Coyotes in the news

Originally posted by Blue Sky

...have you ever knowingly run into the latter group?
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I've stood near (20-30 feet) a group of coyotes digging up and gobbling California voles in the snow, and I've been close to individuals going after bigger game (foxes, hare, etc.), but I've never been near a pack while it was actively on the hunt for big game.
 
My understanding is that coyotes have learned to pack hunt in areas where wolves used to live, but have been forced out for whatever reason. When that happens, there's a an empty niche for a smart, pack hunting predator, and coytoes fill it. Coyotes are capable of that behavior, but they can't outcompete wolves. If wolves are around, then the coyotes stick to solitary scavenging.
 
Evolute said:
I can't speak about the dangers to small pets, but I think some of you might be overestimating the likelihood and personal danger of coyote attacks. As a wildlife photographer, I've done the opposite of this advice, many times:



I've jogged behind coyotes, following them until they were in a good spot for photos. I've crawled on my hands and knees within 15-20 feet of a pack, to photograph them. I've stood in front of one from ~12 feet away, for five or more minutes, photographing portraits. (By the way, I would never try to feed one, of course.)

I'm not saying that they are friendly and harmless (and I'm armed, of course), but what I've done was safe enough for me and for the animals, and I will continue to do so.
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Kind of reminds me of what that grizzly dude in Alaska used to say before the bears finally got tired of him. Never say never with wild animals. Always be ready for a worst-case scenario.
 
lambertiana,

Your comparison of me to Timothy Treadwell is insulting, non applicable, and uncalled for. [Edited so as not to speak ill of the dead, for the sake of his bereaved]

Believing grizzlies are harmless and good natured, and walking up to pet them, is in a totally different category than cautiously (and armed) approaching predators one-fifth (or less) my size, while being careful to give them enough space for their comfort zone.

You are speaking rudely in ignorance of me, Treadwell, and coyotes, with your off base comparison.
 
The story didn't mention whether the dog owner was armed or not, so I'm presuming not. And certainly there may be some additional detail left out of the story line......
Everybody has their own approach to trekking off the beaten path, but for the life of me I cannot understand the mentality of people putting themselves in such situations without thought of defensive tools and tactics. If you're sharing an environment with critters that could potentially eat you or your "pets", why the hell would you not arm yourself appropriately? Not to say the outcome would have been any less harrowing, but certainly it could have been far worse. AFAIC, it's like skydiving without a parachute.
 
I live in central Texas and have a pack, of coyotes living in a field behind my house. I have seen them and at times the howling comes from several directions, but the den is near a gravel pit. I have lost a small dog and maybe a couple of cats due to them. I have also had one attack a dog I was walking on a leash but I think he was sick? I kicked him in the head and he ran off. Anyway they do indeed pack up and yes they will attack near humans and if they have had enough exposure to humans they are just like anything else they lose the fear of man. Don't fool yourself the teeth of a medium size dog ain't that much smaller then the teeth of a big dog.
 
runningboar said:
Barrabas,
No flames from me I love to coyote hunt, it's just that there seems to be a bunch of media induced hype concerning coyotes that isn't based in fact. I think a lot of it has to do with coyotes moving into areas that they have not lived before. They WILL kill pets especially cats and beagle size dogs and smaller and farm animals, but other than that they are pretty much harmless. Their numbers need to be controlled and I don't know of any farmers or ranchers that don't shoot on sight, which is understandable, but compared to whitetail deer coyotes cause almost no damage, but for some reason deer are considered to be good animals. I guess if something tastes good then it is a good animal. Chris
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umm cause Deer Dont kill peoples Dogs :confused:

I agree that Deer need to be controlled probably more than any other animal (we call them New Jersey Road Rats). :D

But I can see where a deer in your backyard or along a trailside on your morning jog would be less intimidating than a Pointy toothed meat eating predator. (I would be more frightened of an unleashed unknown dog)

PS: I saw that Program on Cyotes too (I thought it was in yellowstone but i was probably wrong) they were a pack with an alpha male and all. It was more the story of one male who was exhiled and started his own pack.
 
Texas_T said:
I live in central Texas and have a pack, of coyotes living in a field behind my house. I have seen them and at times the howling comes from several directions, but the den is near a gravel pit. I have lost a small dog and maybe a couple of cats due to them. I have also had one attack a dog I was walking on a leash but I think he was sick? I kicked him in the head and he ran off. Anyway they do indeed pack up and yes they will attack near humans and if they have had enough exposure to humans they are just like anything else they lose the fear of man. Don't fool yourself the teeth of a medium size dog ain't that much smaller then the teeth of a big dog.
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Do you want me to exterminate them? I work for free. :)
 
The coyotes I've had experience with are incredibly smart critters. I used to hope to kill one with a bow while deer hunting. I got off a shot once and missed.

Killing a coyote with a bow while you are not in a tree stand is no easy task. Makes deer hunting seem like shooting fish in a barrel.
 
I lived in western Colorado in the 70s and can attest that coyotes DO pack and especially in winter. I vividly recall being on a bench on a mountainside while late fall hunting and watching a pack of ten pursuing a deer on the flats a good thousand feet below. There was deep snow and the mule deer buck was struggling through it. The coyotes, just like wolves (and coyotes have been termed "prairie wolves"), were taking turns at the front of the pack to breakdown the snow behind the fleeing deer. They caught it too. Quite an experience and one I'm glad I had the opportunity to see.
 
Well I just saw one in my parents backyard 2 nights ago. My dog should be ok with cyotes, but i worry about my cat getting out of the house.
 
I have had plenty of experience and runins with Coyote's and these are just some of the things I have noted about them.

They are next to harmless to adult human beings unless they are rabid.
They can and will snatch small pets.
In the west they live in packs identical to wolves. In fact I lived near several packs and at night you could hear them yack. Almost Hyenaish, no laughing but very high pitched. They would cruise the neighboorhood at night looking for dead animals or small pets left out like cats or little dogs. They usually never tangled with large dogs, unless pack strength was high. I had a pack lure my female 60 lb dog out into a quary in the middle of the night when I walked her and they jumped her. 2 hours later she had one big tear in her rear leg and over a hundred punture wounds in both legs near the butt. They were trying to ham string her with no luck. I took her to the vet and was told to go look for the coyotes as she had plenty of coyote fur in her mouth and the vet wanted to check for rabies. I went back and saw where She had killed 5, the others must have run off. I got one and took it back to the vet. I guess when they pounced on her they thought they would win and she got the better of them. The pack was not huge, but about 10 strong.

Anyway, I have seen them all over the southwest and they are a pain.

The east coast Coyotes do not seem to pack. They seem to be loners and are larger. They almost look like the old Red Wolf and about the same size.

They are a very efficient predator.
 
Back home in the U.P. the coyotes would pack up. It seemed to be at certain times of the year though. Never had a problem with them coming into town or messing with the dog. Here in N.E. Minnesota you see plenty of singles in the woods or even on the roads, but occasionaly you can spot a pack. Our problem here is the wolves. Too many dogs being eaten. I know farmers that lose calves every year to them. They have followed hunters in the woods, quite closely too! They have no fear of man. There are a lot of folks around here that figure it's only a matter of time. A friends brother was kept up in his tree stand last deer season by a pack. They wouldn't let him come down and after about an hour wandered off. He climbed down, got on his atv and drove to the shack. He didn't shoot, because it was after dark and the shot would have pulled in a C.O. for sure. The C.O.'s lurk his area because of the constant shooting after dark by less than scrupulous hunters. If you kill a wolf around here you better have a pretty good reason. They're pretty sacred to some people!
 
Evolute - I think you are making my statement something that it isn't. But I do believe you should realize that wild animals are just that, wild, and therefore unpredictable. Hence my admonition to always be prepared for the worst (which you apparently do, if you are armed). Although coyotes are much smaller than Alaskan brown bears, and most likely a much smaller threat, you are still dealing with animals capable of pack mentality; pack mentality allows canines to take down much larger animals than humans. Not to mention the possibility of coming up close to one that is injured or ill or even rabid, when all bets are off. Just keep you gun handy and keep your eyes open is all I am saying. No need to be overly sensitive and find an issue where one does not exist.
 
lambertiana,

Of course I realize that wild animals are wild, and therefore unpredictable. However the risk is small enough. I act carefully and live reasonably safely, but I am not looking to live in a bubble and avoid every possible remote risk in the world, at all costs.
 
Andrew Colglazier said:
I watched a program a couple of years ago on one of the nature channels that documented a year or so in the lives of a "pack" of coyotes in one of the northern states, I want to say Wyoming or Montana.

I found it fascinating because I also, growing up in KS raising sheep and hogs, had never seen or heard of coyotes moving around in more than mating pairs or a bitch with pups.

This documentary presented a true "pack" of coyotes that seemed to be very similar to a wolf pack with similar hiearchy, etc. I don't remember exactly how many were in the group, but a half dozen or so.

The bilogists studying the pack theorized that they were in such groups because of the size of the animals in the region (elk, mule deer, moose) which they didn't actively hunt but rather were able to scavange, and the more plentiful meat supported larger groups.

That's all I can remember right now! It does seem to be rare behavior.

Andy
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I think this documentary was done on the coyotes in Yellow Stone National Park shortly before they reintroduced the wolves there. It was documented that the coyotes were hunting in packs. After the wolves were intorduced they stopped this behavior. I believe there was a book published as well.

BB
 
no sir I save that for myself but I'm am looking for a place to hog hunt and maybe someone to show me the ropes if ur near austin
 
I lived in Oklahoma for the first 40 years of my life. We had a farm and ranch which was populated by numerous coyotes. I had 20 or so ewes as a youth and they were constantly victimized by coyotes. I grew up hunting them and have called and killed more than my share. During the 70's, pelts were bringing in the $60 to $70 range and this was all the excuse I needed to kill as many of these pests as possible.
My experience has been that they mostly hunt singularly or in pairs. This is the way you will see them the most. However, I have seen on several occasions, packs up to 8 or 10, especially at night. On one occasion, I shot and killed 3 out of a pack at one time.
Just as Runnigboar said earlier, I would certainly not place them very high on the species to be afraid of list. I can't imagine a human being attacked or hurt by one unless it was cornered or injured. I guess anything is possible though.
As far as eastern or western coyotes though, I can't make myself believe there is much of a difference. As a general rule,they are all scavengers and only attack smaller or weak animals that cannot defend themselves.
 
Texas_T said:
no sir I save that for myself but I'm am looking for a place to hog hunt and maybe someone to show me the ropes if ur near austin
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I hog hunt at least every 3 months but havent lately. Austin is only about 60 miles away. What do you want to hunt them with?
 
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