Blade hypocricy

[danthaman1980]

As a knife guy I hate to say it, but I do agree that high school kids should not be allowed to bring knives to school. My Junior year in HS I was assaulted with a rusty Old Timer in the lunchroom one day - a Senior went around cutting some underclassmen during lunch, and I took a 1" long, fairly deep slice to the back of the right hand. Looked down and saw a knife slicing through my flesh - Didn't see it coming, and didn't feel a thing... But I still have the scar.

However, teachers and administrators should be allowed to carry, as long as they keep them hidden and they don't become a distraction to the kids. And in the corporate world... we are all adults and should be able to handle ourselves responsibly.

 

[breakdown52]

And just turn in all your potential weapons in compliance with your Masters.

Screw Zero Tolerance. I went to High School during the mid 1980s in Kalifornia. I carried either a Sears/Camillus Buck 110 clone or a Pacific Cutlery Balisong in my back pocket. Had a lot of other classmates that carried a pocket knife of some sort too.

Fast forward about 15 years when my younger half-brother was attending High School in Georgia. Friend of his from Orchestra and a Honor Roll student gets suspended due to the Zero Tolerance policy. Knife wasn't even on him. The school did a random vehicle inspection and found a steak knife in the tool box in the trunk of his old beater car. Kid had forgotten it was in there. His father had left it in there after using it to cut some duct tape to fix one of the radiator hoses.

I understand what school officials are trying to do, but there needs to be some understanding of the situation & person involved. Cookie-cutter one punishment fits all is not the right response. And I have no answer or ideas on what to do about all the kids stabbing/shooting incidents. No idea why it is so much more of a problem now from when I was a kid, and we had more access to knives & firearms.

Even with these zero tolerance rules it doesn't make it any safer. It's only a rule, but that's never stopped a criminal has it? Heroine is illegal but how many cases do you hear of drug arrests. You can't tell a mass group of people to do something and expect them to turn into mindless obeying robots. It's just a crazy world...

 

[zerkom122]

I get asked why I need a knife by my family except for my dad and stepdad and it's always kinda awkward when I use a knife in front of my family I have a manix 2 lwt atleast I don't have an endura or fixed blade.

 

[scotchleaf]

Just carry the exact same model kitchen knife in a sheath?

 

[Thomas Linton]

As a knife guy I hate to say it, but I do agree that high school kids should not be allowed to bring knives to school. My Junior year in HS I was assaulted with a rusty Old Timer in the lunchroom one day - a Senior went around cutting some underclassmen during lunch, and I took a 1" long, fairly deep slice to the back of the right hand. Looked down and saw a knife slicing through my flesh - Didn't see it coming, and didn't feel a thing... But I still have the scar.

However, teachers and administrators should be allowed to carry, as long as they keep them hidden and they don't become a distraction to the kids. And in the corporate world... we are all adults and should be able to handle ourselves responsibly.

And doubtless there was a rule against his having that knife. Sure was a rule against attacking you. Don't rules just work great?

If the presence of knives caused violence, no one would escape alive from Blade.

 

[zzyzzogeton]

I stopped at the Home Depot to pick up some push points, glazing compound, putty knife, and a new glass cutter for a replacement window project. As I was going through the "Self Checkout", I was running my items through the bar code reader, when all,of a sudden the register locked down on me. The marquis read, see self checkout associate. The associate looked in my bag she pulled out the putty knife and asked to see ID. Dumbfounded I asked her why, she said store policy is anytime someone purchases a knife they have to be at least 18 years old and show proper identification.

Rather than just give her my drivers license, I decided to question the stores motive, so now the store manager shows up and asked me what my problem was. I explained to him a putty knife has no sharpened edge on it and is used for scraping. I asked him that if I bought a 12 inch saws all tree cutting blade would I need to be 18 also? Anyhow I've been around long enough to get that "peripheral feel" of causing a scene, so I showed him my ID, paid the machine then grabbed my bag and walked out into the parking lot while carrying my Hinderer XM 24 clipped to my front pocket and my concealed carry 38 revolver in an ankle holster all the while laughing to myself as I got into my Jeep. I mean WTF is going on here with our society, are we that paranoid that a manager has to ID a 60 yr old for buying a putty knife.

Must be a NY thing. Down here in Texas I have NEVER been asked for ID for the purchase of ANY kind of cutting tool, be it a knife, machete, axe, hatchet, etc.

 

[John_0917]

Must be a NY thing. Down here in Texas I have NEVER been asked for ID for the purchase of ANY kind of cutting tool, be it a knife, machete, axe, hatchet, etc.

Quick guess, NY "gravity knife" law interpretation, HD was one of the companies targeted a few years ago in Vance's crackdown/making his own laws on knives and it cost them a lot of merchandise.

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

I agree, although if we're going for most flawed I'd give slight edge to zero tolerance over Common Core personally, as an educator.

For one small thing that I personally think we're improving, check out Standards Based and Competency-Based Education. I'm a huge advocate of CBE.

Well let me throw my hat in. I'd go with standardized test based performance reviews that determine the teacher rating and pay scale. But there's so much that's so screwed up this could be an endless discussion.

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

As a fellow teacher.... why do you need a knife at school? I have never carried a knife at school and never had a time where I needed one. Just curious...

OK so I'm part teacher, part knife nut, but I only bring my.dragonfly to work. This week we have created a "mini economy" and all of my students need t create am art or craft they will sell at an "international market". I have all types of materials for them to use. Some students have asked me to cut Styrofoam for them because the scissors just crack it. Even if I don't have anything I really need it for, as an adult I just think I should be able to carry a small, legal knife as it just comes up as useful in every day life.

By the way, Great to see so many teachers around here on blade forums!

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

And doubtless there was a rule against his having that knife. Sure was a rule against attacking you. Don't rules just work great?

If the presence of knives caused violence, no one would escape alive from Blade.

While I definitely see your frustration, we can't just do away with rules because some choose to break them. Hell, people are gunna buy and sell crack anyway, let's just make it legal!

 

[RedLynx]

Well let me throw my hat in. I'd go with standardized test based performance reviews that determine the teacher rating and pay scale. But there's so much that's so screwed up this could be an endless discussion.

Also a problem that needs fixing, I agree.

 

[RedLynx]

While I definitely see your frustration, we can't just do away with rules because some choose to break them. Hell, people are gunna buy and sell crack anyway, let's just make it legal!

I agree with this in part, although not spending so much on the endless (and it really is never-ending) drug war would help, and cut into the lucrative black market.

But I wouldn't want my students toking up (or whatever they do these days) in the hallways either.

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

I agree with this in part, although not spending so much on the endless (and it really is never-ending) drug war would help, and cut into the lucrative black market.

But I wouldn't want my students toking up (or whatever they do these days) in the hallways either.

You make a good point. I don't think everyone should just be thrown in jail for nonviolent crimes. That just makes the problem worse. Then taxpayers have to pay for that persons sentence, the person is exposed and assimilated to the prison system and comes out worse for it...don't get me started on privately owned for profit prisons! OK, sorry I'm chilled out now, I'm blowing this way out of proportion.

We do need to learn to pick and choose our battles with weapons rights, drug control, etc. The whole one size fits all doesn't seem to lead to true justice often. Frankly I think wed make much more progress with preventative measures than punitive ones.

 

[Ankerson]

You make a good point. I don't think everyone should just be thrown in jail for nonviolent crimes. That just makes the problem worse. Then taxpayers have to pay for that persons sentence, the person is exposed and assimilated to the prison system and comes out worse for it...don't get me started on privately owned for profit prisons! OK, sorry I'm chilled out now, I'm blowing this way out of proportion.

We do need to learn to pick and choose our battles with weapons rights, drug control, etc. The whole one size fits all doesn't seem to lead to true justice often. Frankly I think wed make much more progress with preventative measures than punitive ones.

Well my take on the drug thing is that they choose to do the drugs in the 1st place or sell them etc so there needs to be some kind of punishment....

We could just shoot them taking them out of the gene pool, it's cheap and quick, but that wouldn't go over too well I don't think. Although they did make the choice to use or sell them.....

Drug abuse (use) is a real issue, but then so is alcohol abuse so some day they will have to start handing out much stiffer forms of punishment.....

Going after the dealers isn't the only solution, they need to start really getting more serious in the forms of punishment of the users.

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

Well my take on the drug thing is that they choose to do the drugs in the 1st place or sell them etc so there needs to be some kind of punishment....

We could just shoot them taking them out of the gene pool, it's cheap and quick, but that wouldn't go over too well I don't think.

Drug abuse (use) is a real issue, but then so is alcohol abuse so some day they will have to start handing out much stiffer forms of punishment.....

Going after the dealers isn't the only solution, they need to start really getting more serious in the forms of punishment of the users.

Often times people are a product of their environments. Not that people aren't still accountable for what they do, but you seem to have oversimplified this in the worst way. Rash and single minded decisions are not the way i would want to be handled in the eyes of justice for any wrongdoing, knife carrying or drug use.

Human beings can lead remarkably different lives. I know if you had been to the places I've been and seen the things I've seen you would feel differently. Many people throughout the world have been raised in hell. Each hell a different experience with a different outcome. While there are some who overcome such beginings I have seen many people while working at a residential facility for emotionally disturbed children. I've held a 10 year old girl who had a flashback that turned into a seizure so her head would not be damaged. She is the type of person who is at risk for such a future in attempt to escape her tortured mind. Heard things from other little children like her that have disturbed me as a grown man.

Easy for an outsider to just say she should be shot for using, not as easy to look into her eyes and her soul to see how she got that way.

Damn, I'm getting all emotional just thinking about her and others. I hope if their lives cant turn out better they are at least treated nicely and as humans in their life.

 

[Ankerson]

Often times people are a product of their environments. Not that people aren't still accountable for what they do, but you seem to have oversimplified this in the worst way. Rash and single minded decisions are not the way i would want to be handled in the eyes of justice for any wrongdoing, knife carrying or drug use.

Human beings can lead remarkably different lives. I know if you had been to the places I've been and seen the things I've seen you would feel differently. Many people throughout the world have been raised in hell. Each hell a different experience with a different outcome. While there are some who overcome such beginings I have seen many people while working at a residential facility for emotionally disturbed children. I've held a 10 year old girl who had a flashback that turned into a seizure so her head would not be damaged. She is the type of person who is at risk for such a future in attempt to escape her tortured mind. Heard things from other little children like her that have disturbed me as a grown man.

Easy for an outsider to just say she should be shot for using, not as easy to look into her eyes and her soul to see how she got that way.

That product of their environment argument is getting really old.....

Things have to stop someplace or some time if they are ever going to get better....

Over complicating things is the reason why nothing ever gets done or solved so uncomplicating things just might be a solution.

At some point and time a line has to be drawn as in enough is enough or it will just continue on and on and on forever as in we could still be having this exact conversation 50 years from now, or 100 years from now, or a 1,000......

I have been places like you are saying and that's why I can say the above, it has to stop some time.....

On the last thing... I have no comment.......

 

[Thomas Linton]

While I definitely see your frustration, we can't just do away with rules because some choose to break them. Hell, people are gunna buy and sell crack anyway, let's just make it legal!

I'm not frustrated. I'm disgusted.

Non-functional, feel-good rules absolutely should be done away with. Beyond not changing behavior (here, stopping violence) they create disrespect for law in general. Prohibition of alcohol is the classic example.

As for drugs in particular, we need to find a better way than punishment. Drugs are at all-time highs in supply and quality and all-time lows in price on the street. Econ 101. We can't build prisons fast enough to hold the convicted users, so judges are ordering us to set them free by the 10,000's. States are ignoring federal felony statutes to legalize some "controlled substances." What does that tell us about the status of the "War on Drugs"?

 

[Ankerson]

A few more comments.

Over Complicating things works both ways as in it lets good honest people get screwed over because certain people (Companies) know they can get away with it MOST of the time because the legal system in this Country is so screwed up and corrupt.

Also the criminals use the system against us, and the systems makes it easy because it over complicated....

We already have more than enough laws in the Country that we don't need anymore, what needs to happen is the ones we have need to be enforced...... I mean really enforced......

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

That product of their environment argument is getting really old.....

Things have to stop someplace or some time if they are ever going to get better....

Over complicating things is the reason why nothing ever gets done or solved so uncomplicating things just might be a solution.

At some point and time a line has to be drawn as in enough is enough or it will just continue on and on and on forever as in we could still be having this exact conversation 50 years from now, or 100 years from now, or a 1,000......

I have been places like you are saying and that's why I can say the above, it has to stop some time.....

On the last thing... I have no comment.......

Have you looked into social Darwinism? Its really seems up your ally. I think there was a German dude who emerged in the 30s who also had a similar outlook on how to handle social problems.

 

[Ankerson]

I'm not frustrated. I'm disgusted.

Non-functional, feel-good rules absolutely should be done away with. Beyond not changing behavior (here, stopping violence) they create disrespect for law in general. Prohibition of alcohol is the classic example.

As for drugs in particular, we need to find a better way than punishment. Drugs are at all-time highs in supply and quality and all-time lows in price on the street. Econ 101. We can't build prisons fast enough to hold the convicted users, so judges are ordering us to set them free by the 10,000's. States are ignoring federal felony statutes to legalize some "controlled substances." What does that tell us about the status of the "War on Drugs"?

That's because nobody wants to make the hard decisions that it would take to really solve the issues....

Prohibition was a joke, they needed to take a much harder line on it back then as in a whatever it takes to stop it and have the punishment at a level so severe that people wouldn't even think of taking a drink.

There is supply and demand.....

To stop it the supply has to be be cut off and the demand has to cut off also..... So both things need to be addressed equally, immediately and harshly with no exceptions.