Best knives for the city?

That makes me feel a bit better. That good, honest people with no bad intentions, pack a pistol that may not be allowed in the place that they are, their only intention life/death usage. Not that I'm doing it. I've done it one time in my life, just to give myself a bit of an idea of what it is like to carry. I was not raised with any knowledge of awareness, defense, firearms, anything of the sort, so.. I don't really know what normal people "do". I am trying to take it upon myself to run in better circles, I had no image of a good person who carried growing up, had to learn everything for myself. Where I am in CA, they basically do not issue carry permits, so I resort to a SD knife, spray, and avoidance skills. I try to be a good, sane, sober, moral, prudent person, but I value being protected. Still, no matter what I carry, avoidance is my best tool, but avoidance sometimes fails.
People are gonna do what they gotta do to stay safe. Laws sometimes be dammed.

One example; when I was a teen, my friend Dave's dad worked for an insurance collection job. He had to go around and collect the monthly payments in some very bad neighborhoods. One night he got shot by two ghetto punks who robbed him. He gave up the money and they then shot him just our of meanness. He lived but was hospitalized for a week or so.

He went and got a gun like most did in D.C. or any anti gun city like D.C., NYC, Philly, Chicago; he put the word out at a few bars where they knew him, and a week or so later he was told to meet the gun guy behind the bowling alley by the dumpster. He got a nice cold little Astra cub. He went down to a deserted part of river bank in Maryland and practiced with it.

Almost a year to the day later, he was making a collection in the same nighborhood and he swears it was the same two punks. Tell him to give it all up. He tells them sure, here it is just don't shoot me. Then he pulls the .25 Astra and dumps half a mag into the one holding the gun. Mugger goes down, his buddy runs like hell, and Mr. D. walks away down the street where his Nash Rambler was parked. Nobody out on the cold winter street so he drives away nice and slow. Tossed the gun in the river and goes about his life. He quits the insurance company and goes to work for Brink's Armored car. Said as long as people were gonna shoot at him, he wants a job that lets him shoot back.

Nobody ever knocked on his door, and the incident just faded into the past. Mr. D lived to a ripe old age.
 
People are gonna do what they gotta do to stay safe. Laws sometimes be dammed.

One example; when I was a teen, my friend Dave's dad worked for an insurance collection job. He had to go around and collect the monthly payments in some very bad neighborhoods. One night he got shot by two ghetto punks who robbed him. He gave up the money and they then shot him just our of meanness. He lived but was hospitalized for a week or so.

He went and got a gun like most did in D.C. or any anti gun city like D.C., NYC, Philly, Chicago; he put the word out at a few bars where they knew him, and a week or so later he was told to meet the gun guy behind the bowling alley by the dumpster. He got a nice cold little Astra cub. He went down to a deserted part of river bank in Maryland and practiced with it.

Almost a year to the day later, he was making a collection in the same nighborhood and he swears it was the same two punks. Tell him to give it all up. He tells them sure, here it is just don't shoot me. Then he pulls the .25 Astra and dumps half a mag into the one holding the gun. Mugger goes down, his buddy runs like hell, and Mr. D. walks away down the street where his Nash Rambler was parked. Nobody out on the cold winter street so he drives away nice and slow. Tossed the gun in the river and goes about his life. He quits the insurance company and goes to work for Brink's Armored car. Said as long as people were gonna shoot at him, he wants a job that lets him shoot back.

Nobody ever knocked on his door, and the incident just faded into the past. Mr. D lived to a ripe old age.
Wow! Glad he made it out alright! Very good illustration of the principle.
 
I understand the sentiment, and I view all gun control as an infringement of natural rights in addition to the often-ignored constitutional protection in the United States. However, should we be publicly advocating that people break these horrible laws? Probably not, and the proper discussion of what we should all be doing about those laws falls beyond the scope of this forum.
 
I understand the sentiment, and I view all gun control as an infringement of natural rights in addition to the often-ignored constitutional protection in the United States. However, should we be publicly advocating that people break these horrible laws? Probably not, and the proper discussion of what we should all be doing about those laws falls beyond the scope of this forum.

I try to make sure not to say anything that could get me into trouble with unconstitutional laws in certain places.
 
Genuine KA-BAR
Always
fxj2KgD.jpg
 
Genuine KA-BAR
Always
fxj2KgD.jpg
I love these, haha. I lost my love for KA-BAR when I found out about Ontario knives, though, seems like stronger, for cheaper. Then again, have never handled a KA-BAR, so will reserve judgement until then! I only have their "Acheron" pocket fixed blade that I bought for $7 when I was just first getting into knives because it has the KA-BAR name. It supposedly came with their "zombie sword", ugh. Has a terrible sheath and a re-curve, but I guess it makes a good knock-around knife for the house, I gave it to my mother to use before I gifted her a walnut handled Opinel no. 6.
______________
As to what I think about city carry in regard to this thread, I was thinking about the idea of knives that look very innocuous but would serve well for defense if needed, particularly if you are in a place that doesn't let you carry fixed, like I am, but doesn't limit folder length. Some folks may not be able to have better defense, or not want to carry an obvious dedicated defense knife like Cold Steel because of the Ads and the way that would/could be presented in court after a defense, or a Spyderco Civilian or Matriarch, because they are purpose-built.

But, can anyone say that about the Ontario RAT 1? I have a safety-orange RAT 1, and that knife is beefy and 3.6" and a quarter long, should be small by my judgement, but very decent size, beefy, stout blade. It is in safety Orange (yes, I think colors matter to some too, with this knife I feel like if anyone gasped at the sight of it I could just point at the color and say "Oh, no, its a safety knife, see?" and relieve them" knowing people...) and screams "work knife", it looks at home next to a Stanley utility knife or wrench.

Also, the Spyderco Endura. The Police is arguable, too, but.... "Police". some do not want any Mil/Police association on their knives as it could be seen as "copying" their techniques or whatever to do bad deeds. The Endura also screams "work knife", especially in some of the better colors like green, purple... I really want a waved one have it as a low-key compliment to my waved Matriarch 2. If you like the Yojimbo profile but don't wanna carry a made for SD knife, Michael Janich makes "Janduras" that he reprofiles. He even makes a grey one, so as to not look as tactical as the regular.

For those with lock restrictions, such as the UK, where I think pepper-spray is illegal, if you are a woodworker, carry a large Higonokami for your work. The large one is genuinely substantial. A Douk-Douk, both the large and extra large are substantial, as are Opinels no.9-13.
 
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Genuine KA-BAR
Always
fxj2KgD.jpg

I love these, haha. I lost my love for KA-BAR when I found out about Ontario knives, though, seems like stronger, for cheaper. Then again, have never handled a KA-BAR, so will reserve judgement until then! I only have their "Acheron" pocket fixed blade that I bought for $7 when I was just first getting into knives because it has the KA-BAR name. Has a terrible sheath and a re-curve, but I guess it makes a good knock-around knife for the house, I gave it to my mother to use before I gifted her a walnut handled Opinel no. 8
______________
As to what I think about city carry in regard to this thread, I was thinking about the idea of knives that look very innocuous but would serve well for defense if needed, particularly if you are in a place that doesn't let you carry fixed, like I am, but doesn't limit folder length. Some folks may not be able to have better defense, or not want to carry an obvious dedicated defense knife like Cold Steel because of the Ads and the way that would/could be presented in court after a defense, or a Spyderco Civilian or Matriarch, because they are purpose-built.

But, can anyone say that about the Ontario RAT 1? I have a safety-orange RAT 1, and that knife is beefy and 3.6" and a quarter long, should be small by my judgement, but very decent size, beefy, stout blade. It is in safety Orange (yes, I think colors matter to some too, with this knife I feel like if anyone gasped at the sight of it I could just point at the color and say "Oh, no, its a safety knife, see?" and relieve them" knowing people...) and screams "work knife", it looks at home next to a Stanley utility knife or wrench.

Also, the Spyderco Endura. The Police is arguable, too, but.... "Police". some do not want any Mil/Police association on their knives as it could be seen as "copying" their techniques or whatever to do bad deeds. The Endura also screams "work knife", especially in some of the better colors like green, purple... I really want a waved one have it as a low-key compliment to my waved Matriarch 2. If you like the Yojimbo profile but don't wanna carry a made for SD knife, Michael Janich makes "Janduras" that he reprofiles. He even makes a grey one, so as to not look as tactical as the regular.

For those with lock restrictions, such as the UK, where I think pepper-spray is illegal, if you are a woodworker, carry a large Higonokami for your work. The large one is genuinely substantial. A Douk-Douk, both the large and extra large are substantial, as are Opinels no.9-13.

Important factors in assessing the defensive potential of a tool are how quickly it can go from being carried to being ready and how many steps are in between those two points. That's why in the gun community, an important feature for holsters is the ability to get a full grip on the draw. That's also true of sheaths for defensive fixed blades. Obviously, these conditions render fixed blades vastly superior to folding knives and the carry method matters.
 
Important factors in assessing the defensive potential of a tool are how quickly it can go from being carried to being ready and how many steps are in between those two points. That's why in the gun community, an important feature for holsters is the ability to get a full grip on the draw. That's also true of sheaths for defensive fixed blades. Obviously, these conditions render fixed blades vastly superior to folding knives and the carry method matters.
This is why I'll always carry something with the wave feature if it is intended to help me survive in an emergency, and why I practice with it to prevent snagging. It is great to have something like a Voyager or Yojumbo in the pocket, too but the wave is near-mindless, if practiced. Thus, Matriarch 2, Espada XL find their way into my pocket. Soon, I will have a waved Endura to be more low-key, and a Black Talon II.
I put a lot of stock into folders because I do not have a legal excuse to carry a substantial (3+ inch) fixed blade while out on my nighttime walks with my girlfriend, which I would need. I would just put a nice fixed-blade on the belt at night and be done with it if I could, or better yet, a gun concealed in a holster, or both. This is in my future, but not while living where I am right now... 😪

A few weeks ago here, I had the police officer with the Dirty Harry profile pic shared a story with me to amswer question on an incident where a knife failed him, he couldn't deploy the flipper on a ZT while fighting for control of his gun, so he switched to an auto. This solidified the importance of grip, practice, fine motor skills, and reliable lock in my mind.
 
This is why I'll always carry something with the wave feature if it is intended to help me survive in an emergency, and why I practice with it to prevent snagging. It is great to have something like a Voyager or Yojumbo in the pocket, too but the wave is near-mindless, if practiced. Thus, Matriarch 2, Espada XL find their way into my pocket. Soon, I will have a waved Endura to be more low-key, and a Black Talon II.
I put a lot of stock into folders because I do not have a legal excuse to carry a substantial (3+ inch) fixed blade while out on my nighttime walks with my girlfriend, which I would need. I would just put a nice fixed-blade on the belt at night and be done with it if I could, or better yet, a gun concealed in a holster, or both. This is in my future, but not while living where I am right now... 😪

A few weeks ago here, I had the police officer with the Dirty Harry profile pic shared a story with me to amswer question on an incident where a knife failed him, he couldn't deploy the flipper on a ZT while fighting for control of his gun, so he switched to an auto. This solidified the importance of grip, practice, fine motor skills, and reliable lock in my mind.

This is a significant issue. As that officer's encounter shows, the number of steps between "carry" and "ready" generally translates to the number of opportunities for failure. Normal folders are terrible for this reason. Usually, getting to ready involves getting your hand on it, successfully getting it out of pocket, successfully deploying the blade to full lock-up, and successfully repositioning the knife in your hand to a usable grip. Each of those steps presents a chance to fail and some of them also introduce a chance for self-injury. The chain of processes might not even start until after an attack is underway. You might be injured or on the ground before the first step. Each successive step may need to take place while you are under aggressive assault. (This is why training with active resistance is so important.)

Knives with the wave feature might shave off a step. Of course, getting to "ready" is only the beginning of use. You still have to successfully use the defensive tool. While most modern locking folders will probably have some utility once ready, actually using them as a defensive tool can mean applying abrupt force at odd angles and those angles may change abruptly. It necessarily violates sound aphoristic rules like "treat all folding knives as if they are just that: knives that fold" and "any activity that would test the lock strength of a folder is not a job for a folder".

If you have checked the laws carefully, you really can't carry a gun or fixed blade, there is no permit process or whatever by which you can change that (and you aren't able to move), then I'd much rather see you work on your empty-handed skills. Think of it this way. Why build those steps and failure points into your defensive strategy just to get to a questionable defensive tool in the first place? Seriously, get to a local gym and spend some time on the mat. Hit the heavy bag. Grapple and spar with real live human beings. Aside from being fun and good for your health, that'll serve you better than a folding knife in lots of possible defensive situations.
 
This is a significant issue. As that officer's encounter shows, the number of steps between "carry" and "ready" generally translates to the number of opportunities for failure. Normal folders are terrible for this reason. Usually, getting to ready involves getting your hand on it, successfully getting it out of pocket, successfully deploying the blade to full lock-up, and successfully repositioning the knife in your hand to a usable grip. Each of those steps presents a chance to fail and some of them also introduce a chance for self-injury. The chain of processes might not even start until after an attack is underway. You might be injured or on the ground before the first step. Each successive step may need to take place while you are under aggressive assault. (This is why training with active resistance is so important.)

Knives with the wave feature might shave off a step. Of course, getting to "ready" is only the beginning of use. You still have to successfully use the defensive tool. While most modern locking folders will probably have some utility once ready, actually using them as a defensive tool can mean applying abrupt force at odd angles and those angles may change abruptly. It necessarily violates sound aphoristic rules like "treat all folding knives as if they are just that: knives that fold" and "any activity that would test the lock strength of a folder is not a job for a folder".

If you have checked the laws carefully, you really can't carry a gun or fixed blade, there is no permit process or whatever by which you can change that (and you aren't able to move), then I'd much rather see you work on your empty-handed skills. Think of it this way. Why build those steps and failure points into your defensive strategy just to get to a questionable defensive tool in the first place? Seriously, get to a local gym and spend some time on the mat. Hit the heavy bag. Grapple and spar with real live human beings. Aside from being fun and good for your health, that'll serve you better than a folding knife in lots of possible defensive situations.
I'll never again carry a flipper for this capacity because once you fail with them, you've failed, they are the hardest to "keep pushing" because the tab gets into the handle. I was rushing the other day to quickly grab my RAT and failed to deploy not once, but twice but because of the contact with the blade, as with a thumbstud, better with a hole, allows you to keep pushing even if you do not flick it open initially.
I also have targets, I seek to basically target certain muscles, areas, that would render a limb harder to operate.

As I have seen time and time again, though, empty handed skills as well as resistance is very important. I am in a place right now where I have a few other priorities to get straight before I can shell out for all the necessary training...or move. But I seek to go to a freer state, get armed, and get trained. I would already be. I am in a very weird situation here in CA.
 
My advice would be to spend some time learning about the city and avoid crime-infested areas. I've lived in major cities my whole adult life, including two that were then the murder capital of the US. Have never come remotely close to pulling a knife, let alone a gun, and would feel (and look like) a complete tool wearing a fixed blade in an urban area.
 
I'll never again carry a flipper for this capacity because once you fail with them, you've failed, they are the hardest to "keep pushing" because the tab gets into the handle. I was rushing the other day to quickly grab my RAT and failed to deploy not once, but twice but because of the contact with the blade, as with a thumbstud, better with a hole, allows you to keep pushing even if you do not flick it open initially.
I also have targets, I seek to basically target certain muscles, areas, that would render a limb harder to operate.

As I have seen time and time again, though, empty handed skills as well as resistance is very important. I am in a place right now where I have a few other priorities to get straight before I can shell out for all the necessary training...or move. But I seek to go to a freer state, get armed, and get trained. I would already be. I am in a very weird situation here in CA.

Once you've divorced your folding knife from any and all defensive notions, you get a lot more freedom in what you carry. As far as flippers, that's what I usually carry. (See my recent post in the Knives and Guns thread.) Quality manual flippers rarely fail to deploy for me and if they do, it's usually a matter of shaking them one way or the other. Honestly, my fail rate with thumb studs is worse. When I do fail on thumb studs, they usually stop with just a little bit of finger meat near or below the plane of the blade. So I suppose that if I got bumped hard while in the middle of flicking a thumb-stud knife, I could shave off a centimeter or so... :confused:

I got a job offer once that required moving to California. I turned it down. There is a lot of good out there but the laws (and some of the people) are crazy. Moving could work. There are a few Supreme Court cases coming up that could make things better but violating your natural rights is a very high priority for the people in charge there. It's a lot like New York, which is already taking steps to circumvent a possible pro-liberty ruling in one of those cases.

Priorities are what they are. If you have a gym with classes, BJJ, or even a boxing club within driving distance; swapping that in for your current fitness routine wouldn't be a bad idea.
 
My advice would be to spend some time learning about the city and avoid crime-infested areas. I've lived in major cities my whole adult life, including two that were then the murder capital of the US. Have never come remotely close to pulling a knife, let alone a gun, and would feel (and look like) a complete tool wearing a fixed blade in an urban area.

It doesn't make much sense to carry in an obvious way. Besides "looking like a tool", we live in a culture where some people are terrified of basic tools. As dumb as that might be, it is neither polite nor wise to randomly scare soccer moms and soy boys at the grocery store.

I sometimes carry a fixed blade as my primary cutting tool. I apply the same rules as I do for guns in public. If it is OWB or "outside the waist band" on a belt, it is usually a smaller knife and rendered innocuous by a cover garment. I sometimes carry a larger fixed blade as my primary defensive tool when traveling to places that violate natural rights. When I do that, I usually go IWB or "inside the waist band".
 
So we are considering a city knife for shanking fools?

The gerber centre drive is a multi tool with a pretty big knife. But also the needle nose pliers come out pretty quickly. And that would be devastating to get hit with.

Otherwise it has a decent tools set and it's screwdriver bit is a normal size so you can say get the corresponding screwdriver/Allen for whatever else for your other gadgets. Which can be handy as well.
 
Knives tend to work best as weapons for the person initiating the attack before you're ready. Your attacker is unlikely to be polite or sporting enough to give you the space to dig around in your pack for your knife and deploy it. Under extreme stress a lot of people are going to panic deploy a folder and drop it or cut themselves drawing a fixed blade, unless they have a lot of training/experience with blades. Legal issues aside, you're always better off learning a practical martial art that allows you to break contact, create space, and/or put an opponent down on the ground. You're even better off keeping your head up and stop staring at your phone, to avoid sketchy situations in the city developing around you. You should only carry knives as tools. Carrying them as weapons just puts you in legal jeopardy, whether it's getting your pack searched or an actual incident.

When I worked as a corporate thug, by chance my buddy ended up being the one at a job squared off with a guy who went for a boot knife. He swept kicked and then stomped him. This guy was a serial arsonist who got caught in the act and decided to go for a weapon and my buddy didn't give him the time or space he needed, plus he took advantage of him reaching awkwardly down for his knife. Naturally, the police took full credit in the media for the arrest, stating that it was as a result of the hard work they put in to solving the case, instead of a chance encounter with a not-policeman who delivered him gift wrapped. Over reliance on a weapon can often put you in a worse position than being unarmed.
 
My advice would be to spend some time learning about the city and avoid crime-infested areas. I've lived in major cities my whole adult life, including two that were then the murder capital of the US. Have never come remotely close to pulling a knife, let alone a gun, and would feel (and look like) a complete tool wearing a fixed blade in an urban area.
That sounds like good advice but public transit allows criminals to move around as freely as the rest of us. It can happen.
 
Concealing 5in to 6in fixed blade is relatively easy with the right sheath. Guys on this forum who've been around a long time have done it quite successfully. Joe paranee comes to mind.

If you are carrying a lot of excess weight it can be more difficult. Point is, wearing a fixed blade in public doesn't have to mean anyone notices it. Plenty of sheath/holster setups specifically for that purpose.

I carry a nearly 6in knife all the time, along with other purpose built rooty tooty point and shootys. Standing in line at a store you wouldn't have the slightest clue.
 
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