Conflicting Forge Threads Combined

You can try and make home-brew refractory that will work so-so, and probably not last long - or spend a few bucks and get the right materials that will last years.

Re-read the comment from Joe and me about that:
"........I fully understand trying to do things with what you have on hand but investing time and a little more money and you'd have something that will last until you retire or give it away. "


There is great truth and value in this. Saving a few dollars and throwing it away in a year or less is not nearly as smart as spending a few dollars and keeping the result forever.
 
Basically, yes.

Lets say you want to use a 7" pipe to make a forge with 1" insulation. The chamber will end up being about 4" when all is done. Take a 12X12" piece of paper or cardboard and draw a 7" circle. Draw a 4" circle inside it. This is the forge chamber. The space is the insulation and refractory. You need to have the burner enter the forge at a tangent to the inner circle. To do that, lay 12" ruler so it just touches the inner circle at 6". Draw a line from where it touches the chamber through the outer circle, extending 3" past the outer circle. This is the top of the burner mount tube. Draw a second line under that that is 1.25" below and parallel to the first line. This will be the bottom of the burner tube. This will be the 1.25 pipe tube you weld to the forge shell and the burner slips in. It will enter the forge exactly at the tangent of the chamber.

Now, you can rotate the forge drawing to any position you want and the burner will come in at whatever position you stop at. If the burner tube is vertical from below, the flame enters at 3:00. If it is horizontal from the top, it enters at 12:00. Most folks normally have placed it between 1:00 and 2:00, which slopes the burner down at a slight angle.

Technically, for maximum efficiency, entering at about 4:00 would be perfect. This may cause problems with the burner and tube conflicting with the table or stand, so an entry farther up the side is simpler. 3:00 to 1:00 is probably the best place for a simple small forge.

Once you decide the position you want the burner to sit at, draw a 2" line ( called a "chord") across the inner circle bottom ( 6:00). This is the chamber floor. When you do the refractory coating over the wool, you can put a little extra wool here and then add a good layer of satanite to make a flat floor. Many people just put in a 1" layer of bubble alumina or Casotlite #30 over the 1" wool insulation to make a robust floor.

Finally, draw in things like legs and whatever is going to be needed to make the forge work.
 
thanks stacy i am soory i got so many questions....i have just read soooooo much recently it is impossible to remember it all i am trying tho......any way sooo yeh let me say i never graduated HS so some words like tangent and the explanation went a lil over my head. especilly with just description no pics. But i took your advice and went to the web and looked up some things and i get what the tangent is and i am pritty sure i get what your saying. from putting your advice with info i looked up and some common sense i figured that you want the burner to intersect at one point of the circle and not continue to another point. you want it so if you drew a stright line the line would continue out of the circle and NOT to another point inside the circle. I think if i got this right. I am in the middle of making this now. some things could deffinitly be better but i am going to make due with what i have for now. i can always modify it later but ill deffinitly let ya know how it works and again thank you stacy you have been a HUGE help!
 
Here's a diagram showing burner angle. I build my forges with the burner at a 21° angle front to back at a tangent to the curve of the chamber. Somewhere around 15-20° should be fine, my testing shows little difference in this range but the jig I build came out to 21°.

Oh, and I'm not sure that clockwise or counterclockwise makes a difference.

Stacy and I vary on one point. He has the burner placed towards the rear blowing forward, while I have it placed toward the front blowing back. I have some shade-tree scientific reasons why I do this, while Stacy has decades of experience showing this his method works excellently. It would be foolish of me to say not to do it the way he suggests. I just wanted to explain that our methods are slightly different, yet both produce good results.

View attachment 570644
 
NICE a pic! lol very helpfull. also i didnt realise that it should be angle from the back of the forge to the front or visa versa i just thought about the angle up or down in the chamber not front to back. i can still alter that. what i am doing i am sure some would not sugest but its all i got for right now. if it works awsome. if not learning experience and do better next time. basicly i got a round cylinder that i madee hole for the burners. next i saw a video where he used plaster of paris and sand a a subsitue for the koa wool. andouthe video use plaster of paris and pearlite for the same thing. i took both ideas and mixed all 3. then covering with refractory cement. ill let every one know how it goes tomorow
 
hey guys well today i put the homemade insulation mix on the forge i figured i would let it set overnight before applying the refractory cement tomorrow. But i know i kinda cobbled this together and i do want a legit one. i don't know if i want to buy one or make it. i was looking at prices and i actuly found the cheapest on ebay they got a couple of small ones one is $170 and looks pritty good. here is the link http://www.ebay.com/itm/DFS-Gas-Pro...er-/251333082716?hash=item3a849e7e5c#shpCntId also i found the same one on there site (but its listed as $200 not 170 like ebay ????) that site is http://devil-forge.com/dfs-series/30-dfs.html Take a look let me know what ya think looks decent to me and is cheap i dont have 3,4,5... hundred dollars to spend. But if any one on the forum has got one for sale around the same price or lower i would do that you guys been very helpful i would rather give my money to one of you guys. In comparasion how much would it cost to build one? a good long lasting one the one i am making now like i said really not the best materials and using handheld torch rather than a good propane burner. I have seen many list's of parts and plans but i dont want to jump into that if it is going to cost me more than the one mentioned above. any one got a estimate on a certain design? Oh also guys i did make a knife (well almost got finish handle and need sharpening and polishin) ill post a pic when its done but i did it from a old nicholson made in usa file. i asked home depot what type of steel are the new nicholson files made from and are they solid or case hardend? they contacted the manufacturer and wrote back that it is "file steel" but it is NOT case hardened its same steel all the way through. so you guys think its good carbon steel like the old ones? i would think that as long as it is not case hardened that steel hard enough for a file it should be hard enough to hold a edge right? any way let me know what ya think thanks guys
 
What Charles has done with placement is almost potot-toe - potattoe. It really won't matter all that much.

My reasoning is that the gases travel better toward the larger exit port. I also feel that I would rather have the hottest spot toward the back instead of right at the front. I can stick a blade in and out, heating just the end or the whole blade when forging with the back the hottest area, but if the hot spot was at the front, the blade always passes through that hot spot.

Charles wants the dragon's breath going out the back. I also suspect that the size and amount or refractory liner will make a difference.

But all that really matters is that it swirls and is directed either forward of backward. The forward/back angle insures that the entire chamber gets fairly even heating of the refractory.
 
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Have you looked at the stickies? There is all kinds of info on forges. The guy that sells the Atlas even has a wip on how to make it.
 
So as you guys might know from previous post i am looking around for a mini forge to buy. I have come across a few on the web. How ever if i can buy one of some one on this forum i would i would rather give my money to someone on this forum since every one has been so helpful. If any one that see's this that has one for sale let me know (just please keep in mind i am on a budget). I keep hearing about the atlas forge and i went on the site to check it out and it says they don't have any in stock but plan to have them on the 25th. Also looking at the price it says "Price- $99,999" Now that cant be right. Does anyone know about how much they are going for now? I cant even find a contact link on the atlas site. If anyone can help with that it would be appreciated. THANKS
 
Stacy, i have never sent a PM before so like you said i click on his name and it sent me to his profile page i guess. what do i click on from that point? on the left there is a list of links " add as a friend, send email, home page, ect...." do i click send email? i dont see anything saying send private message. Its probily right in front of me and i am just being dumb.
 
Anything sold on fleabay is made with thin walls and doesn't last long. I use a majestic forge, I wanted something slightly bigger than the mini forge, but now he's working on a larger model. The majestic has the burners coming from the top which is not ideal but for the price I couldn't be happier.
So between those two, get the atlas, reviews of it don't lie. It's highly recommended and used by many knife makers.
 
That is a pretty plain setup. You could make it for less than $100 easily. It is OK for heating bars of iron for blacksmithing, but fair to poor for blade work.
An Atlas mini-forge is only $50 more and works well for knives.
 
the one above is all 1/4in thick steel there is on similar from Lithuania that does have thin wall the one above is made in usa
 
Maybe a registered user can't send a PM? Normally, you click the name and the drop down box shows. You click on the "send PM" and it will open the PM page. It may show a "send email", too.

I'll send him a PM and let him know you are trying to contact him.
 
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