Chopping/technique threads?

[C.S. Graves]

Just make sure to maintain the primary bevel every now and then or you'll find the thickening of the edge screwing you up

Yep, a little mainenance of the overall geometry now and then saves trouble in the long run.

Speaking of sharpening angles and geometry, a lot of HI khuks have such a thick profile that one can almost sharpen at the angle of the main bevel without risking much in the lines of compromised strength... like a slightly convexed "khuk-scandi".

 

[Nicholas]

Let's clarify, though: which is the "primary" bevel? Is it the big, wide one, or the teeny-weeny little one at the edge? That may have been what confused me before.....

 

[C.S. Graves]

Let's clarify, though: which is the "primary" bevel? Is it the big, wide one, or the teeny-weeny little one at the edge? That may have been what confused me before.....

In my case at leat, I meant the large bevel when I said "primary". I think the smaller one you mention would be considered the secondary bevel, or if very minute, a microbevel.

 

[Nicholas]

"Microbevel," indeed: that's an apt description.
My problem was that I only got that bevel sharpened, and needed to dig more into the primary bevel. Luckily, I've just fixed that, so we'll see how I do!

 

[killa_concept]

My shaving edge was, indeed, thinner.

Ah - thanks for straightening that one out! I'm very literal when it comes to these sort of things and I probably spent 30 minutes reading to see what could cause such a phenomenon. Might I ask what grit you tend to sharpen to? I personally go up to 1000 or 1200 then strop on a leather belt and find that to work best for me - toothy enough to sheer, yet polished enough to shave.

"Microbevel," indeed: that's an apt description.
My problem was that I only got that bevel sharpened, and needed to dig more into the primary bevel. Luckily, I've just fixed that, so we'll see how I do!

Hmm.... I found myself only needing to sharpen the secondary bevel to achieve good cutting performance. Generally speaking, you do not need to work on the primary bevel until the secondary has thickened too much (and that takes many sharpening sessions of only the secondary bevel). I was under the impression that your kuk is only a few months old

 

[Nicholas]

Hmm.... I found myself only needing to sharpen the secondary bevel to achieve good cutting performance. Generally speaking, you do not need to work on the primary bevel until the secondary has thickened too much (and that takes many sharpening sessions of only the secondary bevel). I was under the impression that your kuk is only a few months old

Try, "a couple of weeks old": I sharked it in late august. But the man I had work on it (I found a reputable sharpening shop, run by a man who's actually familiar with HI khukuris!) pointed out that the secondary bevel was pretty steep, given it's width, and the blade's original thickness. He's widened it by a millimeter or two today, so it should go a little better now. And I suspect that it'll widen over time, with more sharpening.

 

[Nicholas]

Well, the re-sharpened khuk and karda are looking promising: between the two of them (mostly the khuk), I managed to chop up about a quart of OKRA! A bit slow, and I have to use a bit of sawing motion, but smooth and clean cutting, nonetheless. I didn't get pics (I was too busy cooking), but I'm willing to bet that this is a new one for the M43!

 

[knifes101]

21 degrees would be my suggestion if you're going to do a V-edge. However, most kukri (and heavy use knives in general) users - myself included - would suggest a convex edge. With a convex edge, it's difficult to approximate the exact angle... I would say figure out what 18 degrees is on a flat surface, then use that angle on a mousepad/sandpaper setup. The bend in the mousepad should give you a nice convex edge that will hold up to a lot of chopping

Just make sure to maintain the primary bevel every now and then or you'll find the thickening of the edge screwing you up:

[/QUOTE]

Thanks, this description really helps give me an idea of what to do.

 

[killa_concept]

Thanks, this description really helps give me an idea of what to do.

Not a problem! Tell us how it goes and I'll be glad to give further suggestions if you run into any trouble

Well, the re-sharpened khuk and karda are looking promising: between the two of them (mostly the khuk), I managed to chop up about a quart of OKRA! A bit slow, and I have to use a bit of sawing motion, but smooth and clean cutting, nonetheless. I didn't get pics (I was too busy cooking), but I'm willing to bet that this is a new one for the M43!

Oh man - that's definitely new! I used to love Okra when growing up in the Philippines... I haven't had any recently. Perhaps I'll order a dish with some the next time I go out to eat.

 

[Nicholas]

I'm lucky; it's still Okra season, here in Austin, and you can pick it up at the Farmers' Market for a decent price. I also dug out a prickly pear pretty effectively with the karda.

I followed it up today with an assault on a sweet potato and a carrot, but this is much rougher cutting. it worked, but slowly, and more roughly. It appears that the blade will achieve its "edge" gradually, over the course of several sharpenings. Either that, or I need a new resource.

 

[killa_concept]

I followed it up today with an assault on a sweet potato and a carrot, but this is much rougher cutting. it worked, but slowly, and more roughly. It appears that the blade will achieve its "edge" gradually, over the course of several sharpenings. Either that, or I need a new resource.

Achieving an edge "gradually" generally shouldn't be required... one good sharpening session should give a nice edge that (if properly treated) will last and only require occasional upkeep (generally just stropping, but occasional touchup with 1000-2000grit paper).

HOWEVER - the sharpness of the edge is only one aspect of the equation... remember that a kukri is built 3/8-1/2" thick in order to hack it's way through trees, not to do kitchen work. Kitchen knives on the other hand, are built fairly thin for a reason - it lends itself to it's intended usage. While the kukri is a VERY versatile design, we can't expect it to do everything proficiently. Even after putting a literal shaving edge on my 1/2" thick AK, I'd be lying if I said that cutting a tomato gave results closer to a kitchen knife than an ax

 

[Nicholas]

Achieving an edge "gradually" generally shouldn't be required... one good sharpening session should give a nice edge that (if properly treated) will last and only require occasional upkeep (generally just stropping, but occasional touchup with 1000-2000grit paper).

So I ust found out. For after months of fretting over the fact that I don't know how to sharpen stuff, I finally had the sense to look on YouTube, and actually found videos on how to do it! It's so easy, I ma no longer intimidated, and I'm about to assemble the "Altoid Can" sharpening kit from the old Tips & Tricks thread. Using the professional edge I got as a foundation (as it was probably intended), I can now build up to a btter edge in one long, "sit-down" session, just like you suggest. But I'll probably try it on my other, smaller knives first.

HOWEVER - the sharpness of the edge is only one aspect of the equation... remember that a kukri is built 3/8-1/2" thick in order to hack it's way through trees, not to do kitchen work. Kitchen knives on the other hand, are built fairly thin for a reason - it lends itself to it's intended usage. While the kukri is a VERY versatile design, we can't expect it to do everything proficiently. Even after putting a literal shaving edge on my 1/2" thick AK, I'd be lying if I said that cutting a tomato gave results closer to a kitchen knife than an ax

Oh, I understand that it can't do everything. Kitchen work is only one of several gauges that I'm using to test the blade's edge. But it would be nice to be able to use the khuk frequently, and get more practice, instead of only being able to use it for occasional, heavy-duty tasks.

 

[killa_concept]

So I ust found out. For after months of fretting over the fact that I don't know how to sharpen stuff, I finally had the sense to look on YouTube, and actually found videos on how to do it! It's so easy, I ma no longer intimidated, and I'm about to assemble the "Altoid Can" sharpening kit from the old Tips & Tricks thread. Using the professional edge I got as a foundation (as it was probably intended), I can now build up to a btter edge in one long, "sit-down" session, just like you suggest. But I'll probably try it on my other, smaller knives first.

I was probably a bit less fearful than most of learning to sharpen my own knives - I lived in a small, rural farming village in the Philippines until I was 8 and was constantly around bolos and the the like. I learned how to put a shaving sharp edge on a knife by 12 or so, and only recently (18) got into convex edges. Proper knife sharpening is a skill that anyone who uses knives should have.

I definitely agree that you figure out what you're doing on old kitchen or pocket knives before working on your kukri. I would also suggest learning how to use simple sharpening stones to make a nice V-edge before learning to convex. Convex sharpening is easier in my opinion, but V-edges are more practical for most knives and is just something everyone should know how to do.

If it helps at all, this is what I've found works best in terms of cost effective materials.

V-edge:
220/400 grit double sided stone ($10 max at home depot or a similar stone)
1200 japanese waterstone ($22 off highland woodworking)
strop (I just use an old leather belt)

Convex:
Spongey Mousepad (shouldn't be too hard to find)
3M Assorted Grit sand paper (220, 400, 800, 1000 grits - $5max)
strop (leather belt from above)

Here are also some videos that I found to be helpful:
1) kitchen knife sharpening (v-edge)
2) convex sharpening (he's only maintaining the edge - if you want to MAKE the edge, just do the same thing but start @ 220 and work up to 1000grit)

Oh, I understand that it can't do everything. Kitchen work is only one of several gauges that I'm using to test the blade's edge. But it would be nice to be able to use the khuk frequently, and get more practice, instead of only being able to use it for occasional, heavy-duty tasks.

Ah - that makes sense. I just find too often that people expect too much of a given design and test it with methods that it was not intended for. I definitely agree that it helps to use your knife for a variety of tasks though.

 

[paua]

This is a very good thread. Thanks for all the information!
I think HI guys are a bunch of decent people who don't need to involve follies to be entertained

 

[knifes101]

And gals to!

 

[Nicholas]

I still have to assemble my sharpening kit (basically the "convex edge" kit that K_C recommended), but "Rufus" is doing much better after his second sharpening. Today, we had another round of invasive-plant clearing, and cutting and chopping times were reduced by about half. My technique still needs work, but I think it's improving. So, my $6 certianly weren't wasted.
I'm still going to go for sharper, though. The only question is, whether I want to start at 220 grit, or 400! Maybe I'll send a picture, and that'll help decide.

Speaking of which, "Rufus" badly needs cleaning.......

 

[killa_concept]

I still have to assemble my sharpening kit (basically the "convex edge" kit that K_C recommended), but "Rufus" is doing much better after his second sharpening. Today, we had another round of invasive-plant clearing, and cutting and chopping times were reduced by about half. My technique still needs work, but I think it's improving. So, my $6 certianly weren't wasted.

Sounds like a lot of fun! I know we have a similar program somewhere here in Portland - not too sure how kuk-friendly they would be though

I'm still going to go for sharper, though. The only question is, whether I want to start at 220 grit, or 400! Maybe I'll send a picture, and that'll help decide.

Definitely post up a good picture of the edge! I find that generally, you want to think of 220grit as your working grit and everything else as refining/polishing. Ask yourself whether you want to re-profile an edge or refine the one you currently have and that will tell you where to start

Speaking of which, "Rufus" badly needs cleaning.......

Haha - no joke. I find that hacking at green vegetation really leaves carbon blades quite stained if you wait too long to wash them.

 

[Nicholas]

Sounds like a lot of fun! I know we have a similar program somewhere here in Portland - not too sure how kuk-friendly they would be though

Apart from a couple of the older folks (one half joking, "don't slash anybody"), I don't think anyone even NOTICES my khuk at EcoTexas! It's just a weird-looking machete, as far as they're concerned.

Definitely post up a good picture of the edge! I find that generally, you want to think of 220grit as your working grit and everything else as refining/polishing. Ask yourself whether you want to re-profile an edge or refine the one you currently have and that will tell you where to start

It *is* a starting point, not a finishing point: I understand that now.
Pictures forthcoming, but I'm leaning toward 220.

Haha - no joke. I find that hacking at green vegetation really leaves carbon blades quite stained if you wait too long to wash them.

The real issue is, scratching on the finish (which I don't quite know how to buff out yet), rather than stains. There was some of that at the edge, but little or nothing that I couldn't handle, and the sharpening process will probably remove it.

 

[Dave Rishar]

The real issue is, scratching on the finish (which I don't quite know how to buff out yet), rather than stains. There was some of that at the edge, but little or nothing that I couldn't handle, and the sharpening process will probably remove it.

Don't worry about scratching, or even discoloration. Would you worry about scratching and discoloration on your hammer? On your screwdriver? What's the difference?

They're tools. If you use them like they were meant to be used they will look like hell in short order. Don't worry about it. Like all good tools they'll continue to work regardless of how they look.

 

[Bill Sanders]

I use MAAS polishing creme on my khuks after cleaning with a green Scotch pad and water. Some scratches don't come out, but, as they don't effect performance, and I can't just buff them out, I don't worry much about them. They become part of the working history of the blade. My main concern is rust, which the polish has kept away.

Bill