Carpenter CTS-XHP Steel AKA "Micro-Melt® 440-XH® Alloy"

Status
Not open for further replies.
Honestly, I have a hard time distinguishing my S30V Manix 2 from the CTS-XHP Manix 2. Personally, I like the way the XHP blade sharpens up a little better. We are very fortunate to have so many choices among really excellent steels...


Sal Glesser said:
Hi Gabriel,

I think that he meant that it is not a "true" stainless in that in "can" corrode, as all stainless steels.

I have been working with Rick Gkeixner at Carpenter for more than a year. We did most of the early testing for Carpenter in developing their new knife steels.

XHP tsted very well and that's why we're using it. I believe we were the first to come out with a production piece and we've got more planned for the future.

In our testing, XHP did not test as well in abrasion resistance as S30V, but it did test very well. As I mentioned, lab tests are good, but real world tests are also good.

sal
Click to expand...
 
Sal Glesser said:
Hi Gabriel,

I think that he meant that it is not a "true" stainless in that in "can" corrode, as all stainless steels.

I have been working with Rick Gkeixner at Carpenter for more than a year. We did most of the early testing for Carpenter in developing their new knife steels.

XHP tsted very well and that's why we're using it. I believe we were the first to come out with a production piece and we've got more planned for the future.

In our testing, XHP did not test as well in abrasion resistance as S30V, but it did test very well. As I mentioned, lab tests are good, but real world tests are also good.

sal
Click to expand...

Well... It's great to here another approval of this alloy by someone who really knows what they're talking about. :thumbup:
Less edge retention than S30V you say?
What about the test where it proved to cut through 425% as much manila rope as S30V before becoming extremely dull?
As always it seems there is a large margin of difference in performance with varied edge geometry and HT but I trust Spyderco on this one :)
I'm really looking forward to having a play with my Manix 2 once it arrives!
How do you think it compares to VG10??? It's been a favourite of mine for quite some time.
 
NRaiano said:
I like to believe that the tests are right but I'm personally uncertain now because so many other members here seem dubious. Even if it's not exactly #2 it has still been rated very highly by many people.
Click to expand...
Besides the fact that he can't replicate his test results, whatever he does is at best individual knife test, not the steel vs. steel comparison.
The knives he tests are wildly different in thickness, blade geometry, even the hardness/ht differs for the same alloy from different maker. Yet he uses that same test as basis for steel A is better than B.
In his own chart starting force for CTS is 0.005 and for bunch of other knives is 0.020. That is just 0.015oz difference if you just look at that, but on the other hand, that's 400%, as the start conditions of the test. The edge on one knife was at lest twice as thick compared to the other, based on his own data. And those 0.001oz differences are what he makes A is better than B statements...
How the hell can one consider that to be even a fair knife vs. knife cutting comparison test, let alone make conclusions about steel vs. steel.

There is obvious reason custom makers make identical blades from different steels to compare steel performance. Cutting a rope with 2 mm and 4mm thick knives and with edges twice as thick, will not tell you much about steel vs. steel.
 
Some very great points Gator, I guess the best way is just to get a blade and see how it performs first hand... Simple usually is better but it's fun to ponder while our blades are in the mail :D
 
Our edge retention testing is done with a CATRA,. While it is a good, consistent indicator, we've found the CATRA does have it's limitations which is why we like "real-world" testing as well.

There will always be differences of opinions in testing, but a general trend can be determined.

sal
 
Sal Glesser said:
Our edge retention testing is done with a CATRA,. While it is a good, consistent indicator, we've found the CATRA does have it's limitations which is why we like "real-world" testing as well.
Click to expand...
I absolutely agree with that. I've argued many times that machines alone are not sufficient for knife testing.
But assessing wear resistance and other properties, especially in steel vs. steel scenario CATRA or any other specialized machine will be far more precise for drawing conclusions.
Using different thickness, angles, sharpness level, etc. for steel vs. steel is nothing but misleading.
 
With CATRA you know what the variables are, and it's easier to keep "apples to apples". I have to admit that with the CATRA test S30V pulling ahead slightly is no great surprise.

Those ( evil) vanadium carbides really do their jobs well. :)
 
The only blade I have in CTS-XHP steel is the 3.5" XM-18 by Rick Hinderer.

I have put it to hard use since March. The steel holds a sharp edge but not quite as long as my old ZDP Endura. Although I can get the XHP to a finer edge with more ease/less work than ZDP.

I haven't used S30V as frequently but from my experience it is similar to XHP in performance and sharpening.
 
I also have xm-18 in XHP. In my experience CTS-XHP steel holding the edge well and is easier to sharpen than the s30v (Strider). CTS-XHP is my favorite steel as of now.
 
I don't know if it was mentioned but Cold Steel has switched to using Carpenter CTS XHP Alloy for most of their knives.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top