Cho - bloodletting notch?

redvenom

redvenom

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I seem to recall having read somewhere that the cho was for the bloodletting of the khukuri. Is there a real tradition behind this? If so, could somebody enlighten me?

Thanks
Andrew Limsk
 
The kamis themselves do not know the original the purpose of the cho - only that it is traditional, to the point that a blade is not a Khukuri without it. The "bloodletting" myth has been ascribed to many edged weapons ("Tradition forbids that we return the jambiya/sgean dhu/switchblade to the sheath without drawing blood, or our grandmothers' cornbread recipe will be dishonored") - It may well have been true, of some blade, somwhere in the past, but it probably would have been ended when infections from so many cut thumbs caused so many hands to rot off. It sounds romantic, but it comes from a time when the men who used blades were "hands-on" with horses, camels, hunting hounds and game every day, and not familiar at all with soap, antiseptics or even basic medical treatment.
 
Based on what I know about the kami culture I'm as certain as one can be about such things that the cho has a religious significance -- but what for sure nobody can say. My guess would be it is homage to one or several Gods and a reminder to them to be on the side of the user of the knife whether it be used as tool or weapon.
 
Originally posted by Walosi
The "bloodletting" myth has been ascribed to many edged weapons ("Tradition forbids that we return the jambiya/sgean dhu/switchblade to the sheath without drawing blood, or our grandmothers' cornbread recipe will be dishonored") - It may well have been true, of some blade, somwhere in the past, but it probably would have been ended when infections from so many cut thumbs caused so many hands to rot off.
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Germanic culture has a similar mythos - I think sometimes it's blood-letting; but more often just elaborate ritual (breathing on the blade, turning it over; praying (both pre- and post-Christian). I think all of these stem from a laudable notion of not drawing a blade unless it's really necessary. Force someone to spend 15 minutes chanting or cut his thumb if he draws a blade and he'll think twice about drawing - so I think these are more injunctions against waving round naked blades more than anything else. Can you not easily imagine a veteran warrior coming up with these sorts of things off the top of his head in order to try to keep a band of young warriors from accidently slicing each other up waving their swords about? ;)

Honestly, that's my belief about these 'injunctions'.

cheers, B.
 
[T]he "fridbond" or "peace-strings" of which we hear so much in the Sagas [are] laces fixed to a swordhilt whereby it could be tied into its scabbard to hinder hasty unsheathing and hot-tempered killing. Such, at least, was the idea and purpose of the fridbond; how successful it was we can judge by the countless hot-blooded (and often extremely cold-blooded) killings of which the Sagas tell.
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Oakeshott, The Archaeology of Weapons
 
[QOUTE]Force someone to spend 15 minutes chanting or cut his thumb if he draws a blade and he'll think twice about drawing - so I think these are more injunctions against waving round naked blades more than anything else. Can you not easily imagine a veteran warrior coming up with these sorts of things off the top of his head in order to try to keep a band of young warriors from accidently slicing each other up waving their swords about?

Honestly, that's my belief about these 'injunctions'.[\QUOTE]

Looks to me need a modern version of this for firearms--seems the common sense ones I was throughly indoctrinated with don't work anymore.


always treat it like it was loaded.....don't point it at anything unless you are going to shoot...

Maybe the lack of respect comes partly from reduced cost... a good sword or firearm used to cost a few years wages for many people.
 
Originally posted by firkin
Looks to me need a modern version of this for firearms--seems the common sense ones I was throughly indoctrinated with don't work anymore.

always treat it like it was loaded.....don't point it at anything unless you are going to shoot...

Maybe the lack of respect comes partly from reduced cost... a good sword or firearm used to cost a few years wages for many people.
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That sounds good to me, you'll have to come up with a story/myth for firearms - I think the 'take-home' message is that people listen to these sorts of things more than sensible precautions..

here's an example for swords:

from Kormáks Saga
'You will find this difficult to manage,' said Skeggi. 'There is a small bag with it, and this you must leave alone. The sun must not shine on the pommel; and you must not bear the sword unless you are about to do battle; and when you come to the place of battle, sit down by yourself and draw it. Pull out the blade and blow on it; and then a little snake will creep out from beneath the hilt. Turn the sword and make it easy for him to creep under the hilt.'
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The snake-bit may refer to a pattern-welded blade, perhaps condensation of breath would bring out the pattern more? In any case, needless to say, Kormak didn't follow these precautions and the sword broke.

B.
 
Ok...we can't figure out what the Cho is for. Does the blood really run down the bllod goove? I always thought it just ran:confused:
 
I still think the Cho is a fluid drip, to help keep fluids from running onto the handle. I can understand the practice taking on a religious connotation. It is easier to make the Cho a requirement of religion then to explain the mechanics. If the symbol had religious significance of itself, you would have expected the Cho to appear on other Hindu made edged tools/weapons, and that doesn't occur. The Ayda Katti has a similar blade design but it doesn't have a Cho. Instead the tang handle design has been modified to serve a similar purpose - to keep fluids from running down onto the handle.

The Cho serves a mechanical purpose. We see similar devices used in other cultures for the same purpose. For example the Spanish Notch on early spanish hunting knives, The Sumatran Sekin, and to some extent the tang extensions on the kris. It is a common theme on many guardless knife designs, which is by no means unique to khukuri knives or the Hindu culture.

n2s
 
N2S - so have you tested this? I mean if one runs water on a khukuree does is it diverted by the cho? What about the Sword of Siva?

B.
 
Ben,

Yes, I have tried it. The fluid is not diverted, but it tends to drip from the cho. Just hold the blade as you would during normal use, with the knife at the ready (point at about 45 degrees) and watch a drop run along the edge. It may not be a perfect solution but it does help.

n2s
 
Originally posted by not2sharp
Ben,

Yes, I have tried it. The fluid is not diverted, but it tends to drip from the cho. Just hold the blade as you would during normal use, with the knife at the ready (point at about 45 degrees) and watch a drop run along the edge. It may not be a perfect solution but it does help.

n2s
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I suppose it's the same principle as putting a knife or other flat bit of metal against the inner lip of a glass/jar/cup whatever if one's trying to pour something - it directs the flow a bit.

I'm sure you're right that there's originally a practical purpose behind it - is there anything on the production side which would tend towards a notch in the lower part of the blade? I was thinking maybe it was originally a way of 'dressing up' an by-product of forging the knife.

Does the Sword of Siva serve any purpose, do you think? On swords and such, 'blood-groove' are actually fullers; or is the sword of Siva a relic of a fuller perhaps?

thanks, B.
 
Cow tracks. Trident. who knows... I do like the bottle opener idea. This needs some practical application soon. :D
 
I haven't given alot of though to the Sword of Siva. It is probably not related to the fuller because it is found just as often on knives with fullers as without. It might be done to cover up something in the manufacturing process. Perhaps the area tend to develop some indentations naturally from the tools the Kami uses to hold and work the blade. It is hard to say without first studying the process closely.

n2s
 
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