Bug out backpacks!

[Codger_64]

This was my explanation of how a cache system works. I have used it successfully in the past when max mobility was top priority, direction of movement was a daily uncertainty due to "changing obsticles and priorities". Caches in that instance included "expendable items" not needed in a civilian E&E, or "bugout". Locations are as varied as the terrain and routes across the terrain can be imagined. If you are traveling up a mountainous drainage, they might be at the bases of certain rocks or other landmarks up side drainages, off the main route of travel. In open forrest, they may be located on a slight rise or ridge, but not on an recognizable trail, perhaps in the middle of a blackberry thicket. If a place says to you "ooh! This is a good place to hide something!", move on.

Sometimes one has no choice but to flee with only the clothes on one's back. No Bob, no 4wd, no 50# Alice pack full of whizzbangs. Am I using a cache system now? No. But would I say if I did? Hardly. Again, anything you can own can be used up, lost or taken from you. This includes you Bob, backpack, caches, etc.

 

[Gerald McDonald]

What are you bugging out from?

 

[ras]

My first BOB used a Maxpedition Condor and weighed in at ~15 pounds without water. Too much for a true BOB. So the pack stays in my truck as a gear storage device (it's a seriously well constructed pack). If I ever need to leave my truck and walk, I'll take the necessary gear from my truck in a Camelback Mule which also stays in the truck in a minimized state. For me to leave my truck and walk means the truck is TU and that moving is more important than staying. Moving means packing light. The Camelback carries much easier than the Condor.

If you haven't read it already, the overnighter mentioned by knifetester and Halcon in the Hatchet vs. Big ol' knife thread at post 176/177 started as a "let's go camping with what's in our pockets right now" challenge. Another thread in another forum detailed the trip. It went to stress the point that what you know is much more important than what you have.

 

[Tikirocker]

Are you actually doing this now or is this just for discussion? How many cache sites are you proposing? Where are you finding locations for these many caches arrayed "like spokes on a wheel"? This sounds like something that is great in theory but undoable in reality.

Personally I would never want to leave with little nothing and rely solely on the ability to reach distant supplies through unknown hazard. I can see and agree that having a cache or two strategically placed somewhere would be a real advantage but would never treat it as anything more than a bonus. In a real bug out situation there are just too many ways that plan could fail.

Well said that man and that is the exact same reasoning used by the folks in my part of the world too ... it just assumes too much. :thumbup:

 

[Halcon]

Blue sky and Tiki, sure any plan could fail. But then again I might have to ditch that ruck because I need to move out post haste.

having cache's are a great way to resup if you have to ditch gear. I assure you Not all my caches would be compromised. Let me put it to you this way I even have caches in another state.

Alan

I assure you Tiki if I was chasing you, you would not get away from me carrying that mother of a load.

 

[Tikirocker]

Delete double post.

 

[Tikirocker]

I assure you Tiki if I was chasing you, you would not get away from me carrying that mother of a load.

Tell that to the SAS Alan ... you take a lot for granted. You have to find me to catch me and those that want to might wish they didn't.

 

[GibsonFan]

Clearly there are many approaches to this question, and it's good to compare them.
Like others, I have different kits for different needs/durations. I think of it kind of like layering clothes... a belt with a canteen and a couple pouches... more involved web-gear for over-nighters... and a full-on ruck for a week or more. The biggest pack doesn't have much more actual gear, mostly clean socks, food, a heavy tarp for better shelter, a few batteries and so on. Food's the biggest concern for anything lasting more than a couple days. I'm sure a lot of us would be tightening our belts real quick!

I bet anyone here could get what they need to camp/hide out into a backpack, and be fairly comfortable once they were out of harm's way. The trick is getting there, and sustaining oneself there. The spot I'd prefer to get to is 2 or 3 days away on foot...

That's when I start thinking of caches along the way. I saw an article online where a guy used 5-gallon pails buried at intervals along his escape route; each one had a few bottles of water, some food or MRE's, book of matches, TP etc etc. Enough to get him to his next checkpoint.

I don't know if I'd ever go so far as to dot two counties, or states, with my caches But I don't think the idea should be dismissed out of hand, either.
The second thing I'd do after finding a suitable hiding spot would be to find another one for backup, and cache much of my stuff there for later.

 

[akennedy73]

In lieu of the great discussion in the Hatchet vs Big Knife thread - I thought I'd start a spin off which allows people to specifically discuss all aspects of their chosen pack in the case of totally bugging out.

* - Tell us what your chosen pack is.
* - Post any pics of it.
* - Why did you choose it?
* - Is weight vs comfort vs capacity an issue?
* - What do you propose to carry in it realistically?
* - What weapons if any do you plan to carry?

* - Tell us what your chosen pack is.

Gregory Shasta internal frame - 4950 cubic inches/a bit over 6 pounds empty

* - Post any pics of it.

They sell them on Campmor.com if anyone wants to check them out.

* - Why did you choose it?

Just as durable as any military backpack but weighs less.

* - Is weight vs comfort vs capacity an issue?

Absolutely. When I backpack I keep my load under 35 pounds including water. Tramping up and down thousands of feet of mountain terrain makes me prefer lighter loads.

* - What do you propose to carry in it realistically?

For a bug-out, everything I carry camping for a week-long trip minus the MSR stove and fuel. Additions of significant weight include snares, bow, and inline muzzleloader. If mechanized transport such as a bicycle, car or train are not available, the muzzleloader may be left behind.

* - What weapons if any do you plan to carry?

My brain. And the body attached to it. And any other deadly tools that are handy like big sticks. But usually I find using my feet to run in the opposite direction of trouble works really well.

 

[Coldwood]

I also would like to learn more about the strategy and logistics of wayside caches. Where do you hide them without the risk of somebody finding them? What kind of containers would you use? I can think of several, ranging from tupperware containers, to plastic storage boxes to large diameter PVC pipe. Thanks.

 

[pict]

My definition of a bug out bag...

"A BOB is a pack you assemble after watching too much CNN that you will repeatedly tear into every time you want to go camping"

I have a Bug out Shelf, currently. All my gear is piled ona large shelf in my closet and I can pick and choose from it according to the circumstances. From Asteroid strikes to Zombie attacks, I'm covered.

My wilderness survival pack is another story. I do keep it packed and modify the contents due to the season of the year. I do get out into the bush with this pack on a regular basis and it works for ME... where I AM.

Wilderness Pack

Shelter
Poncho, Bivy sack, tropical weight bag, ziggy pillow

Fire
Bic, firesteel, PJ treated cotton, candles

Water
US Army canteen, cup, stove sleeve, 3 two-liter Platypus bags, Home-made PVC pipe filter, Chlor-in 1 tablets, Potable Aqua Plus, 60 ml syringe & tube.

Navigation
Recta DP-2 compass, back up compass in PSK

Light
Surefire Z2 Combat light (cause I'm a slick low drag operator), Night Eyz LED, Inova PSK LED

Blades & Tools
BK-7 (This is my on the belt all the time PSK as well)
Tramontina Machete
Mora 2000
Folding saw

MISC
Epi-Pens, paracord

This is my basic wilderness kit. If I was truly going to Bug Out in a dangerous sort of way I would repack this stuff in a slightly larger pack and include:

Firearms and ammo
Motorola radios
Binoculars
FAK

Mac

 

[akennedy73]

Water
US Army canteen, cup, stove sleeve, 3 two-liter Platypus bags, Home-made PVC pipe filter, Chlor-in 1 tablets, Potable Aqua Plus, 60 ml syringe & tube.

I'm interested in hearing a description of your home-made PVC pipe filter including weight and how you utilize it. And what is the syringe/tube for?

Thanks in advance!

 

[pict]

The PVC filter is a simple flow filter to reduce the amount of stuff in the water. It consists of two 20 mm sections about 10 cm long, a pipe joint in the middle and a reducer on the end. The top section holds a ball of synthetic fish filter fluff. The bottom section is filled with activated charcoal. You just pour the raw water in the top and let it drain through into the canteen. It does not purify the water, it strains out the big stuff. I then treat with iodine or chlorine. Five years plus in the tropics and I'm still here.

The 60 ml syringe and tube is used to extract water at high altitudes from cracks in rocks, shallow seeps, bromeliads, puddles, water flowing under rock fields, down in ravines, etc. I don't leave home without it. Mac

 

[hatchetjack]

I use a med ALICE pack and one of those plastic tubs with the folding lid as I figure I'll be buggin' out in my Suburban.

I recently picked up some Maxpedition stuff and discovered Mil-Spec bags and have been very pleased with the performance.

I don't pack the entire homestead. Extra socks, FAK, calfskin gloves, some cash and a roll of quarters, food is mainly granola bars and sardines. I also pack a Surefire 6P , a large fixed blade either a Ranger or Becker, an ATC VTAC for chopping and wrecking. I carry a couple of gallons of water in the
plastic tub.

Weapons are some auto loading pistol and a folding stocked AK.

 

[GibsonFan]

I also would like to learn more about the strategy and logistics of wayside caches. Where do you hide them without the risk of somebody finding them? What kind of containers would you use? I can think of several, ranging from tupperware containers, to plastic storage boxes to large diameter PVC pipe. Thanks.

The two ways I've seen most often in articles are PVC pipe and 5-gallon buckets, both buried. Both are chosen because they can be sealed air-tight and don't rot. I don't think Tupperware-type stuff would hold up well underground, especially if it freezes. If you really wanted to store a lot in one place you could get a food-grade, plastic 55-gallon drum.

http://www.1stconnect.com/anozira/SiteTops/cache/caching.htm ... a good general article about caching.

http://www.alwaysbeprepared.com/site/558697/search/site?keys=bucket ... they sell prepackaged bucket kits. I haven't bought anything from them, just stole some ideas

http://www.savvysurvivor.com/supplycache.htm ...this is the article that really got me thinking about it.

 

[DFW_Dave]

My definition of a bug out bag...

I have a Bug out Shelf, currently. All my gear is piled ona large shelf in my closet and I can pick and choose from it according to the circumstances. From Asteroid strikes to Zombie attacks, I'm covered.

Mac,

I have just about the same inventory plus some, only I have 90% stored in the large Tupperware under-the-bed boxes and in the night stand. That way I know where most of my gear is and can grab what's needed, or just grab the whole damn thing and throw it in the car if need be. The only things I need to add are food and clothes everything else is taken care of.

Oh and for the thread I currently use a Kelty Redwing 3100. It's not perfect but it's good enough and great for travel (lots of pockets).

I can have what I need in seconds...

Dave

 

[Coldwood]

GibsonFan, thanks! I've got some reading to do tomorrow. Even though I don't plan to bug out, it occurs to me that I could be forced out by circumstances I can't yet foresee. Having some stash offsite might be useful then.

 

[Halcon]

Tell that to the SAS Alan ... you take a lot for granted. You have to find me to catch me and those that want to might wish they didn't.

you wouldn't be the first person to spew this nonsense. hahaha! I assure you the SAS are not holier than thou. No one is invincible. Apparently you know very little about me. No worries mate, perhaps it is better this way.

Alan

 

[mymindisamob]

For my family B.O.B. I use a large fiberglass toolbox, In the vehicles I use ammo cans and/or coffee canisters. As far as backpacks, I use a Maxpedition Monsoon Gearslinger and a Lowe-Alpine Bear Paw. I want to check out a Tad Gear Alpha Pack soon.
I keep a store of premade packs for firemaking, first-aid, water purification and hunting/fishing. These are ready to throw in a pack or container at any time.
As far as cacheing, it is an age old and proven method for distance and survival. Animals use it, many indigenous peoples have used it, many trappers use it, pony express used it and many people use it today in trekking. As with any system or supplies, there are plans to be made and there are possible failures. I learned a tremendous amount, mostly through failure, about cacheing firearms and foodstuff in PVC while training in the deep south. You might say, I failed my way to success.

As far as the chest thumping over escape and evasion, it's not the size of the load, it's how it's carried. That along with every similar analogy applies. If he, she, it has a pattern, he, she, it can be tracked.

 

[MORIMOTOM]

For my family B.O.B. I use a large fiberglass toolbox, In the vehicles I use ammo cans and/or coffee canisters. As far as backpacks, I use a Maxpedition Monsoon Gearslinger and a Lowe-Alpine Bear Paw. I want to check out a Tad Gear Alpha Pack soon.
I keep a store of premade packs for firemaking, first-aid, water purification and hunting/fishing. These are ready to throw in a pack or container at any time.
As far as cacheing, it is an age old and proven method for distance and survival. Animals use it, many indigenous peoples have used it, many trappers use it, pony express used it and many people use it today in trekking. As with any system or supplies, there are plans to be made and there are possible failures. I learned a tremendous amount, mostly through failure, about cacheing firearms and foodstuff in PVC while training in the deep south. You might say, I failed my way to success.

As far as the chest thumping over escape and evasion, it's not the size of the load, it's how it's carried. That along with every similar analogy applies. If he, she, it has a pattern, he, she, it can be tracked.

dont really have a bug out bag, but saw you are interested in the alpha pack. i got one a couple months ago. much larger than i expected, so i dont carry it often, but when i do can put alot inside. i find the exterior pockets oddly placed, and i would prefer more zippered pockets like my bfm. also, it doesnt come with lanyards (or strap type things) on the zippers, so i attached my own having been used to camelbaks.

overall, a nice pack, good quality and durable.