bushcraft edge grind question

SDS

SDS

Joined
Oct 22, 2007
Messages
1,389
First let me admit my lack of knowledge in the area of a "bushcraft knife". I spend a little time in the outdoors. Not as much as I'd like, but I'm not a greenhorn either.

My question is this. Why do so many people prefer the shallow grind on a bushcraft knife? Is it so the blade is stronger for chopping/splitting wood or is there another reason I'm just missing?

I'm not trying to be sarcastic or anything, I'm just really curious. I have used high carbon. flat ground blades a lot for splitting wood and that has worked well for me. It seems that for most camp chores the steep grind angles on some of these blades would be tough to work with.

Thanks ahead of time for any answers.
 
If you are referring to the Scandi grind, it is partially traditional. The scandi grind is very nice and to me, it makes the blade act sort of like a plane. I love my SWC scandi as it carves and shaves effortlessly. That being said, many people (me included) prefer a full-convex grind. If you don't sharpen a scandi correctly, it will end up being convexed in the process anyway. The convex edge is very easy to sharpen in the field and even when not scary sharp, it still cuts very exceptionally well.

Just my .02 cents.
 
That makes sense I guess. I can see how a convex grind would be easier to use long term in the field. I guess that scandi-grind just kind of had me stumped. They look like they would be easier to grind.

Thanks for the answer.
 
Both are not difficult to maintain. The scandi requires you to take material off the full length of the edge. If you take off that shoulder, you start to make it more of a convex grind than scandi. I like them both and I think you'll find one you will like if you get a chance to try them both. If you are ever in my neck of the woods, feel free to call me up. I'll bring plenty of toys you can play with.

Kev
 
The Moras use a Scandi grind without having to resharpen by grinding the whole edge bevel because you can put a small secondary bevel on them too. Putting a short convex secondary bevel sort of gets the best of both methods.
 
Esav brings up a great point I neglected to mention. Thank you for another awesome point brotha.
 
the edge is not that thick. the scandi blades are usually of thin stock - 1/16" or 1/8" only. It's no different from a sabre grind, but it doesn't (but can) usually have a secondary bevel. is a full flat grind better? yes...but at 1/16", a full flat grind can be substantially weaker.

is it coincidental that a lot of traditional blades don't have secondary bevels? I think it's just that secondary bevels require a bit more precision when honing / sharpening the edge, and in the field, you just don't have that kind of luxury. look at jungle parangs - they're all zero ground as well.
 
Like some folks have already said the scandi grind usually doesn't result in a really steep angle unless the blade is fairly thick.

Scandi, Flat, Convex, I like 'em all as long is the grind is not really steep:thumbup:
 
I guess I hadn't taken into consideration the thickness of the blade. I haven't actually handled these knives and sometimes I have a hard time getting a real feel for a knife from a picture. I guess I was inadvertantly basing my opinions on pictures without actually handling the knives.

Thanks again for the clarifications.

K-estela, be careful what you offer......you never know who might end up on your doorstep.
 
SDS said:
I guess I hadn't taken into consideration the thickness of the blade. I haven't actually handled these knives and sometimes I have a hard time getting a real feel for a knife from a picture. I guess I was inadvertantly basing my opinions on pictures without actually handling the knives.

Thanks again for the clarifications.

K-estela, be careful what you offer......you never know who might end up on your doorstep.
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SDS,

I have a 4mm bushcraft knife with a scandi edge and I think the edge is somewhat steep on it. On the other hand I have a 4mm from the same maker (SWC) with a longer bevel and it has a very fine edge. Also the Skookum is 1/8" with a bevel of a similar length to the 4mm model and it has a much finer edge. Assuming the length of the scandi edge is the same the thinner blade the finer edge is the one I'd go for:thumbup:
 
SDS,

I have no trouble with letting people try my gear. If you don't give it back, or if you give it back in wrecked condition, that is when we will have words. Besides, I'm usually never too far away when I lend someone a knife. Forceful habit I guess.

I'm serious though about letting people try my gear. Anyone on the forum is welcome to come on the outtings I post.

kev
 
hollowdweller, it sounds like I'm just going to have to actually get my hands on some of these to fully understand what everyone is talking about. In my mind I think I understand what is being described, but I'm kind of a visual person. I sure appreciate the descriptions and I hope you guys don't mind a newbie poking around in here.

k-estela, you must be one heckuva nice guy if you only have WORDS with someone who wrecks your gear. Wish you were closer, I'd get a kick out of putting some faces with the names on here. Unfortunately I don't get back east very often and your a long ways from Oklahoma.
 
Generally I prefer convex or a good flat grind, depending on the job in hand.
 
spyken said:
is a full flat grind better? yes...but at 1/16", a full flat grind can be substantially weaker.
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Have to be careful with these things, guys. Better for what? For chopping? Or for carving wood? For chopping, yes, a full flat grind beats a scandi grind any day of the week, two times. For wood carving? No, a full flat grind won't match a scandi grind ever, assuming the knives are anywhere near of similar size, thickness and quality.

The scandi grind is not intended for splitting wood or for chopping or batoning. It's primary advantages are ease of sharpening and extreme precision in wood working. These are the things it was made for.

To answer the original poster's question, there are mainly two reasons why some prefer the scandi grind: 1) tradition, since these grinds are the traditional grind of choice in Scandinavian knives, and have been for many, many years, and 2) precision and effectiveness in wood working. If you need a knife mostly to chop and split and baton, then the scandi grind is not the wisest choice for you. If you need a knife to build tools with, to carve wood with, and in general mostly for tasks that do not involve beating on the knife, then a scandi grind may well be the best choice.
 
Wouldn't a full flat grinds wood cutting ability be just as dependant on the thickness of the blade and the spine to edge length as a scandi is dependent on the thickness and length of the bevel?

I've fooled with some full flat grinds that were as fine edged as any scandi. In fact maybe more since the tapering starts at the spine and winds up at the edge. I'm talking a full flat grind with no secondary.
 
depends on the geometry. If the primary grind is 7 degrees, and the edge bevel is 15-20, you have a 8-13 degree difference to play with between having the blade lie flat on the piece or having the edge bite into the wood to actually cut. With the scandi, laying the bevel on the wood should put the very edge in contact and allow you to cut.

I do not care for scandis for general utility, mostly because of the metal to be wasted when sharpening, but I see what Elen is saying.
 
Convex is my prefference, I am always surprised by the cutting ability of fairly thick knives that are paired with such an edge (i.e. Fallkniven F1) and the thinner the blade stock the meaner. :D
 
hollowdweller said:
Wouldn't a full flat grinds wood cutting ability be just as dependant on the thickness of the blade and the spine to edge length as a scandi is dependent on the thickness and length of the bevel?

I've fooled with some full flat grinds that were as fine edged as any scandi. In fact maybe more since the tapering starts at the spine and winds up at the edge. I'm talking a full flat grind with no secondary.
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A full flat grind with no secondary bevel is... well, I don't know what it is. It's certainly not the traditional full flat grind, though. Unless I'm very seriously mistaken, the traditional flat grind has a primary bevel and a secondary bevel.

Remember: a true scandi grind does not have a secondary bevel at all. This means that the edge is very, very fine. And for carving into wood, it works particularly great, because there is no small but annoying secondary bevel to "break up" the wood. Instead, the knife just pushes cleanly into the wood along the the full length of the primary bevel - the only bevel on the knife. This way, the knife produces very fine curls, if desired.

The scandi grind is perfect for working wood. Its weaknesses are the relatively large amount of metal removed in sharpening, and the thinness of the cutting edge which makes it not so good at taking impacts and lateral pressure.
 
I personally prefer full convex over scandi type grinds. Even better for wood working since you can use the radiused sides for pressure, to curl the edge back out of the wood again. Much smoother than the shoulder where two flat bevels meet. And it has the same zero edge as the scandi so you can really lay the blade nearly flat on the wood for fine whittling.
 
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