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Beyond Hair Whittling Sharp?
- Thread starter Vivi
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nozh2002
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Looking forward to this!
But it may be some natural limitation, when you just can not make it finer. hair is from 30micron thick so edge must be around 1-5 micron to whittle it. What if edge less then 0.1 micron just impossible to exist?
Thanks, Vassili.
But it may be some natural limitation, when you just can not make it finer. hair is from 30micron thick so edge must be around 1-5 micron to whittle it. What if edge less then 0.1 micron just impossible to exist?
Thanks, Vassili.
i remember when i was a kid, i used to watch batman beyond sometimes...
in this one episode there was a badguy that had a sword with an edge that was just "1 atom thick" or something like that...she stabbed it through cars and then whittled hairs...i want whatever she had!
i wonder if there is any limit to the fine-ness of an edge. i know that in theory an edge can be polished to a nearly infinite grit range, down to the tenths of microns and beyond, but i wonder if there seriously is any advantage to trying to push the limits.
i can't really think of any tests to test sharpness after whittling hairs...perhaps push cutting cord at incredibly low poundage...but that's not so fun.
in this one episode there was a badguy that had a sword with an edge that was just "1 atom thick" or something like that...she stabbed it through cars and then whittled hairs...i want whatever she had!
i wonder if there is any limit to the fine-ness of an edge. i know that in theory an edge can be polished to a nearly infinite grit range, down to the tenths of microns and beyond, but i wonder if there seriously is any advantage to trying to push the limits.
i can't really think of any tests to test sharpness after whittling hairs...perhaps push cutting cord at incredibly low poundage...but that's not so fun.
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There's always the dreaded thread and scale tests.
More quixotic tests would include:
More quixotic tests would include:
- Pushcutting toilet-paper
- Hair-scrimshaw
- Pushcutting vinyl discs so that they register on a turn-table as music
- Unlicensed micro-surgery
- Cleanly slicing newsprint
- That trick in Zorro (either slicing burning candles without disturbing them or undressing Michael Douglas' caregiver without cutting her skin)
- Making micro-brunoise out of four pounds of garlic and four pounds of unpitted olives in under 10 minutes with less than three ounce of waste (excluding pitts and olive liquids)
That measures edge retention in addition to sharpness, I am interested only in the latter in regards to this thread.
I never want to go back to scale and thread...at least not until I figure out a quicker way to do the tests. This is probably why I haven't done much edge retention testing yet, because I do not like setting up the scale 5 times per knife after cutting XX length of cardboard, and doing that multiple times throughout the day. I should hire someone to be my scale monkey.
Push cutting TP I haven't done, I'll have to try that. So much variation between brands though. Cleanly slicing newsprint isn't tough, I can push cut it. Scrimshawing a piece of hair...I'll get back to you on that one.
nozh2002
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If you able to whittle hair, you should be able to pushcut TP - it require similar sharpness.
Legend about bulat sad that saber cuts free falling silk or free sliding silk. I do not have free silk to try. But it will be interesting to reproduce this legend.
Thanks, Vassili.
Legend about bulat sad that saber cuts free falling silk or free sliding silk. I do not have free silk to try. But it will be interesting to reproduce this legend.
Thanks, Vassili.
Reminds me about the one I heard a few years ago...something like a Katana held in a stream and when a leaf was going downstream and hit the katana it split in two.
Sounded like some stupid mall ninja crap to me back then, but now I'm thinking it might be possible.
Sounded like some stupid mall ninja crap to me back then, but now I'm thinking it might be possible.
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If it's a katana, of course it's stupid crap. If it's a watered steel shamshir, well, it probably isn't true either, but they're so cool that it doesn't matter.
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I always found cutting hairs the next step above whittling. A knife that could easily whittle curls off the length of a free hanging hair may not be able to cut it clean off, away from the point of hold. The distance away from the point of hold is another part of the gauge.
nozh2002
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No way. It cut it easy and clean, try for yourself. First edge cut hair and then it starts whitteling it. If it cut - I sharpen it a bit and it starts whitteling.
Thanks, Vassili.
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*Whittle the hair of a blonde 2-6 yr old - a lot harder than your uncle who has to comb the hair coming out the collar of his shirt.
*Tree topping arm hair with edge held well above skin (on my arm, anyway)
*Cutting an empty water bottle in half - stand it up and swing at it.
*Cutting an empty water bottle in half leaving the bottom standing (good luck).
*Roll telephone book paper into a tube, and cut it.
*Roll computer paper into a tube and cut it leaving bottom standing.
All those are harder as your cut goes more to horizontal.
*Make a 90 degree fold the last 1/2" - 2" of a piece of paper - lay it down and pushcut the fold. The more you can fold up, the sharper.
*Fold a cigarette paper, stand it up, and cut it in half.
*Tree topping arm hair with edge held well above skin (on my arm, anyway)
*Cutting an empty water bottle in half - stand it up and swing at it.
*Cutting an empty water bottle in half leaving the bottom standing (good luck).
*Roll telephone book paper into a tube, and cut it.
*Roll computer paper into a tube and cut it leaving bottom standing.
All those are harder as your cut goes more to horizontal.
*Make a 90 degree fold the last 1/2" - 2" of a piece of paper - lay it down and pushcut the fold. The more you can fold up, the sharper.
*Fold a cigarette paper, stand it up, and cut it in half.
nozh2002
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If we're thinking of the same story, I think it was two swords. One by the apprentice, one by the master.
After long years of practice, yadda yadda the apprentice decided to show off to the master how sharp he got his new awesome sword, and when he placed it in the stream, it cut anything that would flow downstream, including leaves and fish, right in half.
The master said "yes, that is a sharp sword, but you are not a master."
He plucked his hair and dropped it on the sword (or something, I can't remember) to show that his sword was sharp, and put it in the river. As leaves and fish flowed up to the sword, the water sliced away from the edge, and neither leaf nor fish was cut. This was apparently a lesson to the apprentice that a sword must not just be sharp, but must be infused with a respect for innocence and all that.
Nice story anyway.
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Aargh. I meant to say "cleanly slicing wet newsprint." D'oh.
nozh2002
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One of the more repeatable tests that I like (and stole from Cliff and Alvin) is push cutting newspaper or pages out of a phone book. You can make a fold about 1/4 of an inch or 1/2 an inch from the edge, so that when you lay the paper down flat, the folded part is vertical. Try push cutting straight down on the vertical part.
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Huh. This is the opposite of what I remember. (haven't done a lot of in depth study on this lately) I could get them to "whittle" easier than cut it off clean. I wonder if we're using a different definition or method of whittling.
Usually when I did hair whittling, I held the tip of the hair so I could cut from tip to root. This way the little "scales" on the surface of the hair would catch the edge easier. (I've never seen these scales myself; I just remember seeing that on commercials for shampoo and hair conditioner.
) And indeed it did work much easier this way. It just seemed like once the edge caught on one of these scales, I could "peel" off a nice curl of the hair. Again, I thought of this more like "peeling" than whittling, where the edge would be actually cutting the entire way. Once it was sharp enough to cleanly cut the hair off, "whittling" became more difficult, because it was so easy for the edge to just go right through the hair rather than controlling it well enough to be able to peel off a nice long curl.
So, how are you using these definitions? When you're talking about whittling here, you mean you can actually control the depth of your cut to half a hair's thickness, on that flexible little hair? If so, then yes, I'd agree that's about the max sharpness I ever really tried for myself.