- Joined
- Mar 8, 2008
- Messages
- 25,907
Bingo. I think that an in-between line based on the FSS specs would be both very popular and profitable for Council.
-
The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.
Council tool velvicut boys axe is finally here...
- Thread starter bearhunter
- Start date
- Joined
- Sep 24, 2010
- Messages
- 2,395
It's what we in business call "The Sweet Spot".
That's not what I call the sweet spot, but ok....
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2007
- Messages
- 7,440
Could it be that they fire hardened the handle? Or just stain?
TF
TF
If they sold a product for 60 bucks that they currently sell at half that price with minor
modifications, they'd actually make way more profit on the higher priced model per tool.
They probably wouldn't have to re-tool either. Of course, I'm talking about it being a sweet
spot for the manufacturer. There seem to be a lot of fans here of Boy's Axes from what I've
gathered. I'm sure they'd like something with a little better finishing than just entry level quality.
Granted, this is all just conjecture on my part and my basing those assumptions on human nature,
my years in business and on my personal experiences with upselling a model or service.
I'm just going by "uncommon" sense.
It's just a lower priced version of what they did with the Velvicut.
I believe they'd sell a lot more of the mid-grade Boy's Axes than the upper crest versions.
They might make more per ax for the Velvicuts, but they probably won't sell more than their
FSS models. In the end, it all becomes a game of numbers. Don't be surprised if they re-introduce
the FSS in some form or another based on either how well or how poorly the Velvicut series sells.
However, if they blow out all the Velvicuts at a rate that outpaced the FSS series when it existed,
then there'd be no need for them to introduce the mid-range line. Time will tell.
Last edited:
Square_peg
Gold Member
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2012
- Messages
- 13,799
I think they'll find the need for a mid-priced model.
Bigfattyt
Gold Member
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2007
- Messages
- 19,215
I am surprised there have not been more reviews/feed back on these Velicut axes.
I have long said I needed to get a felling axe, and a smaller camp hatchet. If these in 5160 are well done, it might be my first axe purchase.
(I grew up heating my home with wood that we harvested, and split). Of course, we had chainsaws, and mauls, wedges, as well as double bit felling axes etc. But I have never cut a tree down with an axe.
I have long said I needed to get a felling axe, and a smaller camp hatchet. If these in 5160 are well done, it might be my first axe purchase.
(I grew up heating my home with wood that we harvested, and split). Of course, we had chainsaws, and mauls, wedges, as well as double bit felling axes etc. But I have never cut a tree down with an axe.
While I would love to see a mid priced line. I do wonder how many would sell- the reasoning is thus:
Average Joe- Does not know alot about axes and pickes one up for occassional use for something that does not bite his wallet.
Next line is nuts like us..... we want something better and are will ing to spend a bit more...BUT since we like to have 3 or 6 of EVERYTHING- we do not bite on the Velvicut. Instead we hit flea markets, yardsales and auction sites for vintage boys axes. Even on the auction site where you pay a fair premium... you can still get a nice one for well under 60.00.
Third line is the guy that is going to buy just ONE and is willing to pay what it takes to get a really nice one.... Eneter GB, Velvicut and Wetterlings. With Wetterlings and GB getting all the press, they lead the pack for premium axes.
Don't get me wrong, I would like to see something more like Stihl and Husqvarnas lineup of saws...Homeowner, Landowner and Professional - done in axes. I just question whether it would be marketable. Already with saws, you get guys that bought homeowner Husky at a box store, it was not tuned and he does not know how, he runs it lean on factory setting and kills it, then swears off the brand forever.
I do have and love my GB, but I have only one. Compared to numerous prevuiously loved or abused vintage axes.
Bill
Average Joe- Does not know alot about axes and pickes one up for occassional use for something that does not bite his wallet.
Next line is nuts like us..... we want something better and are will ing to spend a bit more...BUT since we like to have 3 or 6 of EVERYTHING- we do not bite on the Velvicut. Instead we hit flea markets, yardsales and auction sites for vintage boys axes. Even on the auction site where you pay a fair premium... you can still get a nice one for well under 60.00.
Third line is the guy that is going to buy just ONE and is willing to pay what it takes to get a really nice one.... Eneter GB, Velvicut and Wetterlings. With Wetterlings and GB getting all the press, they lead the pack for premium axes.
Don't get me wrong, I would like to see something more like Stihl and Husqvarnas lineup of saws...Homeowner, Landowner and Professional - done in axes. I just question whether it would be marketable. Already with saws, you get guys that bought homeowner Husky at a box store, it was not tuned and he does not know how, he runs it lean on factory setting and kills it, then swears off the brand forever.
I do have and love my GB, but I have only one. Compared to numerous prevuiously loved or abused vintage axes.
Bill
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2008
- Messages
- 25,907
Then there are the guys who want a GOOD axe, but don't care about window-dressing features. They don't want the bottom grade stuff because they know it's rubbish. The high end stuff is over the top and spends money on features that they don't care about. They'll use it hard enough that they don't want to beat up an antique or go through the bother of hunting down a "user-grade but not mangled" vintage axe and bringing it back to life. That's where the forestry service ones came in. Not at all fancy or prestigious, but solid performers at a good price.
I do agree with you to a degree and understand that you have more marketing experience than anyone on this forum in running a small business. I guess I am just voicing from a consumer point of view as someone who is actively spending money on axes. There are 40 in my basement(many just heads) that were not here a year ago.
I had Wetterlings, GB and Husqvarna all at one point, representing two distinct levels of quality and price for similar design tools(maybe a third fuzzy grade in the Wetterlings). I decided that if I was going to spend 60 for a husky of moderate quality, I might as well spend 100 for a GB for the best OR spend 30.00 for a vintage needed some TLC. That is my split now. A 'tweener' lost its appeal to me as I could have 2 vintage axes of good quality for the same price or a top level for a bit more.
I was finishing up an old Warren Forest King hatchet and hanging a Plumb US 1942 yesterday and thinking over the reason they appeal to me over current production tools. For less than 30.00 each I have a tool of quality design and steel and I have kept something alive and fit for duty that is much older than me. Neither a junk store made in China tool nor a top level brand new tool give me that satisfaction.
On a another topic I just acquired a really nice old scythe in excellent condition and need to get pics on the appropriate thread. The paper label mentioned "Back Saver" as a tease
Bill
I had Wetterlings, GB and Husqvarna all at one point, representing two distinct levels of quality and price for similar design tools(maybe a third fuzzy grade in the Wetterlings). I decided that if I was going to spend 60 for a husky of moderate quality, I might as well spend 100 for a GB for the best OR spend 30.00 for a vintage needed some TLC. That is my split now. A 'tweener' lost its appeal to me as I could have 2 vintage axes of good quality for the same price or a top level for a bit more.
I was finishing up an old Warren Forest King hatchet and hanging a Plumb US 1942 yesterday and thinking over the reason they appeal to me over current production tools. For less than 30.00 each I have a tool of quality design and steel and I have kept something alive and fit for duty that is much older than me. Neither a junk store made in China tool nor a top level brand new tool give me that satisfaction.
On a another topic
I just acquired a really nice old scythe in excellent condition and need to get pics on the appropriate thread. The paper label mentioned "Back Saver" as a tease Bill
- Joined
- May 3, 2013
- Messages
- 83
oh my god-- 4.5lb connecticut. I would buy one so goddamned damned fast....
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2008
- Messages
- 25,907
We're talking somewhere in the same ballpark as present-production Snow & Nealley up through Husqvarnas in terms of price vs. performance. A step up, but nothing outrageous. One must remember that most of us are connoisseurs, and actually represent a fairly niche market (although we do a lot of buying) and that there are many "laypersons" (I use the term loosely--some can swing an axe better than most of us can. They're just not "edged tool geeks" like us!) that have use or even need of a decent axe, don't want to spend a lot, but look at the hardware store crap and just can't bring themselves to throw money away on that kind of garbage. So they want something a little better without breaking the bank. Folks sort of like the...forestry service!
When you have to outfit large crews with tools, you have the absolutely paramount need of both quality and low cost. The push/pull interaction of those two criteria tends to breed efficiency of design, both for use and for production.On a another topic
Bill
Made by Sta-Tite of Shelbyville Indiana, then. Loop bolt or ring-and-set-screw? I'm working on restoring a No.50-I.B.S. (the Back Saver loop bolt model) right now, actually. Should have my new rivets landing on Thursday for putting the hardware back on now that it's clean and clear-coated.
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2008
- Messages
- 25,907
Sweet, man. Post up pics to the thread when you get a chance! I rather like the No. 50's. Not a big fan of the ring/set screw variety of the IBS though. The ring they used plus the weight of the wedged plate makes for too much weight on the end of the snath. Very strong for tough bush work, but no good for general mowing.
To stay on topic, the price of the Velvicuts isn't really too far out of line with historical standard for the level of quality. Back in 1931 a Kelly Perfect 3.5# single bit HEAD (no handle) cost around the $60 mark, and that was with the strong market competition of the time.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2008
- Messages
- 25,907
I agree on the Velvicuts- comparable to my GB Scandinavian.
I really need to give the standard CT Boys axe a try. Aside from a few bad handles gettign out, feedback is very good. I am just so caught up now in the romance of a vintage tool
Bill
Don't forget those accursed aluminum wedges!
Square_peg
Gold Member
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2012
- Messages
- 13,799
Council needs to bring back the affordably priced Forest Service Spec boy's axe. That axe was a winner. Instead they went for the high-priced model. But who knows, maybe the boy's Velvicuts are selling like hot cakes. But if they're not, Council should re-think things.
"To stay on topic, the price of the Velvicuts isn't really too far out of line with historical standard for the level of quality. Back in 1937 a Kelly Perfect 3.5# single bit HEAD (no handle) cost around the $60 mark, and that was with the strong market competition of the time. "
You do mean adjusted for inflation....I hope??
You do mean adjusted for inflation....I hope??