Chris Reeve Warranty for Lock Bar Replacement

[uofaengr]

I have to say I think early lock ups are a fad among the knife community. As long as it's not touching the other side, locks up solid and doesn't move over the years, so what if it's at 75 or 80%?

Can someone shed some light on when the early lockup fad started? Both of my Hinderers are no more than 10% engagement, and my buddy's is maybe 5%. He's almost scared of it, and I'm not the biggest fan. He used to sit and flick open his XM as hard as he could to try and get the lockbar to move over some. If you complain about their early lockup, you're usually ridiculed for not sharing Rick's vision of the frame lock though he was not the inventor. My XM's seem to have a lot less spring tension than my CRKs as they don't take very much pressure to disengage combined with the super early lockup.

The Spyderco frame lock or liner locks I've experienced including the Military, Sage 1 and 2, and Southard have all had perfect engagement of around 50% where the lockbar is completely engaged.

Both my Sebenzas are about 50 to 60% I'd guess with no movement since I've had them. The thing is it doesn't really bother me since I know if it ever became a problem, it'll be taken care of. If I didn't think it would be I'd never spent the money on them in the first place.

 

[Screwdriver]

My CRK Sebenza 25 is probably an 80% lockup out of the box, not thrilled with a $400 knife. But I'll use it daily and when it fails I'll send it in, if they don't make good I never buy another, lesson learned.

So where the ceramic ball makes a small divot on the blade it is at 80%? Just looking at the lockbar on mine it looks 80%, but where the knife is actually locking on the ball contact, it is at <50%

 

[Terry M.]

1. Are you aware that you are asking for help in the form of answers in a tone that appears VERY antagonistic and caustic?

2. Do you realize that you are asking a group of collectors and enthusiasts to predict the future? I am quite certain that we are no more qualified to do this than you are.

Simply put, we can only share past experiences with you...and if you search, you will find these experiences have already been shared. Those past experriences may or may not be identical to future experiences, but it all seems like a moot point since you already made your position clear in the first post If you are not happy with your purchase based on your concerns for the future, I suggest you return it.

Have a nice day, I wish you the best....seriously.

This.

 

[Ajack60]

Can someone shed some light on when the early lockup fad started?

TOO many people believing crap that is taken as gospel on u-tube. I guess some folks don't really know where lock up is supposed to fall on their knife, sooo, they hunt on the least knowledgeable place and start to believe early lock up is a good thing. Personally, I'm not a fan of early lock up, I like to see the width of the lock bar engaged on the blade. Now that gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

 

[Peter Hartwig]

I believe the early lockup fad is people believe that if it is early it will last longer. While logic may make this seem like a given, I am not that sure there is much truth. From what I have heard from most knife makers, once the lock settles in it really doesn't move much( everything wears out eventually and other factors may cause movement). I still do like a slightly earlier lockup then many Sebenza's have(40-60%), for ease of opening(fat thumb syndrome) and still having good lock contact.

 

[JNewell]

Can someone shed some light on when the early lockup fad started? Both of my Hinderers are no more than 10% engagement, and my buddy's is maybe 5%. He's almost scared of it, and I'm not the biggest fan. He used to sit and flick open his XM as hard as he could to try and get the lockbar to move over some. If you complain about their early lockup, you're usually ridiculed for not sharing Rick's vision of the frame lock though he was not the inventor. My XM's seem to have a lot less spring tension than my CRKs as they don't take very much pressure to disengage combined with the super early lockup.

The Spyderco frame lock or liner locks I've experienced including the Military, Sage 1 and 2, and Southard have all had perfect engagement of around 50% where the lockbar is completely engaged.

Both my Sebenzas are about 50 to 60% I'd guess with no movement since I've had them. The thing is it doesn't really bother me since I know if it ever became a problem, it'll be taken care of. If I didn't think it would be I'd never spent the money on them in the first place.

I had a Military that was about 5% and it would unlock without warning frequently. It scared the cr@p out of me - it went back for service. I have a small Regular that is about 10% that I am not happy about but it seems to be very reliable so it hasn't gone back. I'm much more worried about losing fingers than wearing out a knife that would be fixed under warranty anyway.

 

[MatthewSB]

Percentage of lockup is so misunderstood that people should explain exactly what they mean before throwing out the number. Like Screwdriver said regarding the '25, the actual lockup is something like 30% less than it actually looks like, you must go by the marks left on the tang and not how close the end of the lockbar is to the opposite side frame

As far as a 25 "wearing out", what exactly are people afraid is going to wear, the hardened steel tang or the ceramic ball? Look up how hard those parts are, then get back to us about how soon you think they're going to lolwearout. The divot and marks that people see are likely from the titanium flexing, slightly, and leaving a tiny trail that isn't likely to change much over time.

 

[BellaBlades]

I am not sure why this is even a concern.

What I can say with out a doubt is CRK set the bar for a frame lock and its performance.
The amount of bend that these locks have along with the geometry, and treatment IMO makes these the most reliable frame locks on the market and some of the longest lasting. The amount of contact achieved is ideal and with many other factors I can only think of a very few other frame locks out there that are close to as reliable and fool proof.
Early lock up is not the worst thing but is more more important in locks of lesser quality and design flaws.
After breaking my knife down from new and cleaning it up. She (21) is at 50%. That is really the minimum I would want. I had another last year that was 55%. I can say that because I know these locks do not wear like many other I have used. The majority of the framelocks out there have a much smaller contact area at a less than ideal contact angle with the blade and you can feel and see the titanium lock bar wearing in and wearing away.

Besides the lock, the reason I really love the 21 is the blade grind. Primarily the satin finish with the hollow grind. What a utility blade.

 

[JNewell]

When people think about wear, they need to consider how much the design and execution of a frame lock varies from one manufacturer to another. Factors like angle, finish and shape of the tang and extent of contact between the lockbar and tang (among other factors) makes a huge difference. A steeply angled, concave, rough-finished tang that has minimal engagement with an unhardened lockbar is going to wear an awful lot faster than a traditional Sebenza. :thumbup:

 

[blade man]

When people think about wear, they need to consider how much the design and execution of a frame lock varies from one manufacturer to another. Factors like angle, finish and shape of the tang and extent of contact between the lockbar and tang (among other factors) makes a huge difference. A steeply angled, concave, rough-finished tang that has minimal engagement with an unhardened lockbar is going to wear an awful lot faster than a traditional Sebenza. :thumbup:

I see what you did there.

 

[JNewell]

I see what you did there.

??? Not sure I do - must have been absolutely unintentional!

 

[bigmark408]

I like Reeves at 80-90%.

 

[brownshoe]

It won't fail...don't worry be happy!

 

[Bob45]

I have a large regular bg-42 from the mid 1990s that I carried and used hard for everyday for years. Eventually it developed vertical blade play. I sent it back, and they replaced the lock side scale no charge. It has late lock up, but is rock solid. I correspeded with Mrs. Reeve and she could not have been nicer. I wouldn't worry about the warranty or them taking care of you and your knife.

 

[Terry M.]

I have a large regular bg-42 from the mid 1990s that I carried and used hard for everyday for years. Eventually it developed vertical blade play. I sent it back, and they replaced the lock side scale no charge. It has late lock up, but is rock solid. I correspeded with Mrs. Reeve and she could not have been nicer. I wouldn't worry about the warranty or them taking care of you and your knife.

I love stories like this. Thanks for sharing!

 

[630skirmish]

CRK will most likely charge u nothing but if they do then who cares, you won't see this problem for years upon years so at that point you see probably do for a new knife.

 

[xMachiavelli]

Never had a lockbar wear out on my from my usage. Bought a brand new Insingo large the other day, lockup is considered "later". As stated before, the high end custom knife buyers might have a stroke. It's fine. It's made to be later than some.

Regarding their CS, I sent in a 25 that I bought used. Again, I did not have the knife for a day before I sent it in. The blade was swapped free or charge and the knife returned to me in 14 days. Doesn't get better than that. If that's not good enough for you, sell it.

 

[SBXT]

Can someone shed some light on when the early lockup fad started?

... I'm not a fan of early lock up, I like to see the width of the lock bar engaged on the blade. Now that gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

This.:thumbup:

 

[unit]

Can someone shed some light on when the early lockup fad started?

I cannot say for sure when it started, but it seems pretty obvious that the concept is an easy sell to anyone familiar with lesser design/execution of the lock type...which is a huge fraction of the knife buying market.

Anyone that has owned a lesser built liner lock, or frame lock has probably identified some weaknesses of the lock when poorly executed...but they make the asumption that their sample population is representative of ALL (including CRK).

This concept is REALLY typical...just think about all the times you have heard "Ford/Chevy/Dodge/whatever sucks" being proclaimed. Do you suppose these people making these types of statements are truly informed about the ENTIRE product line, and all permutations of those products over time, and therefore honestly arrived at the conclusion that the brand sucks (and of course, their favorite brand is entirely different?) If you ask these people to explain their stance, they can probably point out a single design flaw they have identified that may or may not be based in a truly FIRM grasp of the science behind it all.

I am not saying that CRK is the best, or that no other brand is capable of executing a frame lock the way (or possibly betterr than) CRK can. I am just saying that you are correct that there are a LOT of myths floating around and a lot of people that are passionatly WRONG in their belief and insistence that these myths apply to all makes.

 

[skyhorse]

Imho if the blade lock-up is solid with no blade play in any direction everything else is bravo sierra.