carbon steel still popular?

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gustav

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Sep 23, 2007
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With so many type of stainless steel at reasonable prices, is there still a need for carbon steel for knives under 6 inches? I am not talking about designer stainless but normal stuff like 440 12c27 etc

I am going buy a few knifes and i am wondering whats the appeal of simple carbon steel compared to normal stainless as stated above?
 
Easier to sharpen, good edge holding, good edge stability. If I was going to reccomend a knife for someone to learn to sharpen on it would be carbon. Likewise if I was to reccomend a very high performance hard use knife it would be one of the carbon steels. There are some great stainless steels nowadays but there weren't any in use when I began knife collecting. I typically won't use a stainless steel for anything except folding knives. There are plenty who would take exception to that but it's my choice. Joe
 
The only carbon folders I own are 2 opinels , a 12 and a 9 , I like em because they are really easy to sharpen and a pleasure to use.

On the other hand a stainless blade I have , a Gerber Gator , was impossible to sharpen until I used a diamond sharpener...
 
I wish more makers would use the traditional "high carbon" steels rather than the stainless steels (which, of course, are also have high carbon content).
 
Simple high carbon steel is hard to beat. Roselli's carpenter knife is one of my favorites. the steel is W75, from Krupp. 1095 has been a great high carbon steel for decades, maybe longer. With reasonable care, high carbon will last as long as stainless.
 
I agree that carbon steel are easier to sharpen but is the extra effort in caring for the blade justifiable?

It seems like every time it rust, its taking a little bit of the knife away. where as for stainless theres more frequent need to sharpen the blade, thereby wearing the knife more compared to carbon steel which can be steeled.

Seems like commercial makers are making carbon steel as hard as the stainless range they offer. Is it still worth getting carbo steel when the stainless hardness is the same as carbon steel?

seems like most prefer carbon steel from the replies.
 
I own Stainless and tool steel knives. The tool steel easily out cuts the SS. That's not to say the SS is inferior. Just keep a light coat of oil on your carbon blades. That's low maintenance.
Lycosa
 
Would simple carbon steels be better by stainless if they are of the same hardness?
 
If you're not going to chop or pry and prefer stainless steels like 440A and 12C27, go for it. If the blades aren't too thin, even the chopping and prying are probably okay. The only problem you should encounter with 440A is that knifeknuts will say "it's okay, but not as great as..." Other than that, it cuts when sharpened.
 
Its for cutting only. I like carbon steel and find that the take an awesome edge but I am beginning to wonder if its worth the extra care if 12c27 ( is that good in retaining an edge) like what some folks say. I do not own 12c27 except for filleting knives so I cant really tell.

Is simple carbon steel indeed better than say 12c27 in edge retention?
 
If it's harder than the 12C27, it should last longer for simple cutting. If it has a lot of carbon (1075, 1080, 1095), it might last longer at the same hardness, but not so much that it really truly matter.
 
A lot of it is personal preference.

I prefer "tool steels" like A2 and D2 to ANY stainless. (although, the new S30V seems to hold an edge about as well as D2.

I've owned a dozen or more stainless knives over the years made from 400 series and AUS steels, and I wouldn't have another one as a gift. But that's just my personal preference.

I don't consider keeping a blade dry and clean to be a major problem.
 
Also remember that those carbon steel blades like 1095 take on such a nice patina.:thumbup:
 
Carbon steel can really shine with smaller blades, where very high hardness can be easily obtained, and many stainless steels can never reach, or only reach via high cost materials/treatments.

I'd love to see the likes of Spyderco or Kershaw make a run of Natives or Leeks in 1095.
 
gustav said:
I agree that carbon steel are easier to sharpen but is the extra effort in caring for the blade justifiable?

It seems like every time it rust, its taking a little bit of the knife away. where as for stainless theres more frequent need to sharpen the blade, thereby wearing the knife more compared to carbon steel which can be steeled.

Seems like commercial makers are making carbon steel as hard as the stainless range they offer. Is it still worth getting carbon steel when the stainless hardness is the same as carbon steel?

seems like most prefer carbon steel from the replies.
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When sharpening a carbon steel knife, you are not necessarily removing steel. You could and shouid be just unifiying the burr with a strop or steel. This is one reason why carbon steel is awesome.

Rust is nothing. People (other than people who are near saltwater daily) who think rust is just ICKY! are being a bit of a wuss. One could bury their carbon knife in mudd and come back in 10 years and clean it up and it will shine good as new. A blacksmith who lives behind me uses old saw blades that are way rusty for all kinds of metal objects. Alot of the metal he uses is 50 years old. Stuff hanging around a farm.

Carbon is also cheaper and should always cost less on a knife. I would rarely pay more for a carbon knife. That is why I don't buy Tops knives. RAT uses carbon and D2, they charge less for carbon. THIS IS GOOD.

That all said I love VG10 too. But it costs alot more than carbon.
 
i'm a huge fan of the swedish stainless steels. in using my stainless knives, even aus4, i have never thought "man i wish i had carbon right now." sharpening, i'll feel a difference. still, many stainless steels sharpen like a dream, like vg10 and inox. 420HC has given me mixed results, which i only mention to illustrate the dependence on manufacturing.
 
thombrogan said:
The only problem you should encounter with 440A is that knifeknuts will say "it's okay, but not as great as..." Other than that, it cuts when sharpened.
Click to expand...
Boy, does it ever! Based on my own experience, I believe that 440A is one of the most underrated stainless steels in use today. Every folder I've had where the blade is made of 440A, regardless if it's made by Cold Steel, Gerber, Walther (whoever makes that), or even, yes, even, M-Tech, sharpens to a very, very sharp edge. When it dulls, just a few swipes on a ceramic rod and I'm in business again. Although I've never tried it, I'm certain that if I were out in the middle of nowhere and needed to sharpen a 440A blade, that I could do so easily on any smooth creek or water stone that I came across.

There are some stainless blades that give me a few problems when sharpening them, but 440A is not one of them.

Regarding carbon steel, I believe manufacturing techniques such as plating could vastly increase corrosion resistance. It has in guns, why not knives? Hard chroming is especially effective because of its superior bonding characteristics and its hardness, which is around RC 60.
 
As Yogi Berra said, "deja vu all over again." We ought to link this thread with one I recently started at:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=504259

There's also a short thread on my old WW2 carbon steel bayonet at:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=500092

Lately I've been seriously wondering if these expensive new steels are really worth it, and that if chrisaloia might not be exactly right.

A2, or 1095, or 52100 vs Shun/Kershaw SG2, or Henckels M66 Cermax, or the VGxx steels ... I'd like to hear more.

Thanks,
Ray
 
Don't get me wrong. I love stainless steel. VG10 is awesome! I wish I had the money for some knives in S30v, duratec etc. But that is exactly my point. I don't have the money. I would love a SOG teamleader (duratec) but it is $160. I recently purchased an RD-4
(5160) for $99. With that $60, I can get another knife. Plus, the RD has tan canvas micarta and a 1/4" of steel. Imagine what the teamleader would cost if it was a 1/4" of duratec and micarta handles? How much better could that steel be?


I have owned knives in A2, ATS 34, AUS8, AUS6, D2, 52100, 5160, 440a, 420, 154cm, and 1095. The carbon steels are great performers. They sharpen great, they are cheap and their edges are less brittle in general. They are also easier to regrind or reprofile. Buy a cheap 100 yearold bayonet at a gun show, some 220 grit sandpaper, a good sharpening stone and you can see for your self.


But I shouldn't write like this. Carbon steel sucks. This way the demand stays low and the prices. :)
 
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