Carbon Steel Hydrogen Peroxide Bluing

J

John Andrews

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Jan 24, 2003
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Recently I placed an old EDC carbon steel knife in a plastic container with about a half inch of hydrogen peroxide covering it. The purpose was to clean it up. The knife was crudded up with fish remains. Yep, I forgot about the knife for a few weeks. Today I opened the container and the knife looked like a lump of rust. I then decided, what the heck, I might as well clean it up and see what's left. ZOW! underneath all the crud was a blued steel knife! It really cleaned up good, and the bluing seems tough as the devil, more like it is penetrated into the steel. I scrubbed the old knife with a Brillo pad, but the bluing is still there.Also, the unknown epoxy I used to put antler scales on loosened. The scales were attatched to brass and the epoxy turned to gunk. Also noted was that the antler scales took on streaks of blue and green, now giving the scales an acient ivory look.The scales were originally pure white, made from antler tip. The whole chemical reaction that caused all the coloring must have been initiated by the brass, steel,and the copper bolsters that were plated with chrome, I assume.Noted also was the fact most of the plating is removed from the bolsters during the process. Throw an old EDC in a plastic container with the hp and see what you come up with, if you get bored.You might be pleasantly surprised. Edited to add, the solution was a generic cheap hp., Walgreen's brand.
 
This cheap old poor bastid doesn't have the equipment to post pictures. That's why I try to jam all those $5 words in there instead of a picture. I wonder if I held my mother-in-law under some hydrogen peroxide long enough she would turn blue. She has a cast iron hide.
 
That sounds pretty interesting. I might stick an old scrap blade in some tonight and see what happens. I never, ever cut myself so it's not like I use that peroxide for cuts or anything. :footinmou :D ;)
 
Cool. I'll put a scap piece of hardened carbon steel in tonight and see what happens. RL
 
C@@L
I'm sticking some L6 in some of it, in about 2 min..
thanks John this will be intersting to hear the results..:)

was it pitted? John
 
Dan, yes, there was some pitting, but I don't know if that was already a condition of the blades. The small 3 bladed folder was closed and very crudded with dried fish gunk when I tossed it in the hp.
 
I'm looking forward to hearing these results. I don't have enough HP left to cover a knife because of all my cuts and scrapes. I guess I'm the clumsy one in the bunch. At least I haven't broken anything yet.

I picked up an arc welder today. Between that and the new gas forge I got a whole new set of burns though. Thanks for the ideas John.
:D
 
You are welcome, J.! I am going to hunt up some various junk and see what the stuff does to it. I'll let you folks know what flys.
 
This is very intruiging. Normal bluing solutions essentially depsoit a copper-selenium oxide using a caustic base to activate the steel. It is essentially a plating in the broadest sense.

There is nothing in the peroxide obviously, to accomplish this, no metal ions. Hydrogen peroxide has been used in the past to attain rust/brown finishes, as under the right conditions it forms what is called a "peracid" which will oxidize non-stainless steels.

I have done some searching on the net with no results. I guess I'm gonna have to try and track down an inorganic chemist and see what they say, since this is outside my experience in organic chemistry.

My initial thoughts are that this is the result of re-deposition of the guard materials as an oxide onto the blade. I strongly doubt anything "blue" would happen without the presence of the non-steel metals. Actually, it probably plated the blade and then oxidized to the nice blue color. Alot of copper compounds are bluish. The presence of the chrome, and zinc in the brass are almost certainly invloved, too.

Guess it's time to head over to Walgreen's and pick me up a bottle of peroxide...hmm...maybe I'll spill some on my head and see if it'll turn the gray back to blonde...hehehe
 
fitzo
That makes sense. I just took my BK 7, which I had already removed the finish from, and wrapped it in a bit of pure copper foil and put it into some peroxide. I got the copper foil from a art store some time ago. I will let everyone know how this works. I also put a piece of S7 into the mix. I wonder how long it will take to start to get some kind of effect if there will in fact be one. I hope this works well. I have just about finished my first knife, it is made in S7 and was hoping to do some kind of coating on it.
 
My initial thoughts are that this is the result of re-deposition of the guard materials as an oxide onto the blade. I strongly doubt anything "blue" would happen without the presence of the non-steel metals. Actually, it probably plated the blade and then oxidized to the nice blue color. Alot of copper compounds are bluish. The presence of the chrome, and zinc in the brass are almost certainly invloved, too.

That make a lot of sense. For several years now I have been leaving a piece of copper in my etching to give it a reddish hue. ( One of Bruce E's tricks)
This seems like the same thing.
 
I just hope we don't have to add fish guts to the mix to get good results! A feeble attempt at humor, guys. I beleive the knife laid in the hp for 3 weeks or so, if this helps any. And it really is a dark blue finish. The knife scales cleaned up pretty easy with the soapy Brillo pad, as did the blades.
 
Originally posted by Burchtree
That sounds pretty interesting. I might stick an old scrap blade in some tonight and see what happens. I never, ever cut myself so it's not like I use that peroxide for cuts or anything. :footinmou :D ;)
Click to expand...
:)
 
John
I'm thinking that the blood and guts may have
a lot to do with it since the blood acids will
leave a patina on High carbon steel.
just a thought, the HP may be cleaning the blade well
so the acid works on it real deep and even ??:confused:
just thinking here.. :)
 
Graymaker

I have a knife soaking now. I think that you may be correct about the acid issue. I would think that a more acidic base would help...mmmm...dissovle, I guess, some of the metal from the guard etc. I think that i may add a touch of vineger to the mix and see if that helps. I have some copper based Algaecide that I will try in my next batch. That way the copper will be in solution already. Oh sure it might blow up, but anything in the search of a better knife blade. Don't want to do so many things at once so I have some idea what worked.
 
This sounds very interesting, thanks for sharing.
What was the concentreation strength of the hydrogenperoxide?
 
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