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Blade shapes for Filipino arts
- Thread starter Hesparus
- Start date
I carry a folder in my right front pants pocket and another in my left rear pocket. I also carry a fixed blade (Cold Steel "Spike") on my belt in my back.
To me, brands of knives are not that important. I do have an Emerson and alot of Benchmade knives and a bunch of others but I usually carry the cheaper ones. They are very sharp and if I end up loosing them it doesn't bother me as bad. I don't use them as utility knives. I have one of those too.
Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
To me, brands of knives are not that important. I do have an Emerson and alot of Benchmade knives and a bunch of others but I usually carry the cheaper ones. They are very sharp and if I end up loosing them it doesn't bother me as bad. I don't use them as utility knives. I have one of those too.
Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
Based on your credentials, I have an additional question for you. I asked my original question because I am a knifemaker who likes to make defensive carry knives. My martial arts training is in japanese styles and so most of the fighting knives I make are for those kinds of arts. I seem to encounter more people who are into Filipino knife arts but I am unable to help them because I don't know what kinds of blades are best. So if you wouldn't mind helping me out, I'd be interested in knowing what you would consiter the properties of the perfect knife for your style. Specificly, the length, blade shape, weight, balance point, grip type, and material consiterations, as well as carry style. If there is a difference, I'd appreciate it if you could differentiate between optimal for fighting, and optimal for carry. I'll post a picture of the design when I'm done. I realize that this is a lot to ask so I'll understand if you don't have the time or desire to answer all of my questions. It's just that I am very into the functional design of knives, so I get really excited when I have the opertunity to collaborate with a martial arts instructer.
Thank you in advance.
- Chris
p.s. In the event that I make a knife that I recieved significant input from you on, I would credit you appropriately for the design.
Thank you in advance.
- Chris
p.s. In the event that I make a knife that I recieved significant input from you on, I would credit you appropriately for the design.
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2004
- Messages
- 466
I like the blades short relative to the handle. 3 1/2 inch blade, flanges on the top and bottom of the tang above the handle to create a pseudo cross guard, and a large handle to allow for a solid grip and expose some punho. Id say maybe an overall package of 8 1/2 inches. I find in FMA the vitals that are targeted are so specific that there is really no need for a monster 15 blade. Youre not trying to lop off limbs with Sayoc training. You can just buy a machete and do that with minimal training. You dont need such a big blade to sever a carotid, brachial, femural artery or slice a lower abdomen wide open. 3 1/2 inches is quite enough for this without making for an illegal or difficult to carry blade. Portability and easy of draw are much more critical, also the punho comes in handy for removing blocks and redirecting your attack.
You know, I have to pretty much agree with Roodog. I don't need a 15" blade. I like smaller more concealable knives. 3 1/2 inch blade (8-8 1/2 overall) sounds good to me 
. You don't need a footlong Buck knife to blueworm someone. I also like small/medium sized karambits as well. One thing I don't like are neck knives. I cut myself on the stomach one to many times drawing it out. As for the shape of the blade, I like spear point blades more than others. And a light to medium weight. I also prefer fixed blades to folders. Carry option: Lower back on belt (horizontal) or a draw on the right hip (horizontal).
Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
. You don't need a footlong Buck knife to blueworm someone. I also like small/medium sized karambits as well. One thing I don't like are neck knives. I cut myself on the stomach one to many times drawing it out. As for the shape of the blade, I like spear point blades more than others. And a light to medium weight. I also prefer fixed blades to folders. Carry option: Lower back on belt (horizontal) or a draw on the right hip (horizontal).Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
Thanks for the input, guys. I've got some specific questions about the blade you have in mind before I move on to the handle. You both talk about spear point blades. How deep of a belly are you thinking of? Do you prefer a symmetrical spear-point, or the point slightly back in order to increase the depth of the belly for better cutting power? How steep of a point do you like?
Here's a picture of the Ka-Bar "Impact Spearpoint" for reference:
The blade is slightly asymmetrical, it has a moderate steepness to the point, and a medium belly. As it is in the middle for most aspects (and about the dimentions you are talking about) I thought we could use it as a starting point.
https://www.kabar.com/images/1461_large.jpg
- Chris
Here's a picture of the Ka-Bar "Impact Spearpoint" for reference:
The blade is slightly asymmetrical, it has a moderate steepness to the point, and a medium belly. As it is in the middle for most aspects (and about the dimentions you are talking about) I thought we could use it as a starting point.
https://www.kabar.com/images/1461_large.jpg
- Chris
- Joined
- May 21, 2000
- Messages
- 6,277
I carry fixed blades and folders; mostly folders though.
As for fixed blades, I like something in the 4" - 6" range. When knives get much larger than that, they become harder to carry and slower in my hand. My favorite fixed blade for carry is the Spyderco Perrin. It's my basis for what a good SD knife should be.
All of my folders are in the 3" - 4" range. My two main SD folders are my Military and Chinook II.
As for fixed blades, I like something in the 4" - 6" range. When knives get much larger than that, they become harder to carry and slower in my hand. My favorite fixed blade for carry is the Spyderco Perrin. It's my basis for what a good SD knife should be.
All of my folders are in the 3" - 4" range. My two main SD folders are my Military and Chinook II.
Hesparus said:
In the style of Sir Mix Alot's "Baby got Back"
I like deep bellys and I can not lie
you other brothers can't deny
when my knife comes in
on your little bitty waist
and your blood spits in my face
your guts sprung
.....
I'll stop there, I could go on forever.
Sifu Kevin
I've trained a bit in FMA/Kali, and what I noticed most in the techniques used is a lot a slashing is used compared to thrusting/stabbing moves.
Based on this, I would prefer a blade with a nice recurve, such as the CS Vaquero Grande or the Benchmade Skirmish. The recurve would increase the "bite" of the blade when making contact in a slash, especially when the blade is drawn through the...well, whatever you draw it through...
Based on this, I would prefer a blade with a nice recurve, such as the CS Vaquero Grande or the Benchmade Skirmish. The recurve would increase the "bite" of the blade when making contact in a slash, especially when the blade is drawn through the...well, whatever you draw it through...
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2004
- Messages
- 58
I carry a 3 1/2 inch folder but would prefer to carry a fixed blade around the same length.
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2004
- Messages
- 466
Photo Murray said:I carry a 3 1/2 inch folder but would prefer to carry a fixed blade around the same length.
So whats stopping you, legality? If so, thats sad! I cant stand anti fixed blade laws like Cali. You can carry a Cuda Maxx in California but not a little fixed blade
Hesparus, the spearpoint on the knife you posted looks great, just ad alittle belly to the blade and Id go alittle shorter still. That thing looks over 4 inches.
I do like claw style blades. Especially the "Claw HideAway Knife". I got one from James Coogler with the handle cord wrapped. Man its sweet!
Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
I've got a pretty good blade drawn out a hair under 3.5", real deep belly, recurve, and it even looks good but it needs a handle. Early on, the consensus was 4.5"-5". What I've got is 4.125". Roodog, you mentioned having a "punho" - I don't know what that is.
In any case, I need some input about what kind of handles you like.
Here are some of my more typical handles:
- Chris
In any case, I need some input about what kind of handles you like.
Here are some of my more typical handles:
- Chris
[Cyclone] said:You know, I have to pretty much agree with Roodog. I don't need a 15" blade. I like smaller more concealable knives. 3 1/2 inch blade (8-8 1/2 overall) sounds good to me
Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
Sifu Smith,
what do you mean blueworm someone? i've never heard that term. Are you a knife instructor?
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2004
- Messages
- 466
Punho is a term used to describe the exposed part of the knife handle opposite the blade. This is the reason I prefer a smaller blade and larger handle, more handle+more punho exposed.The butt end portion of the handle that is not enclosed in the fist.
This allows for some level of hooking the opponents and clearing blocks with the loaded hand while redirecting the attack at the same time. This clearing of the block is usually done most effectively buy hooking and pulling throught the weak line of the opponents' blocking limb. With any luck (I have to relly on that since I lack in skill) it will open up another line of attack as well.
Blueworm is a term Ive heard used (specially in the Sayoc Kali system) to describe a deep horizontal lower abdominal cut that usually disembowels the opponent. The reason this is called the blue worm is that supposedly the large intestines look like a big blue worm when thay come falling out. I cant attest to that as Ive never seen it. I still used the term cause blueworm is easier than saying lower abdominal horizontal deep disemboweling cut.
Hesparus, the handle of the last knife you posted is too dedicated to a certain type of grip (saber, with the thumb in th notch on top of the blade) I was always taught that when using a sak-sak (saber grip) you should wrap your thumb around the handle a close the grip for added security. Its much easier to strip someones knife out of their hand if they dont have a closed grip on it. IMHO, I prefer a more generic handle that allows for different grips with a resonable amount of comfort and security. I do like the oval shape of that handle and the rounded butt end provides a nice place for the thumb to rest when in reverse grip. I would just do away with the finger notches and the notch on top of the blade. Just personal preference thought. I would suggest you play around with as many knives as you can get your hands on and figure out what feels good to you in the grips yuo normally use.
This allows for some level of hooking the opponents and clearing blocks with the loaded hand while redirecting the attack at the same time. This clearing of the block is usually done most effectively buy hooking and pulling throught the weak line of the opponents' blocking limb. With any luck (I have to relly on that since I lack in skill) it will open up another line of attack as well.
Blueworm is a term Ive heard used (specially in the Sayoc Kali system) to describe a deep horizontal lower abdominal cut that usually disembowels the opponent. The reason this is called the blue worm is that supposedly the large intestines look like a big blue worm when thay come falling out. I cant attest to that as Ive never seen it. I still used the term cause blueworm is easier than saying lower abdominal horizontal deep disemboweling cut.
Hesparus, the handle of the last knife you posted is too dedicated to a certain type of grip (saber, with the thumb in th notch on top of the blade) I was always taught that when using a sak-sak (saber grip) you should wrap your thumb around the handle a close the grip for added security. Its much easier to strip someones knife out of their hand if they dont have a closed grip on it. IMHO, I prefer a more generic handle that allows for different grips with a resonable amount of comfort and security. I do like the oval shape of that handle and the rounded butt end provides a nice place for the thumb to rest when in reverse grip. I would just do away with the finger notches and the notch on top of the blade. Just personal preference thought. I would suggest you play around with as many knives as you can get your hands on and figure out what feels good to you in the grips yuo normally use.
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2004
- Messages
- 466
[Cyclone] said:I do like claw style blades. Especially the "Claw HideAway Knife". I got one from James Coogler with the handle cord wrapped. Man its sweet!
Sifu Kevin B. Smith
http://mmai.us
I saw frontsight's photos of those in the sale forum and you are very lucky and I am very envious. Nice knife.
Roodog - as a matter of fact, that handle works very well with a reverse grip, too. The groove above the handle can either support your thumb if held in the saber grip, or the heel of your palm if held in the reverse grip. The people who I have made this handle type for always remark at how well it works. I typically only use that grip on custom jobs, though, as it requires measuring the hand of its intended user. The other picture (I'm not sure what happened to it, it was there this morning) shows the handle I use on knives when I don't know who might be using it.
In any case, I'll take your ideas into consiteration. I'm going to try to post a picture of my current design later on today.
- Chris
In any case, I'll take your ideas into consiteration. I'm going to try to post a picture of my current design later on today.
- Chris