Bob Dozier can not Bushcraft (Bob Dozier K-36 Bushcraft 2nd Generation)

U

ukknifer

Joined
Jan 30, 2010
Messages
424
P.S Yes I know he is a legend
and I respect his history and like his skinners but,
I mean this knife (in my opinion) ticks the wrong boxes in my bushcraft form. What is this? Hollow scandi with a bevel? With the most important part of the blade that is closest to the handle unsharpened and in D2???? Just saying

Bob Dozier K-36 Bushcraft 2nd Generation
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While I don't disagree with you, I think most "bushcraft" knives are poor excuses for knives to start with... YMMV.
 
I wouldn't get it for those purposes, although I DO feel he makes fantastic blades.

Strike 1 - Large guard keeps you from cutting in close to the wood on flat cuts.
Strike 2 - Edge isn't sharpened all the way back to the handle.
Strike 3 - Hollow scandi with secondary defeats the purpose/ease of field maintenance of the scandi grind that makes it so well suited to true bushcraft use

Sure this could be a great knife for general purpose use and work well enough to get by in the woods. Doizer does fantastic quality blades. However as a dedicated bushcraft knife that focuses on woodcraft in the bush, I think it has some major design flaws.
 
The Alan Wood Woodlore knives come with a slight hollow grind as well, and that is pretty much the granddaddy of all "bushcraft" knives. From Alan's site:

"Given that these early blades were in the hands of practising bushcraft people I had a few returned for reconditioning of the edge bevel and found people weren’t laying the whole bevel flat on the hone during sharpening so creating a thick secondary bevel which destroyed the cutting ability. I decided that it would be best to supply the blades with a mild hollow grind similar to that produced when a knife is reground on a Tormek or similar machine. This would allow users much speedier sharpening sessions in the early stages when they weren’t so skilled or patient."
 
Well, this just underscores why I would never buy a knife just because it was labeled as a "bushcraft" model (no offense to Mr. Dozier, who is an excellent knife maker). Any knife should be evaluated by its design and attritbues for your intended puprose/s, not by a name.
 
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Correct me if I'm wrong... but isn't the blade not sharpened all the way back so that you can "choke up" on the blade and use it as a finger choil? And I personally love D2, it takes the best edge out of all my steels and I've never had an issue with it not being tough enough.

I agree with the hollow grind, seems to be a weird choice for an outdoor all-purpose "utility" knife.
 
I know Bob personally, and, though we share a love of hunting and the woods, he's not a bushcrafter in the modern sense.


Like others have staled, bushcraft knives have many interpretations, and this knife is not too far off the mark.

I too would like the cutting edge to end loser to the handle for those notching cuts, but I bet that shallow hollow ground edge with a secondary bevel cuts like a laser.

I bet that Bob's edge holds up to tough use better then any zero ground scandi would.


I would be happy to give this unusual variation of the Bushcraft knife a test, and would expect good performance out of it.



Big Mike
 
The so-called "Scandi" grind was a relatively recent development of UK "bushcrafters." A couple of decades back, no one had heard of it.

The "Scandi" is not traditional in Scandinavia or Finland. I have many knives from that area, custom and factory, and I have handled many more. Very few meet the UK definition of a "Scandi" grind. Well over 90% have a secondary bevel. Many customs are slightly hollow ground since the makers use wheels to grind them. Some are convex. Some are diamond-shaped in cross section. Some are flat-ground. Some have fullers.

Even the mod of the Scandi forum at BritishBlades tried to explain to the panting multitudes that the "Sandi" was not advised for actual work in the bush and was not traditonal, but a myth is apparently more attractive than reality.

Will a Nordic maker turn out such a knife for you? Sure. They also make bowie pattern hunting knives with large double guards, and they laugh all the way to the bank.

Nor is the "Scandi" traditional with professional wood carvers. But what could they know about carving wood?

What, for that matter, could Bob Dozier know about making a cutting tool?
 
Thomas Linton said:
The so-called "Scandi" grind was a relatively recent development of UK "bushcrafters." A couple of decades back, no one had heard of it.

The "Scandi" is not traditional in Scandinavia or Finland. I have many knives from that area, custom and factory, and I have handled many more. Very few meet the UK definition of a "Scandi" grind. Well over 90% have a secondary bevel. Many customs are slightly hollow ground since the makers use wheels to grind them. Some are convex. Some are diamond-shaped in cross section. Some are flat-ground. Some have fullers.

Even the mod of the Scandi forum at BritishBlades tried to explain to the panting multitudes that the "Sandi" was not advised for actual work in the bush and was not traditonal, but a myth is apparently more attractive than reality.

Will a Nordic maker turn out such a knife for you? Sure. They also make bowie pattern hunting knives with large double guards, and they laugh all the way to the bank.

Nor is the "Scandi" traditional with professional wood carvers. But what could they know about carving wood?

What, for that matter, could Bob Dozier know about making a cutting tool?
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I wish this was required reading for all aspiring bushcrafty-types. I can't think of another knife grind with more misconseptions so frequently attached to it.
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Smithhammer said:
I wish this was required reading for all aspiring bushcrafty-types. I can't think of another knife grind with more misconseptions so frequently attached to it.
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Yes.

Here is one of the first few out of the shop.
First generation if you will.


AFAIK the change for the 2nd generation was a thicker handle.

The hollow grind?
On mine, I had to hold the straight edge and blade up to the light to see any gap at all.
The gap that a hollow grind would make is barely discernible. It is essentially flat.

Has the OP handled and used the Dozier Bushcrafter?
Or simply opining from a photo on the inter webs?
 
ukknifer said:
P.S Yes I know he is a legend
and I respect his history and like his skinners but,
I mean this knife (in my opinion) ticks the wrong boxes in my bushcraft form. What is this? Hollow scandi with a bevel? With the most important part of the blade that is closest to the handle unsharpened and in D2???? Just saying

Bob Dozier K-36 Bushcraft 2nd Generation
7-25-3.jpg
Click to expand...

Even from the picture you can see the secondary bevel. So not a UK "Scandi."
 
Scandi grinds iv had should be simple to keep a keen edge on a stone but no all seem to be hollow ground and the problem is it's so shallow you might not realise until your in to it and then the amount of stock you take off is years worth ? We have a maker in the uk mark hill (hill bill) who does real scandi grinds ,one grind one stone one minute , for a bushy the grind should be up close or your gonna fatigue the wrist real fast . In fact the scandi grind couldn't be any easier in reality as it's set up at the right degree by the maker.
 
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to get a knife the way you want it to be, you should seek out a maker that can follow directions. Give him the specs for materials, grind, bevel, size, and let him make what you think works best for your uses.
Then you have no one to castigate except yourself. :D
 
Thomas Linton said:
The so-called "Scandi" grind was a relatively recent development of UK "bushcrafters." A couple of decades back, no one had heard of it.

The "Scandi" is not traditional in Scandinavia or Finland. I have many knives from that area, custom and factory, and I have handled many more. Very few meet the UK definition of a "Scandi" grind. Well over 90% have a secondary bevel. Many customs are slightly hollow ground since the makers use wheels to grind them. Some are convex. Some are diamond-shaped in cross section. Some are flat-ground. Some have fullers.

Even the mod of the Scandi forum at BritishBlades tried to explain to the panting multitudes that the "Sandi" was not advised for actual work in the bush and was not traditonal, but a myth is apparently more attractive than reality.

Will a Nordic maker turn out such a knife for you? Sure. They also make bowie pattern hunting knives with large double guards, and they laugh all the way to the bank.

Nor is the "Scandi" traditional with professional wood carvers. But what could they know about carving wood?

What, for that matter, could Bob Dozier know about making a cutting tool?
Click to expand...
While I will agree with you that the recent popularity of zero scandi grinds is probably not coming out of scandinavia, I will disagree with you that the scandi is not "traditional". I, too, have many knives from that area, being from that area ancestrally, and quite a few are zero scandi's.

They don't always stay that way, as you point out. Adding a quick secondary bevel was and is a quick way of regaining an edge in the field. And many a farmer will use a wheel because it's quicker.

But the oldest Finnish knife I've ever seen still in use, by an ancient relative of mine, is a pure zero scandi blade that his father made at his shop near Rovaniemi.
 
I agree that knives may start out one way and end up another.

I should have been clearer that a few of the knives I own or have seen are "Scandi" as defined by the UK bushcrafters.

"Traditional"? Now that I think about it, not sure if there is one meaning for that word. Probably, like "genuine" and "authentic," it has many meanings-- or none.

The notion that "Scandi" is the predominant way that knives are used in Nordic areas? I guess that is what I was thinking of when I used "traditional." I don't own anything older than the 1920's, but they are a diverse family. A low saber with a single, flat bevel is a rare "child."

For that matter, I have seen many knives with secondary or convex bevels and hollow ground called "Scandi."

I really love the rhombic blades.


 
If yea want to sell a few more knives make one named "Bushcraft". Most crafters with skill can use most any knife within reason to get the job done. Betting the same applies here.
 
Thomas Linton said:
For that matter, I have seen many knives with secondary or convex bevels and hollow ground called "Scandi."
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Thomas hits the nail squarely on the head with that observation.


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"Scandi" is as much about the style and usage of the knife as it is about the actual final grind.

Those that think that a true "Scandi" is only a zero edge saber grind have not studied the history of the traditional tools of those tough Scandinavian people.



Big Mike
 
Thomas Linton said:
The so-called "Scandi" grind was a relatively recent development of UK "bushcrafters." A couple of decades back, no one had heard of it.

The "Scandi" is not traditional in Scandinavia or Finland. I have many knives from that area, custom and factory, and I have handled many more. Very few meet the UK definition of a "Scandi" grind. Well over 90% have a secondary bevel. Many customs are slightly hollow ground since the makers use wheels to grind them. Some are convex. Some are diamond-shaped in cross section. Some are flat-ground. Some have fullers.

Even the mod of the Scandi forum at BritishBlades tried to explain to the panting multitudes that the "Sandi" was not advised for actual work in the bush and was not traditonal, but a myth is apparently more attractive than reality.

Will a Nordic maker turn out such a knife for you? Sure. They also make bowie pattern hunting knives with large double guards, and they laugh all the way to the bank.

Nor is the "Scandi" traditional with professional wood carvers. But what could they know about carving wood?

What, for that matter, could Bob Dozier know about making a cutting tool?
Click to expand...

Thomas,

Respectfully ....

Knife makers like Mora/Frost, Helle, and Roselli have zero grind scandis, and the Laurie scandi blades with very small secondary grinds

Are you saying that the way they grind their blades is due to British bushcrafters, where the market and the influence is that strong to get Swedish, Noregian, and Finish knife makers all grinding a certain way?
Or is the scandi infact a much older grind than a recent marketing fashion?
 
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