Canvas Micarta

L

Laredian

Joined
May 27, 2013
Messages
199
Hello,

I need some help with Canvas Micarta. I made a small EDC-scalpel design for myself, because I wanted to try out black Canvas Micarta for the handle scales. I have never used this particular material before.
The knife is made from 100Cr6. It is 14,5cm long overall and the blade is about 4cm long. The blade was hand sanded to a 800grit satin finish and then etched in ferric chloride. Scaled are black canvas micarta with bronze pins:

(Pictures are complete crap, sorry. Also the weird spots on the ricasso in the second pic are just oil)
hyYXD3.jpg


n2dtF8.jpg


806572.jpg


EFdnyD.jpg


OU5Z0E.jpg


mxAABz.jpg


RemlGX.jpg


The knife turned out ok. It works well for what I designed it, I just hate the handle material. I think the black Canvas Micarta looks awful. The canvas fibers look rough and it was really difficult to get a somewhat decent finish on it. I hand sanded it to 800grit, oiled it up and then sanded it with some fine steel wool. (I do not own a buffer)

My question is: did I not finish the Micarta correctly for it to look better? Also the canvas micarta on my knife looks very different to other knives I have seen that use this material for handle scales. Are there different types of canvas micarta? Because based on the experience I had with this knife, the micarta I have just looks crappy.
 
It does look a bit strange. Not like the micarta I've used. But I have seen some inconsistencies in micarta period. So I no longer use it. I always opt for G10 instead.

Great looking little blade though.
 
First question is where the "Micarta" came from? Real Micarta is the cloth and phenolic resin. The stuff I use looks different that the wide mesh of your handle.
I like canvas Micarta for larger handles. It doesn't finish as a real smooth shiny surface.

Try Linen Micarta for a smoother finish, and paper Micarta for a glass smooth finish.
 
There are a few different types of black canvas with some finishing to be almost black/white if not oiled. Double black is very nice if you want a pure black... both the resin and fabric are black.

Very nice work on the knife! The micarta looks like it undercut or maybe the steel wool pulled out some resin. I have never seen any do it to that extent. I do know I am very light handed and only do one pass with scotchbrite or a buffer.

You can finish micarta a lot of different ways. Check out Loveless knives to see micarta finished to a very high level. I prefer to take my perimeters to a clean 600 then and flats either ground clean then blasted to reveal texture or finished anywhere from 24-400 grit for the right finish and texture. I want the knife to be have a nice clean finish then add the texture. My latest group was finished with a 24 grit belt on the scales and looks like I blasted them deeply with no scratches... the same group of knives had black micarta which I had to hand sand to 400 grit to get it to look good, at 24 grit it looked heinous!

32756169_619906091681638_3277437888005931008_n.jpg
 
Thank you for the comments.

The micarta came from a knife making supply in germany. I have never had any problems with this supplier, though I have never bought micarta from them up to this point. Also I checked multiple times, the handle material I bought was definitely listed as "black canvas micarta".

I tried to get my hands on linen micarta or paper micarta because those would have been my first choices, but it is actually not that easy to get your hands on linen/paper micarta where I am from unfortunately and ordering from the US is only worth it in large quantities because of shipping and customs...
 
Daniel Fairly Knives said:
There are a few different types of black canvas with some finishing to be almost black/white if not oiled. Double black is very nice if you want a pure black... both the resin and fabric are black.

Very nice work on the knife! The micarta looks like it undercut or maybe the steel wool pulled out some resin. I have never seen any do it to that extent. I do know I am very light handed and only do one pass with scotchbrite or a buffer.

You can finish micarta a lot of different ways. Check out Loveless knives to see micarta finished to a very high level. I prefer to take my perimeters to a clean 600 then and flats either ground clean then blasted to reveal texture or finished anywhere from 24-400 grit for the right finish and texture. I want the knife to be have a nice clean finish then add the texture. My latest group was finished with a 24 grit belt on the scales and looks like I blasted them deeply with no scratches... the same group of knives had black micarta which I had to hand sand to 400 grit to get it to look good, at 24 grit it looked heinous!

View attachment 908780
Click to expand...

Thank you for your comment. The gaps you have refered to have been there before I used the steel wool. And as I said it I used a very fine steel wool, I doubt that that was the issue in this case. The knives in your picture look very nice by the way. I like the texture on the handles very much.
Just to clarify the scales had this weird coarse uneven texture already when I was grinding it on my belt grinder with 80grit. I just thought that was just because I was working it at a coarse grit.

Edit: I do not know if it is relevant in this case and I do not know if that is an issue with micarta, but when I was shaping the handle on my grinder I made sure nothing got too hot.
 
Last edited:
Daniel Fairly Knives said:
There are a few different types of black canvas with some finishing to be almost black/white if not oiled. Double black is very nice if you want a pure black... both the resin and fabric are black.

Very nice work on the knife! The micarta looks like it undercut or maybe the steel wool pulled out some resin. I have never seen any do it to that extent. I do know I am very light handed and only do one pass with scotchbrite or a buffer.

You can finish micarta a lot of different ways. Check out Loveless knives to see micarta finished to a very high level. I prefer to take my perimeters to a clean 600 then and flats either ground clean then blasted to reveal texture or finished anywhere from 24-400 grit for the right finish and texture. I want the knife to be have a nice clean finish then add the texture. My latest group was finished with a 24 grit belt on the scales and looks like I blasted them deeply with no scratches... the same group of knives had black micarta which I had to hand sand to 400 grit to get it to look good, at 24 grit it looked heinous!

View attachment 908780
Click to expand...
I didn't know that about being different type of black micartas... where do you recommend getting double black canvas from?
 
I find it interesting that after all these years some knifemakers still use micarta as a generic term for composite material used in thermosetting plastics. Micarta is a brand name not the material itself you all must know this. It is too generic and doesn't cover other known TP or phenolic composites that are used like fiberglass or carbon that for no reason get categorized differently. Some say that carbon composite isn't micarta, that is not true micarta makes many composites and carbon too. Let's move away from the generic term micarta please. Just my thoughts.
 
I will keep that in mind every time I use a Cresent wrench, Channel lock or ViseGrip to adjust my grinder or pry hubcaps off my car.
dirtvictim said:
I find it interesting that after all these years some knifemakers still use micarta as a generic term for composite material used in thermosetting plastics. Micarta is a brand name not the material itself you all must know this. It is too generic and doesn't cover other known TP or phenolic composites that are used like fiberglass or carbon that for no reason get categorized differently. Some say that carbon composite isn't micarta, that is not true micarta makes many composites and carbon too. Let's move away from the generic term micarta please. Just my thoughts.
Click to expand...
 
what i don't like is the homemade stuff being represented as micarta. it aint the same, don't work the same or look the same, not as hard, dense or durable.
 
I really like that knife. The handle looks great. But the fine hairs would probably bug me a little. It'll just give you the opportunity to try some different finishes on it.

I have no idea of the material brand, but here is a little Candiru scale that I tweaked a bit. And I really like how it came out. The whole thing was sanded out to around 400-800, don't remember when I stopped exactly on the sides. Then the flats were taken to 2000 (the highest I have in flat wet/dry paper), until near glass. Then spent a little time with foam backed 3000 & 5000. Even though it didn't make a huge difference from how it looked at that point, I did tap it on a buffing wheel for a few. Just recently picked up a buffing wheel, and have found it to be my most used tool and so worth that $30-$40 they cost at Harbor.

I don't have my own before pic, but this one at Esee shows how it looked when I got it. They spec it as just Canvas Micarta but don't mention the color on their site. I think it had a touch of green in it. But the darkening happened at two different times. Most of it was from my sandpaper. I may have been able to get it a little brighter if I had tried, but I liked it dark. Then I rubbed a little Fiebing's leather cream on it for a little extra shine. This darkened the sides the rest of the way.

5djcb7.jpg


15n6sew.jpg


246l5b5.jpg


6z3bdg.jpg
 
Lieblad said:
I will keep that in mind every time I use a Cresent wrench, Channel lock or ViseGrip to adjust my grinder or pry hubcaps off my car.
Click to expand...
How does this help knifemakers in their effort to maintain a level of professionalism, it doesn't. It's lazy and unprofessional to apply a brand name term to include so many different materials when a true definition already exists for each, thermosetting plastic or phenolic resin are the most common. Poor analogies do nothing to support true professionalism.
 
dirtvictim said:
How does this help knifemakers in their effort to maintain a level of professionalism, it doesn't. It's lazy and unprofessional to apply a brand name term to include so many different materials when a true definition already exists for each, thermosetting plastic or phenolic resin are the most common. Poor analogies do nothing to support true professionalism.
Click to expand...
I am sorry but I do not understand the points you have made. I bought the handle material from a knife making supply and in their shop it was described as canvas micarta, so that is what I called it. Also as far as I can tell that term is used by every supplier for phenolic resin that has layers of linen or canvas in it. Also customers know what you mean when you tell them this handle is made from micarta.

Also I think how one describes a particular handle material is in my opinion by far the most insignificant measure of a knifemakers professionalism.
 
Last edited:
Laredian said:
I am sorry but I do not understand the points you have made. I bought the handle material from a knife making supply and in their shop it was described as canvas micarta, so that is what I called it. Also as far as I can tell that term is used by every supplier for phenolic resin that has layers of linen or canvas in it. Also customers know what you mean when you tell them this handle is made from micarta.

Also I think how one describes a particular handle material is in my opinion by far the most insignificant measure of a knifemakers professionalism.
Click to expand...
Every measure of professionalism matters. Riding on the coat tails of another brand is unprofessional. Makers and even users have gotten lazy over the years for the sake of convenience and more so for name recognition.
Since micarta is a brand I can just go around saying every product they make is micarta even if someone makes it homemade they call it micarta, that is why it's important not to use the name when describing the products.
Think about it I could say pine cone micarta, titanium wire micarta, g10 micarta, Carbon micarta etc, anything that is held in a phenolic resin can be called micarta. It's comes down to doing the right thing and that is what separates professionals from the rest. The industry will do what they want, hopefully it's the right thing but doubtful.
 
Final thought here. Go to norplex-micarta and read their product descriptions. A true professional would emulate their descriptions in whatever work they apply it to.
 
dirtvictim said:
Every measure of professionalism matters. Riding on the coat tails of another brand is unprofessional. Makers and even users have gotten lazy over the years for the sake of convenience and more so for name recognition.
Since micarta is a brand I can just go around saying every product they make is micarta even if someone makes it homemade they call it micarta, that is why it's important not to use the name when describing the products.
Think about it I could say pine cone micarta, titanium wire micarta, g10 micarta, Carbon micarta etc, anything that is held in a phenolic resin can be called micarta. It's comes down to doing the right thing and that is what separates professionals from the rest. The industry will do what they want, hopefully it's the right thing but doubtful.
Click to expand...

I think i get your point in general, but still...in practical terms, even though the definition might not be as accurate or precise as you'd like, micarta is used by makers and suppliers to describe a specific material that has to have certain characteristics....otherwise people won't buy it. It's the reason I will never buy micarta again from the supplier I got the micarta for the knife I posted above.

My point is that, many people have seen the beautiful sculpted micarta handles that for example nick wheeler has made for some of his knives in his famous wheeler/paranee project. Or look at old Bob Loveless knives that have handles that are described as micarta (linen or canvas).
If I now have a collector that wants a knife with a micarta handle and I present him with something that does not remotely resemble (for the most part...in general structure and looks) the handles that famous and established makers have made in the past, he won't be satisfied with it.

Also I have never seen anyone, maker or supplier, call G10 or Carbon Fiber as Micarta. Again those are all materials that have been used by great makers and are therefore very much distinguishable from each other simply by how they look.

On the matter of professionalism I think that we just have to agree to disagree.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top