BK9 down

We'll get Kent Mansley right on it!
[video=youtube;PW-RHrX7Fnc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PW-RHrX7Fnc[/video]
 
yup, we see a few of these every Winter... esp with xmas trees being chopped.

branches near the trunk are HARD, and knots, when frozen are like ROCKS

what you got is a hemi-semi-circular chonchoidal blowout fracture - like chipping flint - or some hippie technical thing like that :D

and it's not uncommon with hard steels...

oh, i said xmas trees... a of firs, esp it seems hemlocks, have super hard knots and nodes, and uptake silica into themselves. you can actually get SPARKS...

sometimes too, you get embedded grit, nails, and other crap the tree took in, and grew around... sometimes the knife could be sharper too.

as i'm also fond of mentioning:i broke an AXE that way. actually twisted the head, and tore it off the not so obviously dry rotted handle. i got lucky with the "knot dying" ... they replaced the axe. i still have the old head, and sometimes take it out to hammer on, sooner or later i'll get that twist out. it's fun :D good dirt axe though :D :D :D

some axe makers will point out SPECIFICALLY to not chop on hemlock knots, can't recall which warranty/warning i read

search the forum, we've seen a number of BKs have these semi-circular blowouts... a few 9s, couple 7s, 2-3 6s at least, and i think a 10? never a 2 that i recall, but i could be wrong :D some others? mmm.

yeah, so warranty should be good, but remember kids: don't baton ever ;) don't chop frozen shit, esp knots, unless you use care, but hey, warranty ;)
 
Disclaimer: I'm a big fan of Ethan Becker and Becker knives. I'm also a big fan of Ka-Bar. I also happen to make knives for a living. I do not represent Ethan or Ka-Bar or any other knifemaking designer/manufacturer/company/marketer except myself, and none of them represent or endorse me.

Lots of fun and joking around in this thread... "ho haw, it'll sharpen right out"... But all kidding and smartassery aside, that is a VERY serious, nearly catastrophic failure. I'd be extremely pissed off if that happened to a knife I'd bought, and very deeply concerned if it happened to one of my knives.

The good news is, you've gotten the attention of some folks who sincerely care, and who have the ears of the manu and designer. I'm willing to bet, they'll do their best to figure out the cause and make it right for you. :thumbup:

I'm honestly surprised by a chip/chunk that large; I've very rarely seen that. It is not "normal" in any way for any decent steel with decent HT used in the manner you described, regardless of ambient temperature or whatever material you were chopping on. Somewhere along the line, something very, very wrong happened... whether it was a steel problem or an HT problem or someone beating on the knife with a Buick, I simply don't know.

I will not venture any further guess as to why that failure happened. My only advice is to contact Ka-Bar.
 
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Hey MadIndian.....

To get this outta the way....... A warranty replacement for sure...... Without seeing the blade up close I will not venture an opinion......

For some theoreticals see Bladites post above..... Should not have happened ....It did..... We will fix it..... Sorry that it happened and that you have to be put out some time...... If you show up anywhere around where I am the first brewski is on me...... Maybe two and three......

Thank you for your patience.......

Ethan

Ps.... I freaking hate when this happens....... Feces occur..... E
 
And here I though because the 9 was so big you were trying to put a second handle in the middle of the blade!

Sorry about your luck! KaBar will fix er up for ya!
 
Bladite...good info there.
Ethan is a good guy.
If I break one of mine Ethan I'll take you up on that beer offer!
 
that's horrible, but the response from mr. becker is why I recommend becker (and kabar) knives to anyone that will listen.

having said that, after seeing what happened to your 9, this kid is using his hatchet to chop from now on.
 
First I'd like to say even if there wasn't a warranty I'd be buying another, I don't abuse my knives in hopes of a free replacement I use my knives to the best of my ability and how I think they should/could be used, if I'm doing something wrong with them I'd rather know than repeat that's why I posted here to learn from my mistakes. Second Mr Becker nothing but gratitude, I look forward to a chance to meet you one day, I've learned a lot from you and many others here and truly enjoy your knives, I edc the bk11 or 14 daily (nyc legal) and on weekends if I have my bk11 kit on me I end up with 2 bk11s because of the one in my bag I carry when not in the city although I've been considering replacing the 11 with the 17 since I have that now and don't have the under 4" restriction not being in the city but that's another story. So thank you sir

I didn't post this one yesterday but you can see the three I've been talking about in the top of the pic, the one going up and out the top center is the one that it broke on
IMG_20150110_142852_zps2een7blq.jpg


I went back down last night to look at things with a headlamp, I guess I never thought of branches as knots before, and I wanted to see if there was any difference between what the 4 was going through as compared to the 9 but to me they looked the same, it was a standing dead of some sort, its been dead so long I don't remember the type and its been single digits and teens for a week now so frozen sure sounds right.

I also found a piece of the blade directly under the branch I was lopping off brought it in for a pic
IMG_20150110_212042378_zps65nsdblh.jpg


I'll email kbar now and send pics, I'll keep you all posted
 
I'm not one bit surprised that Mr. Becker stepped up to the plate :thumbup: That's one of the reasons so many people respect and admire him. :)
 
Hey MadIndian.....

Thanks for the kind words........ Your latest pic shows what appears to be a long dead pine...... Not sure about this but the appearance of the bark, the large annual rings and solid core make me pretty sure..... If my guess is correct then the area close to the trunk and at the point the branch formed in the tree will be quite resinous and can be hard as a freaking rock, especially if frozen.......

Those intersections are "pine knots' which are great for starting fires and are best harvested with a large club..... The joins are frequently almost solid, fiber reinforced pitch....... If the club breaks the limb outboard of the join try another until you get the hang of it........ When the main trunk is damn close to rotted away is the best time to do this harvesting..... Those pine and hemlock knots are way harder than hard wood.........

Give the fresh cut a sniff and see if it is pine...... If you can get a lengthwise cross section with a saw and study it a bit.....If I am right, you should be able to scrape some really resinous stuff off of it and it will make a great receptor for a ferro rod strike....

Ethan
 
Ethan Becker said:
Hey MadIndian.....

Thanks for the kind words........ Your latest pic shows what appears to be a long dead pine...... Not sure about this but the appearance of the bark, the large annual rings and solid core make me pretty sure..... If my guess is correct then the area close to the trunk and at the point the branch formed in the tree will be quite resinous and can be hard as a freaking rock, especially if frozen.......

Those intersections are "pine knots' which are great for starting fires and are best harvested with a large club..... The joins are frequently almost solid, fiber reinforced pitch....... If the club breaks the limb outboard of the join try another until you get the hang of it........ When the main trunk is damn close to rotted away is the best time to do this harvesting..... Those pine and hemlock knots are way harder than hard wood.........

Give the fresh cut a sniff and see if it is pine...... If you can get a lengthwise cross section with a saw and study it a bit.....If I am right, you should be able to scrape some really resinous stuff off of it and it will make a great receptor for a ferro rod strike....

Ethan
Click to expand...
I'll try to get those pine knots, its definitely pine just not sure what type it was, guess I missed that word typing too fast :D . and another lesson thank you.

I grabbed some wood that fell from being chopped, rotted or otherwise made some shavings and split some stuff down with the bk11 and firesteel was all I needed
IMG_20150110_203631_zps0ssjl3z4.jpg


and now I know not to do that again :-)
 
When a branch grows at an angle, as most do, the wood inside the angle is squeezed as the branch grows. That makes it extra dense. The only knife I ever did serious damage to got hurt when I tried to lop a branch off a black locust and got careless/lazy/stupid and chopped down into the branch angle. 0___0 I remember that mistake.
 
core branch wood, esp knots is very strong for the obvious reason

it also had more btus than the main trunk, due to density and stuff i can't fathom. branch wood is good wood for a hot fire. easier to collect.

yeah, use a club :) or the BACK of your axe...

back when Toooj was on here, we had a few discussions that someone can probably find, about the circular nature of these types of chips, resulting from hitting a VERY hard contact point, and basically getting a sonic blast resulting in that circular fracture - thing of it was a shock wave. bamf.

flint chips out if you do it right... apparently so can certain kinds of hard steels. it's unusual and stinks when it's your knife, but it's kinda cool too. something for the masters of metal and crystal to figure out how to prevent. chonchoidal. love that word :D
 
Thomas, just a heads up regarding Black Locust, it is a very hard and strong wood, competing with Hickory (Carya genus) as the strongest and stiffest domestic timber: but with more stability and rot resistance. It makes an awesome baton, and hiking sticks, grows quickly and relatively straight but has long thorns (1"+) that don't need time to harden, they will be firm and sharp from 1/4" out.

Ethan, thank you for the tip. I will be scouring my local woods to see what has fallen. I will be harvesting some of those branch bases. Great to know!
 
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