cold steel mini law man

[paulhilborn]

Any chance you could post some pictures of the knife with the black finish on the blade removed?

Heres a link, if you want to know the process I used (super simple) drop me an email @ paul.hilborn@rooftodeck.com

Thanks

Paul

http://m1010.photobucket.com/albumv...HxysQ8hHJYDZtc8WX/x7p+HkDn7jr51v9nuRsRhud8w==

 

[knifeshow]

I've read that statement a few times and I don't get where it comes from.

Have you actually held one in your hands? What is "junky" about the G10 used? And why is the lock "under performing"?

I sell the darn things, and yes its cheaply finished and has very poor fit and finish on ALL.

The G10 is extremely thick and rough, not hand or pocket friendly, the TRIAD lock is the most over-hyped under performing lock system I have ever seen in a lockback/mid lock knife. It takes entirely too much effort to disengage. The blade to handle ratio is extremely poor.

STR I was not referring that all G10 is junk, however the execution by CS is poor and they have chosen a cheap supplier for their G10 and it is Junk compared to that used on KAI, BM, Spyderco, Emerson, etc.

 

[STR]

Knifeshow: I sell the darn things, and yes its cheaply finished and has very poor fit and finish on ALL.

The G10 is extremely thick and rough, not hand or pocket friendly, the TRIAD lock is the most over-hyped under performing lock system I have ever seen in a lockback/mid lock knife. It takes entirely too much effort to disengage. The blade to handle ratio is extremely poor.

STR I was not referring that all G10 is junk, however the execution by CS is poor and they have chosen a cheap supplier for their G10 and it is Junk compared to that used on KAI, BM, Spyderco, Emerson, etc.

I don't agree with your stance on this knife at all and feel you are letting your own bias interfere with what is actually there. Your arguments are vague opinionated and unsubstantiated. The fit and finish is certainly every bit as good as any Emerson knife I own and that happens to be more than a few. For that matter you can't see laser cut marks on the Cold Steel parts at all like you can on the Emerson knives and as for the G10 I don't know where you get your information but I see nothing different at all between this G10 on any of my Cold Steel knives than I do with the G10 I myself buy to use on my own custom folders. Nor do I see any difference between it and what is used on those other makes you mention. Unless you have verification to the statements you make they are not fact but simply your opinion or bias for one brand over another. The videos prove the G10 they are using is certainly strong enough to impress even the most stout skeptic. They are thick and strong and you equate this with poor which in my opinion is laughable at best. How dare they do that!

Striders and many others are not particularly hand friendly either but they are great knives regardless of what anyone thinks of the company or their G10 and the over aggressive texturing.

The blade to handle ratio is supposed to be the way it is. Its the same concept as Emerson's CQC14 or Spyderco's Para Military folder with the shorter blade larger handle concept for people that prefer a shorter blade but still like a longer fuller handle to actually hold onto.

Your other statements once again claiming the lock under performs is inaccurate. The lock engagement is deep and that is why the lockbar/rocker arm travels so far. If you want less contact, less reliability in extreme use and so forth because it disengages easier there are certainly choices to offer that but this knife is designed the way it is to perform when locked open, not to make it easier to close. Again how dare they come up with a design made to stay locked up!

STR

 

[3Guardsmen]

I sell the darn things, and yes its cheaply finished and has very poor fit and finish on ALL.

On "ALL" what? Aside from the teflon blade coating, which I agree is not the best possible choice for a blade coating, please describe what about the knife has "very poor fit and finish?"

The G10 is extremely thick and rough, not hand or pocket friendly

Ever handle a Strider, a Buck Strider, a FG Blade-Tech?

....the TRIAD lock is the most over-hyped under performing lock system I have ever seen in a lockback/mid lock knife.

How many different "lock systems" exactly have you seen in a "lockback/mid lock knife?" How is the Tri-Ad "under performing" exactly?

It takes entirely too much effort to disengage.

I've handled quite a few of them and I own one, and I don't find that it takes much more effort than any other mid lock knife to disengage. Then again, I'm not lacking in strength either.

STR I was not referring that all G10 is junk, however the execution by CS is poor and they have chosen a cheap supplier for their G10 and it is Junk compared to that used on KAI, BM, Spyderco, Emerson, etc.

Oh yeah? Which supplier of G10 does Cold Steel use? Which suppliers do KAI, BM, Spyderco, and Emerson use?

 

[DemkoKnives]

I sell the darn things, and yes its cheaply finished and has very poor fit and finish on ALL.

The G10 is extremely thick and rough, not hand or pocket friendly, the TRIAD lock is the most over-hyped under performing lock system I have ever seen in a lockback/mid lock knife. It takes entirely too much effort to disengage. The blade to handle ratio is extremely poor.

STR I was not referring that all G10 is junk, however the execution by CS is poor and they have chosen a cheap supplier for their G10 and it is Junk compared to that used on KAI, BM, Spyderco, Emerson, etc.

one think is pretty much for sure, we all get our g-10 from the same supplier

 

[knifeshow]

On "ALL" what? Aside from the teflon blade coating, which I agree is not the best possible choice for a blade coating, please describe what about the knife has "very poor fit and finish?"

Ever handle a Strider, a Buck Strider, a FG Blade-Tech?

How many different "lock systems" exactly have you seen in a "lockback/mid lock knife?" How is the Tri-Ad "under performing" exactly?

I've handled quite a few of them and I own one, and I don't find that it takes much more effort than any other mid lock knife to disengage. Then again, I'm not lacking in strength either.

Oh yeah? Which supplier of G10 does Cold Steel use? Which suppliers do KAI, BM, Spyderco, and Emerson use?

gee its clickish around here.

So Far I've handled about 55-60 of these mini lawman CS knives, along with the Voyager series, SRK and some of their throwing knives.

On every one of them that I've handled has had sharp edges on the G10, was extremely stiff to open, some had decently sharp edges some not so sharp, poor stud location makes for a difficult opening.

as far as lockbacks that I've owned, Buck oh about 20 or so, Spyderco 5 or 6, a couple of customs too.

I own an SMF DGG too

in a quick cursory search I turned up no less than 21 suppliers of G10 in various quality levels and colors.

@ STR my OPINION (if it is an opinion) is based on handling many of these knives and several other CS models, and the mini lawman is one that is poorly executed compared to their other products.

We each have our own opinion and IMO that what makes these forums so interesting and informative is that there is a place for everyone to express their opinions but more importantly their experiences.

if you guys don't agree thats fine, theres room for everyone; but don't throw me under the bus for sharing my experiences and trying to contribute to an interesting conversation.

 

[3Guardsmen]

gee its clickish around here.

So Far I've handled about 55-60 of these mini lawman CS knives, along with the Voyager series, SRK and some of their throwing knives.

On every one of them that I've handled has had sharp edges on the G10, was extremely stiff to open, some had decently sharp edges some not so sharp, poor stud location makes for a difficult opening.

as far as lockbacks that I've owned, Buck oh about 20 or so, Spyderco 5 or 6, a couple of customs too.

I own an SMF DGG too

in a quick cursory search I turned up no less than 21 suppliers of G10 in various quality levels and colors.

@ STR my OPINION (if it is an opinion) is based on handling many of these knives and several other CS models, and the mini lawman is one that is poorly executed compared to their other products.

We each have our own opinion and IMO that what makes these forums so interesting and informative is that there is a place for everyone to express their opinions but more importantly their experiences.

if you guys don't agree thats fine, theres room for everyone; but don't throw me under the bus for sharing my experiences and trying to contribute to an interesting conversation.

I notice you in no way defended your claim that, "however the execution by CS is poor and they have chosen a cheap supplier for their G10," and have not provided the name of Cold Steel's G10 supplier. This attempt:

in a quick cursory search I turned up no less than 21 suppliers of G10 in various quality levels and colors.

at tweaking what you stated was weak. I knew you wouldn't be able to do it. Reason why = You're full of it!

 

[JeremiahWeaver09]

Heres a link, if you want to know the process I used (super simple) drop me an email @ paul.hilborn@rooftodeck.com

Thanks

Paul

http://m1010.photobucket.com/albumv...HxysQ8hHJYDZtc8WX/x7p+HkDn7jr51v9nuRsRhud8w==

after seeing this post, i went and removed the black coating on mine. i just scraped mine off, it was pretty easy. the knife looks way nicer now with the coating gone lol.....i think i might buy the full size lawman and do the same with it.

 

[orthogonal1]

I sell the darn things... .

Not too many I suspect.

The G10 is extremely thick and rough, not hand or pocket friendly, ...

So the issue is the thickness and roughness of the G10? I seem to recall Spyderco being admired for their thick and rough textured G10. Spyderco's G10 is nicer IMO, but the Lawman's is pretty nice as to grippiness too.

the TRIAD lock is the most over-hyped under performing lock system I have ever seen in a lockback/mid lock knife. It takes entirely too much effort to disengage.

You failed to discuss how the Tri-Ad lock "under performs". Or is it merely the apparently high effort operation that makes it so. If it is merely the "high effort", I have a Buck you'd find atrocious.

The blade to handle ratio is extremely poor.
...

Never understood this "blade to handle ratio" stuff. But, again, the same could be said for any knife with a "finger choil" or similar "safe blade" area.

 

[STR]

gee its clickish around here.

So Far I've handled about 55-60 of these mini lawman CS knives, along with the Voyager series, SRK and some of their throwing knives.

On every one of them that I've handled has had sharp edges on the G10, was extremely stiff to open, some had decently sharp edges some not so sharp, poor stud location makes for a difficult opening.

as far as lockbacks that I've owned, Buck oh about 20 or so, Spyderco 5 or 6, a couple of customs too.

I own an SMF DGG too

in a quick cursory search I turned up no less than 21 suppliers of G10 in various quality levels and colors.

@ STR my OPINION (if it is an opinion) is based on handling many of these knives and several other CS models, and the mini lawman is one that is poorly executed compared to their other products.

We each have our own opinion and IMO that what makes these forums so interesting and informative is that there is a place for everyone to express their opinions but more importantly their experiences.

if you guys don't agree thats fine, theres room for everyone; but don't throw me under the bus for sharing my experiences and trying to contribute to an interesting conversation.

State your opinion all you want. I'm not trying to stop you from sticking your foot in your mouth at all. Its not a matter of not agreeing with you and no one threw you under the bus you did that yourself.

knifeshow. On every one of them that I've handled has had sharp edges on the G10, was extremely stiff to open, some had decently sharp edges some not so sharp, poor stud location makes for a difficult opening."

I can honestly say this above statement fits many of the Emerson knives I've bought over the years at three times the price of one of these Cold Steel Lawman knives and your description above fits it just as well as it can fit other brands bought new many times with significantly higher price points. Some knives require a break in to smooth them out. Emerson is one such animal. Kai knives can spoil you for this I agree because most of their knives come spit shined and smooth as silk but believe me not all.

Some of my Emerson knives including the Horseman in my pocket bought just recently had such sharp inside edges on the liners that I had to immediately take a triangle sharpener to them to knock off the burr to make them safe enough to prevent paper cuts during use if you hit the liner just right in a tight grip. My American Lawman was stiff out of the box too just like this Horseman. Neither of them are now though! When you look at the price point of these knives by Cold Steel I feel that for the money you get a fine knife with little to complain about for your investment and that it is for the most part done with quality materials. I'm not a fan of the black blade either but thats Cold Steel. Change it if it bugs you. What makes these knives so great isn't these petty things anymore than it is for the Emersons. You can use it hard and beat the crap out of it knowing you can trust the lock on the Cold Steel knives thats what I think most folks look for!

Your claim about the G10 source has been proven to be BS. Your claims in other vague statements are still nothing less than allegations which I suspect could also be BS but I guess we're supposed to take your word for it? Based on what? That you're a dealer and have seen and handled 50 or 60 now? So I guess you open the box of every knife shipped to you? Please you must be a huge dealer to have seen that many let alone handled them to have had that many in your hands by now. Again I suspect BS!The truth of the matter is that these Lawman folders are quite simply some of the best offerings from Cold Steel in recent years even if they are not perfect for blade finish or color, texturing, smoothness and so on. Dollars for dollars apples to apples they stand up well.

If anyone wants to come in here feeding this forum membership BS about any knives knife nuts are currently buying that I've seen, worked on, used carried, or had apart for any reason wanting to say things I know to be otherwise be prepared to get down to the nitty gritty. You want to talk fit and finish? Pull out any Emerson knife and tell me looking at it honestly that for $140 its a good fit and finish. Go ahead try it! For the money you often times get G10 that does not match up to the liners evenly showing a lip that can catch your fingernail. On others the traction grooves in the G10 are not exactly lined up with that of the liners.The liners are often times shipped with burrs. Laser cut mark lines are visible with the naked eye and even burn marking can be seen on the liners inside of many models from their cheapest ones to the most expensive one they offer in that CQC45 shipped with a Les Baer custom handgun. I know because I bought one of those CQC45 knives and more than this I know because I've documented it in my blog where you can see my statements in the way of pictures for yourself. This is substantiated claims with at least something to go on that others can verify with their own knives many times. Nothing you've said pans out for any of my Lawman folders.

When you pay a lot more and don't get a lot better then you have an argument but not on a $50 plus or minus purchase. I've spent three times the money and got half the knife with fit and finish so bad you had to bevel edges before you could handle it, with dull blades, with stiff gritty opening and locks that could not be trusted to clean your finger nails let alone use hard. In the end the bus ran you down because you put yourself under it.

STR

 

[Que]

I would think that the G10 would have to be thick as for the most part it's an "all" g10 handle (no steel liners). To me that's what makes the knife novel and interesting to own (and light). Ergonomics are very subjective and I find the grip to be great.

 

[greater]

Fit and finish on the CS Lawman both large and mini that I have handled was top notch. I did give out a mini lawman to someone once and he broke off the tip but he was using the tip as a screwdriver.

The lock did not break and fit and finish was still the same after the abuse.

I have a very hard time believing this person when he says they have poor fit and finish. I have shown these to non-knife nuts who themselves own cheap knives and just at one glance they thought these lawman folders were expensive top notch knives.

They were wrong about expensive but correct about top notch quality.

You joined here last month, you have 13 posts, and the things you are saying do not add up. What gives ?

 

[paulhilborn]

I would think that the G10 would have to be thick as for the most part it's an "all" g10 handle (no steel liners). To me that's what makes the knife novel and interesting to own (and light). Ergonomics are very subjective and I find the grip to be great.

The first versions released had steel liners with jimping near the blade. That's the version I have and am looking forward to getting the "all g-10" version as well:thumbup:

Paul

 

[knifeshow]

State your opinion all you want. I'm not trying to stop you from sticking your foot in your mouth at all. Its not a matter of not agreeing with you and no one threw you under the bus you did that yourself.

knifeshow. On every one of them that I've handled has had sharp edges on the G10, was extremely stiff to open, some had decently sharp edges some not so sharp, poor stud location makes for a difficult opening."

I can honestly say this above statement fits many of the Emerson knives I've bought over the years at three times the price of one of these Cold Steel Lawman knives and your description above fits it just as well as it can fit other brands bought new many times with significantly higher price points. Some knives require a break in to smooth them out. Emerson is one such animal. Kai knives can spoil you for this I agree because most of their knives come spit shined and smooth as silk but believe me not all.

Some of my Emerson knives including the Horseman in my pocket bought just recently had such sharp inside edges on the liners that I had to immediately take a triangle sharpener to them to knock off the burr to make them safe enough to prevent paper cuts during use if you hit the liner just right in a tight grip. My American Lawman was stiff out of the box too just like this Horseman. Neither of them are now though! When you look at the price point of these knives by Cold Steel I feel that for the money you get a fine knife with little to complain about for your investment and that it is for the most part done with quality materials. I'm not a fan of the black blade either but thats Cold Steel. Change it if it bugs you. What makes these knives so great isn't these petty things anymore than it is for the Emersons. You can use it hard and beat the crap out of it knowing you can trust the lock on the Cold Steel knives thats what I think most folks look for!

Your claim about the G10 source has been proven to be BS. Your claims in other vague statements are still nothing less than allegations which I suspect could also be BS but I guess we're supposed to take your word for it? Based on what? That you're a dealer and have seen and handled 50 or 60 now? So I guess you open the box of every knife shipped to you? Please you must be a huge dealer to have seen that many let alone handled them to have had that many in your hands by now. Again I suspect BS!The truth of the matter is that these Lawman folders are quite simply some of the best offerings from Cold Steel in recent years even if they are not perfect for blade finish or color, texturing, smoothness and so on. Dollars for dollars apples to apples they stand up well.

If anyone wants to come in here feeding this forum membership BS about any knives knife nuts are currently buying that I've seen, worked on, used carried, or had apart for any reason wanting to say things I know to be otherwise be prepared to get down to the nitty gritty. You want to talk fit and finish? Pull out any Emerson knife and tell me looking at it honestly that for $140 its a good fit and finish. Go ahead try it! For the money you often times get G10 that does not match up to the liners evenly showing a lip that can catch your fingernail. On others the traction grooves in the G10 are not exactly lined up with that of the liners.The liners are often times shipped with burrs. Laser cut mark lines are visible with the naked eye and even burn marking can be seen on the liners inside of many models from their cheapest ones to the most expensive one they offer in that CQC45 shipped with a Les Baer custom handgun. I know because I bought one of those CQC45 knives and more than this I know because I've documented it in my blog where you can see my statements in the way of pictures for yourself. This is substantiated claims with at least something to go on that others can verify with their own knives many times. Nothing you've said pans out for any of my Lawman folders.

When you pay a lot more and don't get a lot better then you have an argument but not on a $50 plus or minus purchase. I've spent three times the money and got half the knife with fit and finish so bad you had to bevel edges before you could handle it, with dull blades, with stiff gritty opening and locks that could not be trusted to clean your finger nails let alone use hard. In the end the bus ran you down because you put yourself under it.

STR

I know that you have a godly presence on this board, however I find much of this post to be riddled with the same BS and accusations that you make of my posts.

I've got 4 Emerson's in my collection right now and every one of them was hair popping sharp from the box, the liner edges are clean and the G10 mates well, the jimping lines up perfect, the only down side I can find is that they're chisel ground so it takes a bit more time to sharpen as I have to do it by hand .


since when do a join date and post count have to do with anything. AFAIC many here have huge post counts and have been here for many years but they still don't see the forest for the trees- and they call themselves knife aficionados.

I never said that CS didn't make a decent knife what I said was that out of the 55-60 that I've handled this model has poor fit and finish, CHEAPER G10 than any other manufacturer using G10 and the for the money it would be wiser to buy something from KAI!

On the grounds of being a huge dealer, I do all of the cutlery inventory for a large multinational Hunting/Outdoors/Sporting good chain; so out of our 52+ locations I've had the pleasure of stocking close to 10K of this particular model in the last year alone.


You can either agree or be Wrong!!!!! B/C some seem to just want to argue over a simple statement just to argue and run the new out of town.

Your adults- or at least I assume you are so act like it for pete's sake.

 

[greater]

cheaply built, junky G10, and an over the top, under performing back lock. No thanks!

For the price they charge for those things I'd rather buy a KAI with quality products and much better performance.

I am an adult.

I just wanted to point out that the things you are saying lean more toward lies than opinion unless you got a bunch of counterfeits or factory rejects.

It is possible you are biased to the extent where your judgement has been affected or maybe your just getting a kick out of stirring the pot.

Most people who have handled these products would find your blanket statement fishy.

 

[Que]

The first versions released had steel liners with jimping near the blade. That's the version I have and am looking forward to getting the "all g-10" version as well:thumbup:

Paul

It was the all G-10 aspect of the knife that drew me to it so I can't comment on the older version with steel liners. This version is a very well made knife with excellent fit and finish. There is dead zero blade play and no flex. The all G-10 frame works, at least for now. The blade does seem rather slow and opening it with a flick seems out of the question, but this may change with more use. (EDIT: Just noticed that opening has already eased a good bit.) I've only carried this knife for a total of about a week.

I'd also add that I find the stud location to be quite acceptable. They have even added a small scallop/indent in the G-10 that I find to be very useful in accessing the stud. The stud is only on the side for right handers but it appears as if it can easily be moved to the other side for lefties. The small scallop/indent is present on both sides.

Based on the knife that is in my pocket at this moment, a G-10 framed Mini Lawman, the negatives that I have read here are about another knife entirely.

 

[longbow]

Hey beats me I owned a Lawman once and thought it was excellent. Matter of fact it was so sharp I was trimming burrs out of my dogs neck near his ears and cut his ear on the back pretty damn good. He didn't notice it and I didn't till it started bleeding which was about 2 minutes later. As for the tri ad lock I think it is damn good lock. I've owned a couple of the tri ad CS knives using it and outside of having to depress the back lock pretty far down it seemed to me to be pretty darn stout, safe, and reliable. I like most CS products at least knife wise, I don't buy into there advertising but then again I don't buy into alot of folks advertising to much. As for your outdoor store chain you stocked 10k of the mini Lawman though 50 retail outlets? That's about 200 knives of one particular model. That sure is alot of mini Lawman knives. Well keepem sharp

 

[A.P.F.]

Knifeshow, it would be appreciated if you could post some pictures of the problem areas you mentioned. Your experience has not been my experience, but I am always ready to learn.

 

[Dnalsi]

Out of curiosity, I just compared the fit and finish on a few of my folders.
2 Cold Steel Mini Lawman (I bought another for $40 delivered
Sog Flash II
Gerber 450 E-Z Out
Kershaw 1910CKT G&G Hawk
Spyderco Endura 4 ZDP 189
2 Spyderco Delica 4 VG 10
Cold Steel Black Rhino

Looking closely at each knife:
On ALL the blades, the edge grind is not even at the tip. Noticably more taper on one side. (The Gerber excluded since it has been sharpened a few times and is almost even)

On the back of ALL the handles (Kershaw excluded - different design) there is a slight edge you can hook a finger nail on.

Do any of these so called "defects" bother me? Nope.
These are all users, and I find this F&F level very "normal" for manufactured knives.

My point is this: My 2 Cold Steel Mini Lawman have exactly the same fit and finish level (IMHO as a consumer) as all of my other folders from various manufactures. I believe only the Gerber and possibly the SOG cost me less than the $40 I paid for the CS Mini Lawman.

Of all these folders, I trust the CS TRIAD lock up the most, and my Gerber lock back the least. The CS TRIAD requires a firm deep push on the lock release lever. The Gerber has an easy, very shallow lock release when compared to the others.

knifeshow,
I'm curious about the price your company normally retails these mini lawman at.
Also, if you have such a low opinion of the CS Mini lawman, why order 10,000 of them?

A quick check on eBay shows prices ranging from $40 delivered to $64.99 + 3.09 shipping.

For $40, I'm a very happy consumer
(And now tempted to buy a couple more for gifts...) :thumbup:

 

[Active Verb]

I think the blade is a hair over 2.5 inches. The lock up is solid and the Triad Lock performs well. It's relatively easy to disengage the lock (little pressure required), but hard to do it accidentally as you have to depress the lock bar deeply to unlock it. What I like about the Mini-Lawman is it's light, sharp, attractive, and easy to operate. The scales are comfortable and feel sure under wet conditions. I think it's a great value.