boker reality based folder any good?

Yeah man, I just bought mine earlier this week in fact. I really had no particular use for it as I definitely am not a knife-fighter, but I really dig the design so I sprung for one. The main knock on it from some others will probably be the 440C steel from Taiwan, but then, if they used ultra high-grade steel they wouldn't list for only $90 bucks either. I have no problem with the steel, and the rest of the knife is built like a brick sh*t-house! The lockback is solid as a rock with no horizontal or vertical play at all. The action is pretty stiff compared to any of my other folders, but all of them are liner-locks so I think that's to be expected. There's always some tension on the hard-chromed race from the lock spring. It takes a hard flick of the wrist to open it one-handed, whereas, with most of my other folders I can open them with only a flick of the thumb against the stud. But I'm getting used to it. It's a little trickier closing it one-handed, but I've got that down now with only a couple of small knicks on my forefinger to show for it.

I did a search on eBay to find this one. I can't say for sure what the search criteria was, but it was something different than "boker" or "Reality Based Blade." I think I searched on "Jim Wagner" and came upon a lonely little auction that had only been viewed 20 times, and no one was bidding on it. The minimum bid was $45, and that's exactly what I got it for, plus shipping. I think I got a deal!

Here's a couple or three pics I just took today:

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Almost as goofy looking as Dork Ops. . . :barf: in some ways worse (than the ones DO stole from ER at least)
 
Hey, i like that knife! Call me a mall ninja if you will, but also call me a person with one more knife in my collection.:D
 
The reviews on the german knife forum were very positiv. Quality and function really seems to be OK. Wheter you like the design or not is another thing.
 
Well that's weird. I could've sworn I clicked on the "Knife Reviews and Testing" forum, but the vast majority of replies other than mine take personal digs at people who like the knife rather than commenting on the knife itself at all. "Mall ninja?" What does that even mean? What knife might one admit to owning to be safe from such juvenile insults being hurled at them? Jeesh, you'd think, with the humongous variety of knives available to enjoy looking at pictures of, if you don't like the one being discussed and pictured in this thread that you'd just move on to one where you will get some enjoyment, instead of spewing your self-perceived knife-snobbery. While trying to make me look bad for owning, and more importantly, enjoying owning, the subject-knife, you simply accomplished making yourselves look petty and small-minded. What fun. We'll have to get together and do this again sometime, eh? :jerkit:

Blues
 
Can't get used to it. I handled one at Knife Center and didn't like the blade very much. The tip is only really good for penetration as it is very thin and I wouldn't want to use it for hard work. The line on the blade is to mark how deep you need to stab someone to kill them. Very Dork Ops like. Read the info from the Boker website:

"Just by looking at this knife for the first time, you know it's a professional tactical tool to defend yourself. After world-famous knife fighting expert Jim Wagner trained Germany's top counterterrorist team, GSG9, in knife tactics, we at Boker asked him if he would design the ultimate tactical folding knife for police, military and security personnel, and this is the result - the Jim Wagner Reality-Based Blade. This knife has tactical features that no other folder has - a gladius penetrating tip, a cutting kriss curve, two blood grooves in the blade, ergonomic finger grooves with anti-slip texturing, and a Thumb Guide Slide that guides the operator's thumb to the thumb stud for immediate deployment. Also featured is a clip kit that allows the operator to choose between a standard heavy-duty window-breaker or one that looks like an ordinary writing pen clip for undercover operations where conceiling the knife, and yet having instant access, is crucial. It has two lanyard holes for air, water and wilderness operations, and it comes in tactical subdued black. When the blade is retracted, the handle and exposed blade back is designed to be a tight impact weapon. To absorb the tremendous forces you can put to the knife, there is a solid lock back mechanism. Under the fiberglass-reinforced plastic, there are two 1 mm stainless steel liners to strengthen the construction and to give the right weight to the hand. The blade is made of 440C high performance stainless steel, which guarantees superior edge-holding ability and corrosion resistance. Not only does this weapon bear the name of the designer, but the blade is also emlazoned with the name of the fastest growing and most complete martial arts system in the world, Reality-Based Personal Protection. Jim Wagner's system has been taught to the American FBI, Brazilian GATE, Argentinean GOE, Israeli Special Forces, German Federal Police, Canadian Royal Mounted Police, and the list goes on. All the experiences the designer had during his several police and military missions were put into the concept of this knife. Overall length 9 1/16". Blade length 3 7/8". Weight 6.2 oz."

Very likely to get you into a heap of trouble in a court of law when brought up as evidence. They even call it a weapon in the description. To each his own though as stated above. At least you got it cheap. Boker makes some quality blades but I think a thicker tip as well as not having the markings on the blade would have been nicer. Did you buy this as a weapon? Did you order the video that Boker sells on how to use this knife? www.Bokerusa.com has the video for sale. Good luck with it. Lastly, I see that you are a little newer around here than some of us. Some of us (many) laugh at this kind of advertizing because it adds to the negative aspect of our hobby. Yeah any knife can be used as a weapon in a trained hand. But why advertize a knife as a weapon? That is asking for problems. Dark Ops AKA Dork Ops is great for doing just that. That is why you are getting flack.
 
BluesStringer said:
Well that's weird. I could've sworn I clicked on the "Knife Reviews and Testing" forum, but the vast majority of replies other than mine take personal digs at people who like the knife rather than commenting on the knife itself at all. "Mall ninja?" What does that even mean? What knife might one admit to owning to be safe from such juvenile insults being hurled at them? Jeesh, you'd think, with the humongous variety of knives available to enjoy looking at pictures of, if you don't like the one being discussed and pictured in this thread that you'd just move on to one where you will get some enjoyment, instead of spewing your self-perceived knife-snobbery. While trying to make me look bad for owning, and more importantly, enjoying owning, the subject-knife, you simply accomplished making yourselves look petty and small-minded. What fun. We'll have to get together and do this again sometime, eh? :jerkit:

Blues
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Good luck finding a knife that won't prompt those kind of statements. It seems to be some folks idea of a good time to bash people with different tastes.

Don't go away; if you hang around a little, you'll find some folks with interests similar to yours and you can get an awful lot of good information on this forum.
 
Yeah, they don't tell you about that "depth gauge" line in their descriptions. I asked on a Boker forum what that was for and got that same answer. I thought that was a bit over the top. I'm not crazy about the chisel grind either, but I understand its' purpose. It's intended to make the edge stronger, which it probably does to some minor degree, but I'd still prefer a more common grind. Other than that though, like I said, it's a rock-solid knife. I like the aesthetics myself, but even if someone else doesn't (which obviously some don't), if that's the best (or worst) criticizm one can come up with, then I doubt Boker designers are losing much sleep over it.

I'd be curious to know why this particular knife would be more trouble to anyone in court than any other knife, assuming that the court-case was based on illegal use of any/either knife in the first place? The blade is about the same length (+/-) as a Buck 110 or a Kershaw Spec Bump. I would think that if a judge allowed a jury to consider how sinister one knife looks over another, and to base any part of a guilty verdict on nothing more than looks, the defendant would have great grounds for appeal. I'm no lawyer, but that just makes sense to me. 'Course, I am not under any illusions about our justice system making much sense these days!

If I'm not mistaken, Dark Ops became known as "Dork Ops" after the proprietors acted stupid at a Blade show, didn't they? I read somewhere that they wouldn't allow people to handle the product and were very disrespectful to some big names in the knife industry. If any/all of that is true, I don't really get the comparison between this knife and their products, at least not in the negative context this one is being compared to them with. Has Boker done anything to earn people's scorn? Other than just make a knife that *looks* different than all the others?

Blues

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Edit: Sorry guys, you edited/posted while I was replying.

No worries Shann, I ain't goin' nowhere just because of this thread. I just noticed it and mentioned it is all.

Did you buy this as a weapon?
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No, not in any way, shape, manner or form. In fact, the main reason I bought it was for the glass-breaker end. If I ever use the knife at all (meaning if I ever take it out of my glove-box for anything other than just handling/admiring it), it would either be to get me or my wife out of the car, or someone else trapped in another damaged car. Like I said, I am definitely not a knife-fighter, and that was just as true when I bought/traded/inherited the other 100+ knives I currently own as it is now that I own this one.

Did you order the video that Boker sells on how to use this knife?
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Nah, had absolutely no interest in it. I'm 51 years old, my feet are tore up from diabetes and I've had two major back surgeries. I ain't likely to be trying to learn how to fight in any way by now, much less learn how to knife-fight. Besides that, I have a concealed pistol permit and carry about 90% of the time. The knives I actually carry in my pockets are, well, pocket knives. The rest are just part of the same hobby you and everyone else enjoys.

Some of us (many) laugh at this kind of advertizing because it adds to the negative aspect of our hobby.
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Well then I'm right at home! I laughed at the description too when I first saw it on Boker's website. But I still like the design and I started looking to see what they were going for, and I bet better'n 80% of the internet dealers I found them on just copied and pasted the exact same text to describe what they were selling! So all, or most anyway, of the dealers we all do business with are doing a helluva lot more to promote the negative stereotypes of knife-owners than I am by posting a few pics deep in the bowels of an internet forum, dontcha think?

But why advertize a knife as a weapon? That is asking for problems.
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I don't know, it seems to me that Jim Wagner has a pretty impressive resume of training professionals how to use a knife as a weapon, and considering that his personal experience is what Boker asked him to base his design on (according to the above description), they are simply practicing truth in advertising. Is that so wrong? Not to me it isn't, the fact that their advertising had almost nothing to do with my decision to buy the knife notwithstanding.

Blues
 
Basically the Dork Ops thing spans from the descriptions in the advertisement of the knife. I see some similarities there and they are quite comical. Maybe it's just me, but I don't know. I have been carrying knives for quite a few years, and out of the last 11 years I have spent in the military have needed a field worthy knife for all sorts of situations. (not combat as I don't belive in bringing a knife to a gunfight). But that being said I see the marketing in this product and although it sounds cool don't really see the need for what it offers. The blade design doesn't hold too much utility in it, but the belly of the main bevel can probably cut nicely. Then there is the whole chisle grind thing. Not really worth all the trouble. Doesn't cut all that efficiently for utility. Again, really just a weapon thing. As far as the court thing goes. If a prosecuting lawyer looks up this knife on the internet, or in a catalog he would see the word "Weapon" thrown in there regularly. Then he would see the other terms used to describe it's penetrating ablilty and then there is the fact that a video is made on how to use the knife. That is what makes me question it. Like I said. I am not going to make fun of you for getting this knife. You like it and that is all that matters, but I will get into a debate about the knife itself and its real use to you. For the price you paid for that knife you could have gotten yourself a Delica 4 or a similar knife. The Delica and Endura were knives that were used in training for knife defense, at the Sigarms school of armed combat. They still may be, but SIG has thier own line of knives now. That isn't somthing that is advertized by Spyderco. It's more of a utility blade that has, what some will consider, weapons grade performance. A Delica won't be confused as a weapon upon inspection. Yes Spyderco makes trainer models, but that is the only thing that I know of that blatently says "weapons training". This isn't about Spyderco of course, but you see what I mean?
 
For in the car carry, it could have advantages.

The apparently chisel ground "tanto" front would make a dandy scraper.
The recurve should do well on seat-belts.
The window breaker - shatters windows.
 
I think the only thing that chaps my lips on this knife is the whole "Weapon" thing. I, like many don't view knives as weapons. They are tools. That and Jim Wagner may feel that these atributes are what a knife needs to be the perfect edged weapon, but as far as I know, he is not a knife maker/designer. He asked for a bunch of features and Boker threw them all together into this knife. I feel that some guys who are knife fighters by real experience and training, and knifemakers by trade (Larry Nowicki comes to mind), make a knife that has real world potential and they are maybe a tad bit more asthetically appealing. Again not bashing on your knife, but it looks kind of more thrown together feature wize. More R&D would have surely hiked up the price though.
 
I'm to the point now where the stated intended use for a knife is of no concern - I want to see how it does at a variety of uses and what it actually excells at.
 
Yeah I think I wanna see all that too. Hey Blues, you gonna give her a workout on some cardboard or something so we can see the edge retention?
 
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