Attila

 

I'm uncomfortable with the very idea of an IWB sheath for a knife, so I'd advise caution there. Some guys I know do it no problem, but the thought of quick-drawing a razor sharp piece of steel out from my pants is a bit unnerving.

I agree with the ever-wise Attila about the execulite system. You characterized your blade as "long" but 6.75" is the shortest knife I carry. I typically carry knives with 10" to 12" blades. For a blade as short as yours, you can't beat the execulite. I have a dual system, one knife on each side, and I can get those suckers out really quick. But that's only if you're taller than about 6ft.

If you're shorter than 6 ft, you may want to look into the SB3 rig. I typically carry (I usually carry a Millennium Fighter with an 11" blade from Jerry Hossom at www.hossom.com ). The other day I carried one of those long Millennium Fighters for 16 hours without discomfort in this rig. A 7" blade on a spinal backup rig would almost be as quick on the draw as an execulite.

Let us know what you decide.

Matt

 

[Attila]

Matt,

I generally carry blades anywhere from 3" up to 12" in length. I'm not a big guy, but with the right gear I can conceal & quickly bring into play anything short of a spear. I can do the spear as well, but i'm afraid I have to wait for my MD hydra to arrive...

. I will look into an SB3 rig for the bigger knives. Hossom's knives look REAL cool & they are affordable as well. Getting one of his Millenium Bowies with a JSP carry rig would be sweet...

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Attila

 

[Gaucho]

Thanks HJK, Attila, and Zog for your valuable imput.

Zog and Attila- you both recommend the execulite shoulder harness system. I am in complete agreement that this is the safest, quickest drawing, and most comfortable system under a coat or vest. I wonder, however, how quickly I could draw the blade when wearing the execulite under a tucked-in dress shirt- my normal daily attire. Do any of you have experience carrying in this way?

thanks

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Gaucho

Tuvo muy mala suerte...se callo en mi cuchillo.

 

[Attila]

Gaucho,

You are more than welcome! As for wearing an execulite under a tucked in button down shirt: I have tried it & I do not reccommend doing so UNLESS you can leave the top 4 or 5 buttons unbuttoned. Which I believe in a corporate setting would be frowned upon. It's still kinda slow on the presentation though & you have to be EXCEPTIONALLY careful on the draw, lest you cut things...

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Attila

 

[Ronald Reagan]

Unfortunately, it seems that in order to carry this knife concealed you will have to modify your daily wardrobe. Perhaps start wearing a jacket or a sweater, don't tuck in your shirt, etc.....you get the idea. Of course you can carry the knife in Associate or Execulite harness, but like Attila said, there will be a a slow, messy draw.

 

[HJK]

The JSP systems do look awesome and effective, for tactical uses. The website mentions a 3 year wait. That's a long time. Is that the actual wait and is there a shorter alternative?

 

[Attila]

HJK,

Unfortunately the 3 year wait is the norm. The only way around that is to decide on which of his custom pieces you really like & then ask around on the forums if anyone has it available for sale/trade. That's what I did & I am the proud owner of 3 JSP customs! They really are incredible blades. I have yet to fondle one I didn't like/want.

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Attila

 

[Don Rearic]

The "Corporate Environment" and the Execulite OR Associate Shoulder Rigs...

First of all, to carry a knife that size in a shoulder rig, you are going to have to have a torso to match! If that is a "yes," consider the following...

If you wear dress shirts...take them to a great tailor and have him leave the buttons on, but make them velcro closure...some of the People in the Department of Corrections have uniformed shirts that zip up too, but look like button up shirts...

Your right palm would anchor the material on the right side of the shirt for the velcro draw, and the left would pull the shirt open and the right then dives in for the draw.

very fast

As for IWB carry, I never liked it (as Zog mentioned), however, I think the JSP Static Cord System cured that fear, for the knife clears the sheath away from the body, which is very safe. James pioneered this method of rigging and I think it is second to none...

Carrying weapons, especially the intricacy involved...may not necessarily dictate a change in clothing style but in the construction of the clothing...just some ideas!!!

 

Attila et al.

If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times, the best long knife to carry is a Millennium Fighter with a 9" to 14" blade, carried in one of Jame's wonderful SB3 rigs. I wore a 16" OAL Millennium Fighter last week 14 hours straight with no discomfort or strain. I wore it under a combo scrubs/overshirt that my wife made. Jerry's knives are wicked sharp and lightning fast. On top of that, NOBODY COULD TELL I WAS WEARING SUCH A LARGE KNIFE!

Check them out:

Mighty Millennium Fighters (look at BOTH pages at www.hossom.com )
Blade Rigger's SB3 Rig ( www.bladerigger.com look under "semi-custom" and "carry systems".

I also like the suggestion Attila made about Jame's knives. I have one on order I probably won't get for a couple of years, but once you have a custom knife on order you can get any carry system much quicker. My mighty Japanese Bowie (10" blade, sharpened false edge) won't be ready for another two years, but I got my execulite system several months ago. It's the only way to go.

Matt

 

[Attila]

Matt et al:

Yep, GOTTA look into the Hossom Millenium Bowie. Since I will be attending the NYC show next month, I will keep my eyes out for one. One of those bad boys on an SB3 rig with a rigger coated V-stat modified sheath would be InTeNsE!!! Damn, I LOVE this stuff! I'm also very happy that there are quite a bit of intelligent ppl out there with the same outlook.

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Attila

 

[Gaucho]

Well, its a toss up boys.

Don, your idea on the velcro dress shirts was terrific. And Matt, who would dare argue with a man who carries a Bowie every day?!

I can see where a shoulder rig would work on some days and an SP3 on others. Or, I might be in the mood to carry two long fixed blades- one in the execulite and one in the SB3- instead of one and my MPF or BM 710. So, I believe that I am just going to have to get one of each. I hope that y'all will agree that this is forward thinking on my part.

I'll let you know how it works out. And thanks again to everyone for your cogent advise.



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Gaucho

Tuvo muy mala suerte...se callo en mi cuchillo.




[This message has been edited by Gaucho (edited 26 October 1999).]

 

[Don Rearic]

To The HUN,

You will see one of Jerry Hossum's Millenium Bowies before you know it. As ZOG said, they are beyond description...

I have to do some cutting tests this weekend, I have had one for a couple weeks now, and I can tell you they handle incredibly well...the knife defies logic. It has a 10 3/4 inch blade and the whole thing weighs about 14 ounces...when I pulled it out of the box, I handed it to my wife and she said, "This is made out of steel right?"

The knife is like handling a large, muscular, venomous snake...it commands respect and it feels alive and like an angry snake...it wants to move, and it is very deceptive in that, you expect a hacking attack because of its' size, but what you end up with is...an extremely large fighter that you can do redondo and florette with, very fast and very deadly.

I talked to James yesterday about sheathing this weapon...the knife gets two thumbs up.

[This message has been edited by Don Rearic (edited 22 October 1999).]

[This message has been edited by Don Rearic (edited 22 October 1999).]

 

[Attila]

Don,

SWEET! I can't wait to play with one of these large puppies!!! Let me know how your cutting tests go. I will look for Mr. Hossom's blades at the NY show. If I have no luck in locating a Millenium Bowie there, I will have to see yours & then, PROBABLY put in an order for one! Yeah, this rocks! It will have to go to James for a rigger coated sheath & V-stat mod for an SB3...

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Attila

 

[Gaucho]

Don and Matt,

Now you two have me intrigued with this Hossum Millenium Bowie. It really feels that fast in the hand?

My only concern would the toughness of an ATS34 blade that length. How well would it hold up to blade to blade contact without chipping or breaking? Do either of you have enough live blade training time with the Millenium Bowie to comment? Or maybe you could test the blade's toughness Don?

I really look forward to your replies. If the Bowie is as tough as it is fast, then I believe it would make the perfect Christmas gift from my loving wife to her most deserving husband

.



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Gaucho

Tuvo muy mala suerte...se callo en mi cuchillo.




[This message has been edited by Gaucho (edited 26 October 1999).]

 

Guacho,

I want to clairfy your question for a bit. I don't think that Jerry's blades could withstand the torture and abuse that a Mad Dog or a Battle Mistress could.

But, his knives are the toughest ATS-34 knives I've ever handled. They're tempered AND cryo treated.

Here's a very lengthy review I wrote of his knives at www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000656.html
I waxed a bit over-eloquent, but I did do practical, rather than destruction testing, on my knives. I do not think that fine fighters should be used to dig holes, break rocks, split wood. And, I hate to break it to you, but I don't know of any knife that can withstand edge-to-edge contact. Blade to blade, perhaps. My style (mostly American bowie) is mixed with some Kali. I don't use any blade-to-blade impact in my style. Call me a chicken, but I don't want my opponent's steel getting that close to my hand. If I had a Crossada from James Keating, I'd reconsider.

I'm glad we've gotten you interested in Jerry's knives. He's a great guy and a joy to work with. And yes, his knives are that fast and that light!

Matt

 

[Gaucho]

Matt,

I can just tell that you are a kindred spirit. Too bad you live in Utah while I call Massachusetts home, otherwise it would be fun to get together and train.

Your review of the Hossum Millenium Fighters was exactly what I was looking for! A sparring tree and hanging beef on the bone are perfect ways to test a fighter. Plus your description of the knives feel was quite vivid.

By the way, I mean't exactly what I wrote- blade to blade contact, not edge to edge- although I should have qualified it as incidental contact. Clearly, finding your opponent with your blade is infinitely preferable to finding his knife, but at the speeds at which knife combat occurs,sometimes you count yourself lucky if you can intercept his blade with a witik or a meet.

Anyhow, thanks again, and I think that I'll have to give Mr. Hossum a call.

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Gaucho

Tuvo muy mala suerte...se callo en mi cuchillo.

 

Gaucho,

Oh yeah! I'm glad you clarified

Several people on the forums describe integrating blade to blade contact into their style. That just makes me shudder.

Contact Jerry, you won't be disappointed. He's a great guy. After he finishes the Millennium Mega Fighter (a 20" OAL knife I helped design), I'm going to ask him nicely to make me a set of Millennium 2 fighters to use on my JSP>- Dual Execulite Rig.

Please keep in contact and let me know how it goes.

Matt