canadians, and aussies, and whoever else can't have guns

[zebo]

For me a gun is not a part of hiking / camping equipment, so it's kinda hard to say what I carry instead of it.

Maybe I've seen too many films but I believe some kind of ballistic apparatus should be a normal part of any outdoor equipment. If it's just for recreation as plinking or target shooting out in the woods.

Well I for one think we over blow the "security in the woods" topic on this forum.

I don't think so. At least here in Germany we have a security problem in the outdoors, not a big one but also no bagatelle. During the 1990's there were many gangs of Romanian thieves camping in the woods, and during the last years some hunters were killed, probably by robbers and militant animal activists. Not to talk about minor problems as aggressive dogs and dogfights, drunken teenager hords or criminals storing their loot.

I have made two negative experiences myself. At the first I encountered a wood thief, at the second I was attacked by a dog whose owner rescued me just in the last seconds (I had my knife already in position).

These problems accure because there is no real wilderness here in Central Europe. Nearly all woods are part of the man-made 'cultural landscape' and are easy to reach with lots of roads and trails. (The only exceptions are the national parks - where BTW all forms of camping are strictly prohibited - and some mountain areas.) So it's not difficult for 'problematic people' to go to the woods and fields. I quite often meet ordinary people - dog walkers, riders, and nordic walkers - on my hikes, even at places I wouldn't expect it. And I always try to go to the more remote areas because I want to be alone or with my partner.

 

[DocArnie]

I'm in the blackforest at the moment (yay, finally got internet!) and I've spent many hours in the woods during the last days, hiking or collecting mushrooms.
The only things on me were my Suunto Vector (= watch, barometer, altimeter and compass in one), a Mora or pocket knife (Otter or SAK Spartan/Farmer), a lighter and a book about mushrooms, plants and animals in a rucksack when I had it with me (plus a rain jacket).
Haven't carried my pepperspray since I left it at a friends house months ago - and I haven't really missed it, though I think peppersprays are generally a good idea.

Can't believe how many mushrooms I found today. I'd have to pay a fortune in a restaurant...

 

[collecter]

I must admit that the encounters did get me thinking about getting my FAL and purchasing a long gun (maybe a 45.70) for REAL close encounters.

In addition to the fal you would probably need to have a hunting license in order to be legal with a rifle in the woods. Check the regulations for your provice.

If you never owned a rifle before the 45-70 could be intimidating. A 30-30 would be milder recoiling and still plenty powerfull for stopping a black bear. I use the 30-30 on moose at distances up to about 100 yards. A 12ga with slug thru 000 buck shot is also very relaible bear stopper and a 12 ga pump such as an 870 is less expensive that a even a Marlin 30-30.

Here in the USA, most people I know carry a gun in the woods more because there is a healthy gun culture than a real need. I like the rights Americans have with respect to guns and I wish Canada had similar rights for it's citizens.

It's very comforting to have a handgun with your in the woods. I've become used to it and I like having one. Even if I'm hunting with a high power rifle or 12 ga I still carry +P 38 sp Airweight...I love that little gun. When I go back to Canada for a visit I get to carry a whistle...makes me sad.

 

[numberthree]

Forgive me for being nosey, but i am just curious to see your HIKING combo. This is only for places that don't allow guns (let's not hijack the thread with guntalk) . If you are from a place that allows firearms and travel to places that don't , let's see yours . It has been years since i traveled out of the u.s . but i will post what i would carry , later today

You can have guns in Canada.

I usually carry a carbine length rifle or a shotgun if I'm in bad animal country, but for regular outings I carry an M6 Scout....

If I don't feel like carrying a gun, it's usually a tomahawk or a Cold Steel Barong Machete...

 

[DOC-CANADA]

When I go back to Canada for a visit I get to carry a whistle...makes me sad.

What calibre?

Doc

 

[attej]

Maybe I've seen too many films but I believe some kind of ballistic apparatus should be a normal part of any outdoor equipment. If it's just for recreation as plinking or target shooting out in the woods.

Why? I stated that "For me a gun is not a part of hiking / camping equipment", pointing out that if anyone else thinks it's necessary, by all means carry one. But since I can't think of a reason why I should, why should I consider it a normal part of my equipment?

And about "healthy gun culture"... IMHO, a lot of people seem to carry a gun just because they are afraid. Many rightly so, and some simply out of irrational fear of everything.

 

[These_Nutz]

The law is very clear. The implementation of it may not be, remember A.C.A.B, but the law is.

“You cant carry any fixed or locking knife ive been charged before for carrying a silly 2.5 in knife just because it locked it was also on a keyring.”

The size of the knife, and the fact it was on a keyring, makes no difference if you did not clearly satisfy one of the rules I mentioned above. The reason for that being – I locked. It could have a blade only and inch long, if it locks and you get got by the metal detector on the underground or something, game over. The key to it all is satisfying those conditions not arguing what should or should not be legal. I'm certain that is central to how you got to be prosecuted.

I had it in my car when asked why i had it i said i was using it for fishing my lawyer said this in court also.
That didnt wash the fact it locked was all they cared about and i got charged and got CS could have got the jail.
A guy i know got caught the month before that with a stanley in his pocket he said it was for cutting his mums carpet up nobodys that stupid to say its for self defence etc we can all think of a good reason to have a small knife..He got one month for that.
If i get caught again i will get jailed and can get up to 4 years most people around hear have been getting about 6 months recently though unless they have a lot of previous.
Its a joke there is a couple of murders in London and suddenly theres a knife epedemic in the UK.London has a low murder rate compared to most UK citys its knife crime is nothing compared to what goes on around hear up in Glasgow and a lot of UK citys like Liverpool,Manchester,Birmingham etc.
Yet no one carred at the fact my citys murder rate was 3 times Londons per head of population for the past decade.

 

[tabeeb762]

Why? I stated that "For me a gun is not a part of hiking / camping equipment", pointing out that if anyone else thinks it's necessary, by all means carry one. But since I can't think of a reason why I should, why should I consider it a normal part of my equipment?

And about "healthy gun culture"... IMHO, a lot of people seem to carry a gun just because they are afraid. Many rightly so, and some simply out of irrational fear of everything.

Same for me. I only carry when hunting.

Quite to the contrary. People who have irrational fears are the same kind of people that are afraid of guns and knives.

 

[attej]

Quite to the contrary. People who have irrational fears are the same kind of people that are afraid of guns and knives.

Actually, it's both. You can carry a gun because your afraid of the world, or you can be afraid to carry one, because you are afraid of guns. Im certain that both cases exist.

Edit: Just to clarify; most gun owners cannot of course be fit in these two categories.

I personally dont carry a gun, but Im certainly not afraid of them. Kinda like them actually. I always felt that shooting with live ammo was the most entertaining part of the army, and I got my hunting licence when I was 14. But, I think this thread is not about hunting or shooting for fun.

 

[fujita yuji]

As far as I am concerned, most powerful tool as a weapon may be my ice axes.
Crampon can come close to them . Anyway, most bears go asleep at the time
when these tools are in use. Without no doubt, weather, snow, falling rocks are
far more serious than other kind of risks in my field.

 

[zebo]

Why? I stated that "For me a gun is not a part of hiking / camping equipment", pointing out that if anyone else thinks it's necessary, by all means carry one. But since I can't think of a reason why I should, why should I consider it a normal part of my equipment?

I also stated only my opinion. And I did it in an (self-) ironic way.

About your second sentence: This will be an endless discussion. What equipment does someone really nead? Are there good reasons for all the gadgets we are carrying? I think no. Many people don't even have a knife when they are outdoors, and until now they have somehow survived. IMO the only limiting factor is the weight of our gear. How much can and will we carry, be it essential stuff or just for fun.

 

[Myal]

I also stated only my opinion. And I did it in an (self-) ironic way.

About your second sentence: This will be an endless discussion. What equipment does someone really nead? Are there good reasons for all the gadgets we are carrying? I think no. Many people don't even have a knife when they are outdoors, and until now they have somehow survived. IMO the only limiting factor is the weight of our gear. How much can and will we carry, be it essential stuff or just for fun.

i think it can depend a lot on where you are , and what you consider outdoors ... much of my gear is not used when I am within a hundred km or so of a town , but when you get out into the open spaces like this ....

it gets to be a whole new ballgame , there is no going home to grab whatever or waiting till we get to the next shop / service station ... you are all there is to support you , end of story .

a lot of the gadgets I carry , around town have no real use , the hot plate for over the fire , the knives , the compound bow , the tents swags and tarps ... they are pretty useless and stay packed in the car , the little gadgets in my pocket , the knife , lighter , army surplus can opener , led light they even are not often used in town , but when we camp out either in a car or on foot , they get used daily ...

because we travel a bit , couple weeks ago we clocked up around 9000km visiting my brother , next week we are clocking up another 5000km to visit friends up north , and this is small trips , comparatively anyway , the gear we carry gets used and is carried because it makes our life easier to have it than not . to me that is good reason

 

[tholiver]

Nice pic!
:thumbup:
Makes me want to watch my Bushtuckerman episodes again!

 

[DOC-CANADA]

Damn, I like those Bushtuckerman videos.

Doc

 

[collecter]

What calibre?

Doc

What caliber whistle...you are funny!

I like my Acme Thunderer in large caliber.

 

[collecter]

Same for me. I only carry when hunting.

Quite to the contrary. People who have irrational fears are the same kind of people that are afraid of guns and knives.

I think fear drives people on boths sides of the argument. Even this thread is based on fear...what do you carry for protection because you can't carry a handgun?

most people I know here in the US carry more gun than I would want to carry. Be it a hunting rifle or a self defense handgun. I carried a variety of different handguns on my hip and I have to say, less is more if you get my drift. The only handgun I'm happy to carry is a S&W Airweight and that's mostly because I like guns too much NOT to carry one. I feel that anything heavier is a burden.

 

[Davyd]

As another Ozzie I'll come from our point of view. It brings up some interesting points for us when looking at North American forums.

Guns for defense are not allowed, guns ownership is frowned upon, though obviously less so in farming areas. There are farmers now who do not have any guns... they get people like me to keep the ferals down while they sit inside in front of a warm fire

People used to carry pocket knives like the Schrade or Case Stockmen but due to some incidents of inner city youths around nightclubs, or druggies doing robberies ....

Carrying a knife is now illegal unless you have a "legitimate use" - so tradies openly wear multitools, and in the country a folding/multitool sheath on the belt would usually not get a second look. However in the city a guy who looked like a druggy in a rough neghbourhood carrying a SAK had a very bad time - the courts forgave him, as it turned out he was sick going to chemotherapy and needed the SAK to open his car doors. I suspect he was pretty unlucky. Generally, I suspect, police use discretion - unfortunately he ticked the wrong boxes, in the wrong place, at the wrong time and things escalated before logic came in

It is very different from North Amercian as the bush and the safety aspects are entrirely different.
- Safety from animals other than the ones that slither is a non issue expect in very rare circumstances (grumpy buffalo in the northern territory or a irritatable oversexed roo - in both cases a knife would not be of any real use)-- Safety from people outside urban areas - especially in the real bush again a non issue except in very rare circumstances.
-There is generally so much deadfall timber around that building a campfire does not need chopping

So knives are generally for utility.

- Most houses would have a SAK or something similar around somewhere, and take that backpacking or camping -often for the corks screw as much as anything else. Pretty much everyone who goes backapacking to europe, asia South America etc takes a small SAK. Most foreign backpackers here have a SAK
- Hunters carry knives depending on the animal - schrade old timers for rabbits through to fixed blades for deer hunters with the occasional folder - I expect largely what you see hunters carrying in the US buck gerber gator fallkniven .... - they alos tend to be the people who like knives so ...
- In the tropical North bolo style machetes are more commonly around particularly I gather in the aboringinal communities as tools - and for getting through thicker brush
-real bushmen on the vast properties can do what they like and would generally have some knife and or multitool handy
- I have bushwalked extensively in well used and remote areas and generally only carried a SAK and/or a Gerber Bolt folder - I will now probably carry a benchmade griptilian - mini or standard. Openly carrying a large knife or similar would attract concerned looks as it is not seen as necessary - and people would wonder why someone was carring useless weight. Weight is always the enemy

If I really had to survive in the bush for some time I would probably do a trio like talked on many forums her - probably with a machete because of its versatility. Even though I am not comfortable with them - I think the scar on my leg has largely disappeared now

For car camping an axe/hatchet is usually around for when having fun fires that satisfy entertainment, rather than purely cooking needs - and more and larger wood is needed. They are seen as a tool and most people who have been out of the city have used one

Most people travelling in Australia by car or hiking in the bush would not carry any weapons - or at most, may have a maglite handy, and probably have a spade and an axe in the camp kit in the back if going off sealed roads extensively

 

[attej]

As another Ozzie I'll come from our point of view. It brings up some interesting points for us when looking at North American forums...

Kinda funny that up here in the north we have almost identical requirements (and laws ) for outdoors knives, guns etc... I mean, considering that Finland is located almost directly on the opposite side of the earth

Well, sure the differences would come up if we would be discussing about clothing etc, but it's anyway pretty intresting that 99% of what you said fits to our environment and society also

 

[DocArnie]

How things change over time... I have an older book about offroad tours through the australian outback - and it recommends taking a firearm with you.
But since australian politicians seem to like the idea of copying the british, australia is a much safer place now... or is it?

 

[attej]

How things change over time... I have an older book about offroad tours through the australian outback - and it recommends taking a firearm with you.
But since australian politicians seem to like the idea of copying the british, australia is a much safer place now... or is it?

A few decades ago it would have been a good idea to carry one in here also. The goverment actually used to pay a reward e.g. for killing a wolverine and so on. Now its on the endangered species list. Aren't many wolves or bears left either.